Who is Barack Obama?

[jetstream1 18]

We checked this out on " Urban Legends Reference Pages".

>

> Who is Barack Obama?

>

> Probable U. S. presidential candidate, Barack Hussein Obama was born

> in Honolulu , Hawaii , to Barack Hussein Obama, Sr., a black MUSLIM

> from Nyangoma-Kogel , Kenya and Ann Dunham, a white ATHEIST from

> Wichita , Kansas .

> Obama's parents met at the University of Hawaii . When Obama was two

> years old, his parents divorced. Hi s father returned to Kenya . His

> mother then married Lolo Soetoro, a RADICAL Muslim from Indonesia.?

> When Obama was 6 years old, the family relocate to Indonesia . Obama

> attended a MUSLIM school in Jakarta . He also spent two years in a

> Catholic school.

>

> Obama takes great care to conceal the fact that he is a Muslim. He is

> quick to point out that, "He was once a Muslim, but that he also

> attended Catholic school."

>

> Obama's political handlers are attempting to make it appear that

> that he is not a radical.

>

> Obama's introduction to Islam came via his father, and that this

> influence was temporary at best. In reality, the senior Obama returned

> to Kenya soon after the divorce, and never again had any direct

> influence over his son's education.

>

> Lolo Soetoro, the second husband of Obama's mother, Ann Dunham,

> introduced his stepson to Islam. Obama was

> enrolled in a Wahabi school

> in Jakarta .

>

> Wahabism is the RADICAL teaching that is followed by the Muslim

> terrorists who are now waging Jihad against the western world. Since

> it is politically expedient to be a CH RISTIAN when seeking major

> public office in the United States , Barack Hussein Obama has joined

> the United Church of Christ in an attempt to downplay his Muslim

> background. ALSO, keep in mind that when he was sworn into office he

> DID NOT use the Holy Bible, but instead the Koran.

>

> Barack Hussein Obama will NOT recite the Pledge of Allegiance nor

> will he show any reverence for our flag. While others place their hands

> over their hearts, Obama turns his back to the flag and slouches.

>

> Let us all remain alert concerning Obama's expected presidential

> candidacy.

>

> The Muslims have said they plan on destroying the US from the inside

> out, what better way to start than at the highest level - through the

> President of the United States , one of their own!!!!

>

> Please forward to everyone you know Would you want this man leading

> our country?...... NOT ME!!!

>

> Probable U. S. presidential candidate, Barack Hussein Obama was born

> in Honolulu , Hawaii , to Barack Hussein Obama, Sr., a black MUSLIM

> from Nyangoma-Kogel , Kenya and Ann Dunham, a white ATHEIST from

> Wichita , Kansas .

> Obama's parents met at the University of Hawaii . When Obama was two

> years old, his parents divorced. Hi s father returned to Kenya . His

> mother then married Lolo Soetoro, a RADICAL Muslim from Indonesia.?

> When Obama was 6 years old, the family relocate to Indonesia . Obama

> attended a MUSLIM school in Jakarta . He also spent two years in a

> Catholic school.

>

> Obama takes great care to conceal the fact that he is a Muslim. He is

> quick to point out that, "He was once a Muslim, but that he also

> attended Catholic school."

>

> Obama's political handlers are attempting to make it appear that

> that he is not a radical.

>

> Obama's introduction to Islam came via his father, and that this

> influence was temporary at best. In reality, the senior Obama returned

> to Kenya soon after the divorce, and never again had any direct

> influence over his son's education.

>

> Lolo Soetoro, the second husband of Obama's mother, Ann Dunham,

> introduced his stepson to Islam. Obama was

> enrolled in a Wahabi school

> in Jakarta .

>

> Wahabism is the RADICAL teaching that is followed by the Muslim

> terrorists who are now waging Jihad against the western world. Since

> it is politically expedient to be a CH RISTIAN when seeking major

> public office in the United States , Barack Hussein Obama has joined

> the United Church of Christ in an attempt to downplay his Muslim

> background. ALSO, keep in mind that when he was sworn into office he

> DID NOT use the Holy Bible, but instead the Koran.

>

> Barack Hussein Obama will NOT recite the Pledge of Allegiance nor

> will he show any reverence for our flag. While others place their hands

> over their hearts, Obama turns his back to the flag and slouches.

>

> Let us all remain alert concerning Obama's expected presidential

> candidacy.

>

> The Muslims have said they plan on destroying the US from the inside

> out, what better way to start than at the highest level - through the

>president of the United States , one of their own!!!!

Would you want this man leading

our country?...... NOT ME!!!

[Adrian 155]

John, your passport is in the mail.

You have been nominated, "mate"

[Doug Dahlke 114]

Okay I guess I can't let this one go. These are just my opinions don't take offense. Chastise if you want to.

Separation of church and state is a myth. Read the constitution. Nowhere is separation of church and state mentioned. There is a clause that says the state may establish no religion. That means government can't come in and say the Church of XYZ is the official church of the state and you must belong to it, pay taxes to it, etc. The founders did not want religion out of politics they wanted politics out of religion.

I would love to vote for a true conservative who is also a strong Christian and really lived by what he professed as his faith. I disagree that most evangelicals want to shove our religion down people's throats. In my opinion what has been happening in this country for quite awhile now is the exact opposite.

I believe this is a free country. What two or more consenting adults do behind closed doors is none of my business. I may disagree with it but I defend your right to do it. Just don't try and tell me that marriage should not be between one man and one woman. If we allow men to marry each other or women to marry how can you possibly say that its not okay for two men and one woman to be married? Maybe three women and one guy. Where does it end?

Hate crime laws are rediculous. If someone is murdered the motive behind the crime is allowed to be considered at the time of sentencing. If you rob, assault, destroy property, whatever there are already laws to deal with that. Don't start telling me I can't say Merry Christmas to someone because it could be construed as hate speech. Don't tell me the Bible needs to be removed from a library because it contains hate speech. 1984 is here.

I am tired of people being offended. If I wear a cross or a shirt with a religous symbol and you are not of the same faith don't tell me I can't wear my cross because you are offended. Wear whatever religious symbols of your faith you want to. It won't offend me. Its your right.

Most evangelicals I think will defend peoples rights to live as they choose as long as that doesn't interfere with our freedom. That is what this country was meant to be. Sadly we have strayed far from the path.

[tinsley 14]

Amen Doug

Everyone says that Christians shove everything down peoples throats but if thats true then why do us Christian have to deal with everything that the publics puts in our face. Like the TV shows that come on, Vidio games ect. Now Im not saying that it is all bad and yes I can and do change the station and I have to monator what my children play on the PS2. But the worldly thing are put in our face every day. If it hurts when someone says that you are wrong according to the Bible and God maybe you should find an alter somewhere and repent before it is too late.

[Jeff 232]

Guys I am a Christian, Catholic, maybe not the best one in the world, but I pray to God, not for me but for everyone around me. I believe in a lot of the same things you do. not all, maybe not as strong as you think about some things , but I am not a bible hating fool or anything like that. Its just when we lean on the bible to run the country I ask why? This country isn't all Christians, it isn't all republicans and it isn't all democrats. when I think of far right Christian Conservatives I ask why one group should dictate to another, not just right, but any group. The Christian Conservatives put Bush in office, thats who and what they wanted, well I think Bush is one of the most ungodly person I have ever seen. I think he cares about the rich and who can help him. He pushes programs and says how great they are then he doesn't fund them, signs laws and then goes back out of public view and does Signing Statement saying her doesn't have to follow the law. I don't think he tries to speak for all of us and I dont think any one religion should have more say in the government than another, thats why I think religion shouldn't play a major factor in governmental decisions

The Christan Conservatives elected him in 2000 and then reelected him in 2004. I dont think Bush is a good Christian but if thats who Christians wanted why would we now in 2008 elect another candidate supported strongly by Christian Conservative.

I hate how some things are in this country, I have a 1 & a 4 year old, believe me i am worried about the moral fabric of this country, I hate TV programing I wish we could go back to 3 stations like when I was a kid. I don't like how kids will kill kids over a pair of sneakers, I dont like a lot and I fear for my children as they grow, its the parents fault in many cases. Instead of pushing one view lets work on what we have in common, we as Americans are never going to agree, Hey I cant stand alot of things the far left pushes

But you know Bush has hurt the Christan Conservative cause quite a bit, many even many right wingers dont trust or like him anymore, its just like why should we trust another right wing candidate

We'll never all agree, but we better start finding common ground, because nothing good is coming out of Washington and thats all we got to run this country.

[tinsley 14]

I also think that Bush put on a good show as a Christian, sadly I did vote for him. This conversation turned into a Bible battle when I stated that we need someone that has faith in God. My belief in that will not change. Im not a great person of knowledge when it comes to politics but I do know that this country was founded With God in mind. Look at most of the laws of the country and they come from the laws of God.

As for as politcal veiws I want a MAN that will get or soldiers back home and cut the debit this country has and focus more on the need of the American people than trying to be politcaly correct with the rest of the world. We are blessed from God to be the most powerful country in the world so lets take care of us first.

Let the new President know who is in control, God is still alive and still has the power in every Saved persons life. I can prove that with thing that have happened in my life.

And you are right Jeff we will never all agree but that is what make this country great.

Praise God for he is worthy

[Beth n Rod 1,279]

Thank you Gordon for pointing out the deviation from the topic.

Rod!~

[Chappy 138]

I also think that Bush put on a good show as a Christian, sadly I did vote for him. This conversation turned into a Bible battle when I stated that we need someone that has faith in God. My belief in that will not change. Im not a great person of knowledge when it comes to politics but I do know that this country was founded With God in mind. Look at most of the laws of the country and they come from the laws of God.

As for as politcal veiws I want a MAN that will get or soldiers back home and cut the debit this country has and focus more on the need of the American people than trying to be politcaly correct with the rest of the world. We are blessed from God to be the most powerful country in the world so lets take care of us first.

You sexist pig you.

One thing you cant say about GW is that he is trying to be politically correct with the rest of the world. what I hear over and over again, is that the rest of the world hates us. GW TREATS the US as the most powerful country in the world and THAT is why they hate us. The rest of the world is a bunch of cowering sissies that wont back up their words with force because their affraid of what the rest of the world will say about them.

(I love going off topic.)

[Beth n Rod 1,279]

I agree...we used to have lots more allies than we do now. That....is sad.

Beth

[tattwd 14]

Heres my opinion,

presidency is a four year term, four years ago in my life I was broke, drinking heavily, and going no where. Then a woman came into my life, actually one I cared about. In four years she took me from 20k a year income into a 80k+ bought a house, had a child, expanded business and what ever else she tells me, lol. All just by staying on my ass and keeping me in line. Im willing to give a woman a try here too.

[Jeff 232]

I also think that Bush put on a good show as a Christian, sadly I did vote for him. This conversation turned into a Bible battle when I stated that we need someone that has faith in God. My belief in that will not change. Im not a great person of knowledge when it comes to politics but I do know that this country was founded With God in mind. Look at most of the laws of the country and they come from the laws of God.

As for as politcal veiws I want a MAN that will get or soldiers back home and cut the debit this country has and focus more on the need of the American people than trying to be politcaly correct with the rest of the world. We are blessed from God to be the most powerful country in the world so lets take care of us first.

Let the new President know who is in control, God is still alive and still has the power in every Saved persons life. I can prove that with thing that have happened in my life.

And you are right Jeff we will never all agree but that is what make this country great.

Praise God for he is worthy

Gordon, its not a battle at all, I am just putting my take on things out there so you or others can see what the other side thinks., not what some news channel tells us about the left or right or a candidate or our religeon. I also read and take in what you are saying.

I'm not a saved person, but I sure feel like one because God has saved my life and kept me alive in some very difficult times.

[Jeff 232]

Heres my opinion,

presidency is a four year term, four years ago in my life I was broke, drinking heavily, and going no where. Then a woman came into my life, actually one I cared about. In four years she took me from 20k a year income into a 80k+ bought a house, had a child, expanded business and what ever else she tells me, lol. All just by staying on my ass and keeping me in line. Im willing to give a woman a try here too.

I spent years doing what you did and more. 2000 everything changed for the better. Glad to see you are enjoying life!

[steve choate 14]

Also i would like to say that it was not Obama That was swarn in on the Koran but a diffrent congressman which was swarn in on it..also to be correct it was Thomas Jeffersons

copy of the koran..( look it up)

[Chappy 138]

I agree...we used to have lots more allies than we do now. That....is sad.

Beth

So, your saying Beth, that the President should be more politically correct. So we dont lose allies.

Let me tell you as one who spent a lot of my formative years overseas. Governments or other countries have always disliked us because of our power, until we dont show our power. Then they ask us for help when they need it. People around the world love us. they want to be here because they economic opportunities here are much better than there. When the press interviews citizens of other countries, who do you think they interview, the ones who like us or the ones who hate us.

When Pres. Reagan asserted power the world thanked us. WHen he withdrew the Marines from lebenon, the world lost respect for us. When Jimmy Carter sat there and waffled about what to do, the world lost respect for us. Then Reagan built our power again up again.

I could go on and on. Ive lived Overseas. I have seen the respect and the hatred people have for the US. and in my experience, the more power we assert, the more people respect and love the USA.

[Beth n Rod 1,279]

I'm saying our foreign relations aren't what they used to me. We used to be good at working with countries and building relationships.

Beth

[Chappy 138]

I'm not a saved person, but I sure feel like one because God has saved my life and kept me alive in some very difficult times.

Wow, what a statement.

So God has saved your life, etc. but you dont believe that God should have a place in our country's discourse. Keep Him out of politics, Seperation of Church and State, and all that horse pucky.

If you believe God has a place in our everyday lives, why shouldnt He have a place in the everyday lives of the people who lead us?

Christians-Evengelical Christians anyway-believe that the social fabric of this country is coming apart. Ever since the rediculous assertion that the Seperation of Church and State is enshrined in the Constitution. When a liberal supreme court found that right in the constitution, along with the right to abortion,(that freedom of speech means that a woman can kill her baby) the majority of the country was againt those rulings. Now they have been so enshrined in our country's psyche, that when a canditate running for public office says their for Christian values, every one gets up in arms that he will turn the country into a Christian caliphate and overturn all the liberal rulings of liberal judges and liberal supreme court.

Thats the problem with the modern democratic party, No person with strong faith gets far up in the party, Robert Casey for instance. The Democrats wouldnt even let him speak at the convention. They have to be completely non religious.

The republican base is conservative, religiously inclined. We want a Christian that will at least talk about his faith, that will talk about the values that made this country great-Christian values.

(by the way, polls show that the vast majority of religious conservatives voted for Romney in Michigan. )

[PPC 37]

I agree...we used to have lots more allies than we do now. That....is sad.

Beth

I don't like to get caught up in political crap but this really rupped me the wrong way nobody likes the US and they never have I'm so tired of every one blaming President Bush for our problems some poeple act like he has ruined there life he is not perfect the media has ruined him and he does'nt back down just to be politicaly correct and sometimes he is too loyal

Also I was hurt in Korea because of the hatred towards this country I have the scares on my face to prove it and the presidnt was Bill CLINTON!!!!!!

[Beth n Rod 1,279]

I don't like to get caught up in political crap but this really rupped me the wrong way nobody likes the US and they never have I'm so tired of every one blaming President Bush for our problems some poeple act like he has ruined there life he is not perfect the media has ruined him and he does'nt back down just to be politicaly correct and sometimes he is too loyal

Also I was hurt in Korea because of the hatred towards this country I have the scares on my face to prove it and the presidnt was Bill CLINTON!!!!!!

Bush certainly isn't helping now is he???

Rod!~

[PPC 37]

I was not trying to be a jerk we had alot of problems before President Bush came along

[Jeff 232]

Wow, what a statement.

So God has saved your life, etc. but you dont believe that God should have a place in our country's discourse. Keep Him out of politics, Seperation of Church and State, and all that horse pucky.

If you believe God has a place in our everyday lives, why shouldnt He have a place in the everyday lives of the people who lead us?

Christians-Evengelical Christians anyway-believe that the social fabric of this country is coming apart. Ever since the rediculous assertion that the Seperation of Church and State is enshrined in the Constitution. When a liberal supreme court found that right in the constitution, along with the right to abortion,(that freedom of speech means that a woman can kill her baby) the majority of the country was againt those rulings. Now they have been so enshrined in our country's psyche, that when a canditate running for public office says their for Christian values, every one gets up in arms that he will turn the country into a Christian caliphate and overturn all the liberal rulings of liberal judges and liberal supreme court.

Thats the problem with the modern democratic party, No person with strong faith gets far up in the party, Robert Casey for instance. The Democrats wouldnt even let him speak at the convention. They have to be completely non religious.

The republican base is conservative, religiously inclined. We want a Christian that will at least talk about his faith, that will talk about the values that made this country great-Christian values.

(by the way, polls show that the vast majority of religious conservatives voted for Romney in Michigan. )

Jon, Im just not real big on religion, so I don't want it to be a major part of our government

I agree that the moral fabric is pretty crappy, but I dont think people like Bush is going to change that, I have seen nothing in him that trys to bring people together, he tells everyone its his way or the highway, he tells other countries that (sure I like being tough) BUT he also tells at least half of this country, he doesn't care what we think so I guess its the highway for us in his mind, I just don't like someone who divides. We will do as we always do, about 20% of the eligible voters will vote and we will do what we always do spend billions to put a republican or democrat in office and we will have something new to argue about

don't get mad Jon, I'm just tack fully trying to explain how the OTHER side thinks and kill some time too

Time will tell if there's a heaven & hell. I just don't think like many born agings, that they are the only ones that are going to heaven and the rest well, we know where they are going

have a good one

[tinsley 14]

Ok my turn to chime back in on the conversation. Its hard trying to read a few post and then reply so if I get something wrong sorry.

First Jon I didnt say that GW was trying to be polititcaly correct I said that he trick people into believeing something that is false as far as the reason we went to war, & ect. I do think that he is part of the reason for the gas prices being so high.(he is an oil man from Texas)And I dont know about the rest of ya but the gas prices are KILLING ME.

Jeff

I hope and will pray for you that you find some wrong with your last statement. It is very sad because without salvation there is no way to get to Heaven. I have had alot of people ask me how can God send someone that he loves to Hell and here is my answer God dont send us to Hell we send ourselves by unbelief. There is one way and that is through Jesus Christ himself. Go ahead and call me a holy roller or what ever it dont bother me at all, but without God this country is going astray. I understand how the other side thinks I was not raised in church and I know how the world is. So I do understand your stance. I also know how much better it is on this side of the fence(for a lack of better words).

As for allies

We are the most powerful nation in this world if they dont like us it dont bother me. When they need help though they always call Uncle Sam. And we will rush over and help some other country just so we can say look at what we did.Then we take the hit to our economy. The goverment should charge people for our help and or protection.

Once again if I got my thought mixed up sorry but these are mine and now yall can come beat on the Christian now if you want its ok. But as long as this conversation is geared towards God or says anything about God I will voice my Beliefs in him.

For he is worthy of all praise

One more thing the reason for seperation between goverment and church was so the goverment could not tell us how to worship God, it wasnt to keep God out of goverment. One of the biggest reason this country was founded was for religious freedom, with God in mind.

[Jeff 232]

Ok my turn to chime back in on the conversation. Its hard trying to read a few post and then reply so if I get something wrong sorry.

First Jon I didnt say that GW was trying to be polititcaly correct I said that he trick people into believeing something that is false as far as the reason we went to war, & ect. I do think that he is part of the reason for the gas prices being so high.(he is an oil man from Texas)And I dont know about the rest of ya but the gas prices are KILLING ME.

Jeff

I hope and will pray for you that you find some wrong with your last statement. It is very sad because without salvation there is no way to get to Heaven. I have had alot of people ask me how can God send someone that he loves to Hell and here is my answer God dont send us to Hell we send ourselves by unbelief. There is one way and that is through Jesus Christ himself. Go ahead and call me a holy roller or what ever it dont bother me at all, but without God this country is going astray. I understand how the other side thinks I was not raised in church and I know how the world is. So I do understand your stance. I also know how much better it is on this side of the fence(for a lack of better words).

As for allies

We are the most powerful nation in this world if they dont like us it dont bother me. When they need help though they always call Uncle Sam. And we will rush over and help some other country just so we can say look at what we did.Then we take the hit to our economy. The goverment should charge people for our help and or protection.

Once again if I got my thought mixed up sorry but these are mine and now yall can come beat on the Christian now if you want its ok. But as long as this conversation is geared towards God or says anything about God I will voice my Beliefs in him.

For he is worthy of all praise

One more thing the reason for seperation between goverment and church was so the goverment could not tell us how to worship God, it wasnt to keep God out of goverment. One of the biggest reason this country was founded was for religious freedom, with God in mind.

Gordon. Holy Roller is cool, its what you believe in. I just don't think your bible speaks for everyone and should not be a big part of the gov. The Gov has to be for All the People, Born Again, catholic, Jew, Buddhist or the millions of others

I just cant believe God as you or I know him, would exclude all these other people just because they are in a different religion. What because someone was raised in a different Christian religion or raised a Jew or whatever they are doomed unless they become born again. It just confuses me how you and other can say its your bible or you are going to hell. Your bible wasn't even the 1st bible was it ( really just asking and not trying to offend)

Let me put it this way, maybe Gods words were interrupted wrong in your bible or other bibles, what if you get to heaven and theres zillions of just good people there of ALL FAITHS that were good all their lives and God took all the good people in. I cant see God saying to a 5 year old, sorry you cant come in, because your parents taught you to be a Jew or a Catholic

Believe me Gordon, I am not putting down your faith now. I love God, I'm not a great Christian I know that I just have many different thoughts. I believe God of course has a place in government just as i do with other faiths. I have no problem and I think it should be allowed in many aspects. I have no problem with the 10 commandments in gov buildings, I have no problem if children or their parents want their children saying a pray in school, theres a lot of things that have to do with God & moral that we probably agree on.

have a good one and more power to you. Maybe we'll meet some day and you never know it might be in Heaven, if all goes well

Jeff

[Deck Guy 14]

I just don't get the 72 virgins thing. I'd rather have 72 35-year-old divorcees!

[Beth n Rod 1,279]

We now return you to the topic of the thread: Who is Barack Obama?

Rod!~

[Jeff 232]

We now return you to the topic of the thread: Who is Barack Obama?

Rod!~

Im waiting to hear more than a good speach from him, Im worried he will get in and have nothing other than good speaches, I just dont know and Im wondering about him

[MMI Enterprises 289]

Hope ya'll don't mind if I chime back in on a few things..

Gordon, I think many of us have more common ground than not.

Your earlier posts treading into sin and then evil and then finally opinion of how GW has no faith pretty much took too much time to hear.

My background in Christian belief system and logic does not allow me to confuse or twist sin, evil, fence sitting, or wrongful policing in a country in need of their own solution as all being same or grounds for a faithless president.You say you not judging him but I don't buy it. Seems since his faith or actions , or course of actions are different than what yers would be that he has no faith is what yer saying. Maybe you not dooming him but simply making a judgement/decission on who or what he is personaly and his relation with God. I can't say he did a sin on me or anyone else as he and I have no personal relation. He is but a man that makes state decissions and I can't in good concious label what his nature may be on personal level beyond what he claims openly. Even if he is a sinner as most are it hardly makes for evil.... Is rediculous to me that fiscal decissions leading to failure also might equate to lack of true faith and following to some people. You and some others are correct in my book though on some things and questionably wrong on others. Will site such below:

Ok my turn to chime back in on the conversation. Its hard trying to read a few post and then reply so if I get something wrong sorry.

First Jon I didnt say that GW was trying to be polititcaly correct I said that he trick people into believeing something that is false as far as the reason we went to war, & ect.jury still out there and likely always will be I do think that he is part of the reason for the gas prices being so high.(he is an oil man from Texas)likelyAnd I dont know about the rest of ya but the gas prices are KILLING ME.

Jeff

I hope and will pray for you that you find some wrong with your last statement. It is very sad because without salvation there is no way to get to Heaven. I have had alot of people ask me how can God send someone that he loves to Hell and here is my answer God dont send us to Hell we send ourselves by unbelief. You leave out a milleniums worth of teaching and preaching that people will have oportunity to listen to before judgements are handed. Many believe that it possable that not a single soul but for the one already doomed as they will be unable to refuse what they hear. As teachers in such situations (let's imagine luved ones unsaved) we will have chance to contribute besides this evangelical world. Such chance adds upto more than most give credit or think about. Satan is the only one sentanced already..There is one way and that is through Jesus Christ himself. see you believe such must happen before yer worldy death but others well it is simply no.. Jesus will be my advocate when time for me. I hope and pray so. Take a murderous killer for example. They have no rest while here and are to be sent back to their maker in timely fashion (aka-state death penalty). Even they have chance as does relatives and unborn babies too good for this world...but hey to sum it up the only unforegivable sin is to deny the holy spirit speak through you when time comes. If some don't understand the need for such or ho wthat plays out then they are just not quite to that part or interpritation of the book in understanding how we all will effect each other and our salvations before what is called the Great White Judgement.. Go ahead and call me a holy roller or what ever it dont bother me at all, but without God this country is going astray. AMEN I understand how the other side thinks I was not raised in church and I know how the world is. So I do understand your stance. I also know how much better it is on this side of the fence(for a lack of better words). Too much war and killing from views of being on differing side of fence. All will likely be on same side soon enough..

As for allies

We are the most powerful nation in this world if they dont like us it dont bother me. Amen When they need help though they always call Uncle Sam. And we will rush over and help some other country just so we can say look at what we did.Then we take the hit to our economy. The goverment should charge people for our help and or protection. Amen

Once again if I got my thought mixed up sorry but these are mine and now yall can come beat on the Christian now if you want its ok. But as long as this conversation is geared towards God or says anything about God I will voice my Beliefs in him. Think mostly people accept that and but view it that they not talking about God persay but rather what they belive God is all about and how they apply it to their lives and wants for the country.

For he is worthy of all praise So be it

One more thing the reason for seperation between goverment and church was so the goverment could not tell us how to worship God, it wasnt to keep God out of goverment. One of the biggest reason this country was founded was for religious freedom, with God in mind. You, John, and I have great common ground here..

To sum up my positions on who I am most like in these sharings would be difficult..I believe something of everyone. Mostly Jeff, John, and myself...even a little Rod.

Oh that reminds...

Rod, All one has to do to see bible guidance for fiscal things of goobermint is to read it. Heaps of example and practical speak in there concerning financial right and wrong and credit usery even. One fella tought Egypt how to put back a great surplus to get through famine.

..as to your 'sad' thing I quote a famous rock band "SAD BUT TRUE" :)

oK Brothers have at me..haha