John T 744 Report post Posted August 17, 2008 Is it possible to Convert a Propane Burner to a Diesel Burner?? I have a 12 gpm Diesel Burner thats going to be added onto this flatbed so we can use up 24 GPM for Hot Water Cleaning. Even though Propane Burns so clean and it has minimal parts it would be more beneficial for me to now have all Diesel Burners. So u Equipment Geniuses can there be a way to Convert over Burners so they can be Diesel?? The coils and the Burners themselves I would like to save if possible instead of buying new Burners. The Diesel Burner thats going to be added onto this truck cost me almost 3 Grand and thats just for the burner and I don't want to spend double that for 2 more burners since I already have these propane burners. Thanks in advanced Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Russ Johnson 141 Report post Posted August 17, 2008 John, you'd have to go to the heater manufacturer and get the proper head to mount an oil burner on. Then you'd need oil burners, fuel lines, a tank, and wiring for either 120 or 12 volts. Do you know who made the heaters? Call me if you like, I can get most of what you need. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Bears Pressure Washing_ 14 Report post Posted August 17, 2008 Dam that is some serious flow. how many btu's are you running? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
John T 744 Report post Posted August 19, 2008 The Diesel Burner which I purchased from Envirospec has a btu rating of 660,000 btu and the two propane burners I have on this flatbed are rated at 1,100,000 each. You would think that would be enough heat power but is it ever really enough??? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
John T 744 Report post Posted August 19, 2008 (edited) Do you know who made the heaters? Call me if you like, I can get most of what you need. The burners are assembled by www.semfg.com and there btu rating is about 1,100,000 for each burner. Now the question is why the propane burners don't stay running long enough. This has me scratching my head for answers. Edited August 19, 2008 by John T spelling Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Russ Johnson 141 Report post Posted August 19, 2008 (edited) Now the question is why the propane burners don't stay running long enough. This has me scrathing my head for answers. What do you mean? Running out of fuel? Cutting off before desired temperature is reached? Falling apart? John, do you have a parts breakdown on your units? Edited August 19, 2008 by Russ Johnson Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
John T 744 Report post Posted August 19, 2008 What do you mean? Running out of fuel? Cutting off before desired temperature is reached? Falling apart?John, do you have a parts breakdown on your units? Yes I do have the parts breakdown of my burners. I'll try to remember to scan them and put them here. I replaced the electrodes awhile back but I'm guessing I probably have the wrong distance between them. I don't have a gauge to set them with so I did them by trial and error. So one burner goes on but sometimes after awhile it doesn't kick back on when needed to and the other one at times won't even light. This has caused more problems:lgbugeyes Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Beth n Rod 1,278 Report post Posted August 19, 2008 I have heard that propane in itself does not burn as hot as other fuels. Rod!~ Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ECS MARK 19 Report post Posted August 19, 2008 John, Silver Eagle has (SE MFG) burners are different from most out there, you would need an adapter plate under neath to mount a Wayne or Beckett burner, in addition to the items Russ mentioned. If the burner is shutting off before it reaches temperature your problem could be: Thermostat Calibration or faulty. Propane tank or piping freezing due to undersized tank or lines. (If the propane tank and or lines are not sized properly they will ice up.) We have worked on a few of these units.....not my favorite:eek: Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Vince Wood 14 Report post Posted August 19, 2008 If the burner is coming on and off then it could be the microswitch in the black box of the unloader. At least that seems to be the problem with mine most of the time with my Silver Eagle Unit. As far as setting the electrodes, I've had problems with that also. I just take a tape measure and make sure all 3 are set within 1/4 inch of each other. Rod is right though about the propane not burning as hot as diesel but it still takes the gum off great and gets the job done. My next pressure washer will have a diesel fired burner on it though. Have you ever replaced the main control module (black box with a bunch of wires coming out of it) that is the brain for the burner and it controls how hot the water gets, when the burner comes on/off and more. If thats the problem it's a $190 dealer only item. Call me anytime if this doesn't work and maybe I can help you through it. Vince 562-331-0301 Industry, Ca Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Russ Johnson 141 Report post Posted August 19, 2008 Is that a forced air gas burner as opposed to a natural draft type? If so, the plate to mount the oil burner may already be in place Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
John T 744 Report post Posted August 19, 2008 This is the schematics for the Burners on my truck Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Vince Wood 14 Report post Posted August 19, 2008 Russ, I believe they are forced air burners on these units. If you're using them in a windy area though the flame will blow out. Have you by chance checked to see the PSI coming out of the propane tank? It should be between 12 - 15 PSI. One more thing you can check also is the flame on the burner. If it's blue then you're alright. If it has alot of yellow in it then it may mean it's not getting enough propane to it. Also make sure the gas line coming from the 12v solenoid to the burner orifice isn't pinched or leaking anywhere. Hope this helps Vince Industry, Ca 562-331-0301 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Vince Wood 14 Report post Posted August 23, 2008 Hey John, Did you ever get your machine working right? If so, what was wrong with it? I'm starting to have problems with mine again. The burner isn't lighting off like it should. Russ Johnson gave me a great price on a brand new machine. Hopefully within the next 6 weeks I'll be ordering a new machine from him then I'm selling the Silver Eagle. It's got 180 Hours on the Vanguard 18HP engine, the General TS2021 pump has less that 50 hours on it. I'll sell it including the 50 gallon propane tank to the 1st person that PM's me. $1,200 takes it (but not until I get my new machine 1st). Vince Industry, Ca 562-331-0301 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Russ Johnson 141 Report post Posted August 23, 2008 Heck, if I were close enough, I'd give you that for the pump and engine and trash the rest... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
John T 744 Report post Posted August 24, 2008 (edited) Hey John,Did you ever get your machine working right? If so, what was wrong with it? I'm starting to have problems with mine again. The burner isn't lighting off like it should. Russ Johnson gave me a great price on a brand new machine. Hopefully within the next 6 weeks I'll be ordering a new machine from him then I'm selling the Silver Eagle. It's got 180 Hours on the Vanguard HP engine, the General TS2021 pump has less that 50 hours on it. I'll sell it including the 50 gallon propane tank to the 1st person that PM's me. $1,200 takes it (but not until I get my new machine 1st). Vince Industry, Ca 562-331-0301 No we have been to busy for me to get this Flatbed to a propane place for a look see. So far both Burners work intermittently. A real pain in the rump. Edited August 25, 2008 by John T Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Vince Wood 14 Report post Posted August 24, 2008 Well don't feel too bad John, this morning mine was lighting off again at all. I had to hold the gun open and light the burner off with a match about 4 times this morning. Just have to make sure you do it quick and with the long barbeque matches. Burned the hairs off my right hand again this morning though doing it. It's going to the repair shop this week. I'll take it over to a guy here in So Cal that does good work. The problem is finding someone locally that works on the propane powered machines though. Vince Wood 562-331-0301 Industry, Ca Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Hummerbk 16 Report post Posted August 24, 2008 Try replacing the thermal couple (milivolt generator) that the pilot light heats up. If it is going bad the pilot light will not stay lit or it will not allow the gas valve to operate. It is cheap and quick to replace it , about $20. If the pilot light is staying lit try jumpering around the flow switch and on/off switch using a piece of wire. Make sure the pilot light is lit and quickly bypass the switches by touching a wire between the two terminals on the gas valve that the switches are wired to. Be careful if the gas valve is under the burners. Hold the wire there for about two seconds, the burner should light. If it lights then your flow swith or on/off switch is bad. If it dosen't light replace the thermal couple. If it still dosen't light after replacing the thermalcouple then you have a bad gas valve. Dave Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Vince Wood 14 Report post Posted September 3, 2008 Well the problem with my machine turned out to be bad electrodes. I paid $25 for 4 of them here. The machine lights off every time now. As soon as I got it fixed I had a guy drive by asking me how much for the rig? Stupid me told him it wasn't for sale....I should've told him $7,000 and take it lol. Vince Wood Industry, Ca 562-331-0301 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
MMI Enterprises 289 Report post Posted September 3, 2008 They utilize pilot light?..never woulda thunk it being so in this day and age of auto this or that. Shouldn't they have an autoignitor like natural gas home heating units? I would think process for deducing issue should be something like David describes. I mean bypassing things in the loop always finds problem no matter the technology. I'd tend to look to the switch technology (flow,pressure, vac, thermo) first before thinking electrodes or parts of the propane system being at fault or lesser than a deisel. Personally I would prefure the clean burning nature of the propane unit but perhaps the valving and efficiency they seem to be offering in their current state isn't worth it. Before switching to deisel perhaps some focus on what Rod said about the heat is worht considering. He did mention 'propane in itself does not burn as hot' and that leads me to think that the forced air/ratio can make all the difference on how well these units can produce. After all look at the btu rating of them things. Is it a lie or should those things get hot? If their not keeping up to spec I would think it has to be electronic switch/thermostatic issues or freezing issues of the valving. Propane at high pressure goes liquid and freezes stuff up. I know internal combustion machines that utilizes diaphragm regulation via vacuum are susceptable to tank overfill. Diapragm can freeze or crack and yer done for. Perhaps some part on these burner type machines are just as prone..Seems a high flow of propane through a fuel plumb system would also cause freezing of things. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
alvisishere 66 Report post Posted September 4, 2008 Well the problem with my machine turned out to be bad electrodes. I paid $25 for 4 of them here. The machine lights off every time now. As soon as I got it fixed I had a guy drive by asking me how much for the rig? Stupid me told him it wasn't for sale....I should've told him $7,000 and take it lol.Vince Wood Industry, Ca 562-331-0301 glad you got it fixed Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
John T 744 Report post Posted September 4, 2008 My Burners should be fixed by today. There was some continuity issues with also the two Black Control Modules boxes needing to be replaced. Don't know the tab yet to have this fix but as long as its fixed and no more headaches then I'll be happy. Oh yea I was told to WD-40 the electrical connections once in awhile because the outside weather loves to beat on these connections even though there hidden under some stainless steel. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Vince Wood 14 Report post Posted September 4, 2008 John, If I remember correctly the control boxes are around $140 to $160 each. I replaced mine already twice though. I'm just waiting for the thermostat or the gas solenoid to go out on mine. It's the only 2 things that I haven't replaced on it. Have you had any problems with your machines Al? Vince Wood Industry, Ca 562-331-0301 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
MMI Enterprises 289 Report post Posted September 4, 2008 So stay away from fickle SE MFG propane units is the message then eh? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
John T 744 Report post Posted September 6, 2008 So stay away from fickle SE MFG propane units is the message then eh? I can't say that. Propane burners have alot less parts to them compared to a Diesel burner. Propane also burns much cleaner then diesel and the propane itself cost cheaper then diesel. The downfalls with Propane burners is that not as many Powerwashing people work on them compared to diesel burners. propane is also more of a pain to purchase on any given night compared to diesel. So there are pro's and cons to Propane Burners. One of the most respected men in this business David Olsen Pressurewashing Cleaning Specialists - Tidy Powerwash Service, Inc. www.tps-inc.com Pressure Washing Project Pictures uses Propane Burners and swears by them. He was a major influence on me to go the propane route a few years ago Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
