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MMI Enterprises

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Posts posted by MMI Enterprises

  2. Posted · Report reply

    I wouldn't say they are junk for their intended purpose but that folks are under a false impression of how fast them lower gpm machines can do some jobs or how long the direct drive pumps, or accesories might last. Our commercial pumps are belt driven, built to last or be rebuilt, and satisfy many types of PWing. They can easily cost more then the machine discussed here. Although I regularly see plenty of home owners using cold washers in my neighborhood I don't forget to notice they spend hours and hours in just doing their drives and walks for them to look like a zebra. In the real world time is money so when a professionals machine has a problem that changes it's effectivness down to one of them 4 gpm or under machines they usually fix right away. Now plenty of painters prep with them small cold water washers from the box stores and they are the bread and butter of sales most likely for the stores. But thing to remember is if you'll notice they are up on dangerous ladders and are fully prepared to work with the result of what would normally be considered damage from too much pressure. If it weren't for post PWing sanding tasks and painting tasks already planned it would be a mistake to consider using them washers as they do on a house or it's trim areas. They use them to remove loose paint and some dirt prior to painting and is a whole other animal to considered compared to a home owner being allowed on the hose to do more harm then good. Also there are the plenty of gas stations sending their cheap labor out at night with them cold machines to mesh around with. I can testify how their results are kin to a horror show in them commercial situation. Not uncommon to see a guy out doing a 4k sq ft. pad for the better part of an 8 hour shift and yet gum and grease is still everywhere or there are pencil marks or vebra stripes all about. They don't get gum or grease in a commercial situation worth a darn without chemical and heat.

  3. Posted · Report reply

    You mentioned in a post above,

    Quote:

    The two chems are likely to leave differing amounts of soft fiber that you can scrape off cause they likely burn different and deeper,

    Is this an oxalic result? I've not noticed any "burning" or "soft fiber" remaining after citric acid use.

    Anyway, two pics attached. The ipe' was cleaned with percarb, allowed to dry, and lightly sanded with 60 grit using a random orbital. No acids have been applied yet. First is a close up of the deck floor. Second is our test bed of 2 x 6 ipe' top rail running the length of the deck.

    http://windsorwoodcare.com/images/bb...s/dscf0015.jpg

    http://windsorwoodcare.com/images/bb...s/dscf0017.jpg

    If you want to compare to original condition before cleaning, I posted 4 pics on the 2nd page of this thread.

    Just ignore that cause your wood is already satisfactory far as cleaning the old dead grey mush off the surface. Your actually using the acids to brighten and to actually go from alkaline to acidic. Your not just neutralizing and are after the brightening aspects of the acid. I like what your doing in this cause it helps to control the myth of how one might clean better then the other.

    Far as mold coming back I don't know for sure but imagine that pc is a good enough sanitizer that it won't survive. It isn't strong enough at the strength I used to disolve 1" algae like chlorine of the 'apple sauce' mix might but I think it dead enough. The tsp isn't something to shake a stick at either. Painters been using it forever prior to painting and I heard something over the years about it was used heavily in the whaling industry to bleach whale bones..??

    But don't get me wrong as I am not advocating using it in the residentail HO market. I don't know sufficiently what it does to wood.(maybe an anchient deck hand on a whaler cound say or ma ladies flowers..time will tell)

    ..oh and no I got no darkening effects from the pc or rather the mix I used, only nice light original looking wood..

  5. Posted · Report reply

    Not sure yet what the tsp will do to windows at the ratio I did.

    I did 8 oz. percarb, 3 oz tsp, .5 oz apple blossom, and .5 oz borax to 1 gal. and flojetted it on for a dwell of 15 minutes.. the reaction and cling was perfect for my taste. A very mild application of either acid after would be fine to make perfect for staining. That mix is almost same as 'apple sauce' for roofs but without the chlorine. It stripped aged acrylic floor finish just fine the other night...

    I'll post up the ph level chart I was working on to the chemical section on how the two acids differ.. I see either as just as harmfull to fish along with ph being different.

  6. Posted · Report reply

    Ahhh he should be named Plainscientist not Plainpainter :D

    If there is an experiment that should made it should be bleach vs oxalic.I would use oxalic if the wood had rust stains or leaf stains.

    I still feel bleach will prep the wood up better to accept the stain.

    Irony has it that prior to seeing this thread this early afternoon I did just that but I did it with PC,TSP,apple blossom, and borax... is almost good enough to accept stain...lol

    Oh and BTW, the amount of grey after a year was same on all boards.

  7. Posted · Report reply

    Rick, I say to rinse before the staining part. The two chems are likely to leave differing amounts of soft fiber that you can scrape off cause they likely burn different and deeper, and probably one keeps on burning with time or more sun. Oxalic gets whiter faster and more so on crete then the citric and I suspect it will have some similar effect on the wood along same lines when still active. If you stop the action of both by rinsing as well as you can then you can confirm more important things. Whether or not the wood became changed or any more porous deeper on in and would be immedietly seen by stain absorbtion. Leaving it on could say more about down the road effects of which might be better to rinse off prior to sealing..Is not my bag to leave a reaction happening unchecked on anything so I am out of line in speaking on this really. I would rather know which absorbs more after using a citric mix or an oxalic mix meant to be washed off cause they have cleaners in them and but this is apparently more about which to leave in the wood or not. I call a manufacture claim that one is worse then the other to use (clean with) is subjective to whether their product is going to be left on or not.

  10. Posted · Report reply

    This is way old but I am interested in how it went..

    I have these in my kitchen and exterior patio..they are often refered to as Mexican tile....They do not come with a glaze persay far as I usually saw and were applied originally across the country as if they were to have their pores open. When it comes time to clean they respond well to standard degreasers and the grout respond well to citric acid and last years and years with a natural look and no top coat. Problem is though they show every bit of dirt and require too much cleaning. Method is either mop or autoscrub with mild strato grit type brush as you must get into the grout and you must pick water up...well if not the water just goes straight down into slab and evaporates just fine on backup with dirt and chemicals. When I got tired of the cleaning all the time I tried a few high solid acrylic finishes first and they were just absorbed right off and made cleaning no easier. So then I used some conversion varnish followed up by the acrylics and bamm they looked hot for the past year. The kids got a new sandbox about 3 weeks back and proceded to go ahead and create me a nice traffic lane on the kitchen when their trikes tracked it in. Couple more weeks I am stripping it all off and redoing with catalyzed poly before top coating..

    Mine are pretty robust far as being able to scrub with low speed machine. Have even ran 100 grit sand screens on them to smooth corners and edges of individual tiles so that I could run a soft padded propane burnisher on them..haha, yup I do grocery stores at night then come home and polish my kitchen with a 200 lb machine..lol

    P.S. I consider it a restoration level of work cause to do perfectly you will end up with some amount of the clay coming off and possably some scratches left to sand out or fill in. The black 3M hipro pads (thin open weave) are the best to really get clean though(or to strip vinyl..btw). Sand screens can be had at the big box store if you want to really get in there.

    Thanks for the info. Any Names or Brands for an Outside Tile Sealer? Thanks.

    Not Behr low lustre...slippery as all get out.

    Not white mountain..lasts less then a year under sun.

  11. Posted · Report reply

    Well is this going to be pure oxalic & citric crystal at same percentage?

    I have no experience with testing the two on ipe or how a stain would hold differently but from my tests on 20 year old fir and cedar on both spa and fence over the last year I can confirm that the oxalic removed the gray and calcium much faster and was better at showing the original natural wood color. I know it is aside from the tests your going to do concerning stain but isn't it pretty darn important to get to the point of a real even look let alone prior to leaving for a night of dry time of worrying about if stain/seal is going to look decent on it? I think the claim of differing spread ratio results is very possable but that it is likely to be more geared around incomplete removal or leach out in general of the dead stuff and rinse methods. I would like to see the staining results of 4 tests between the two acid with 2 of the tests using a garden hose fan rinse and the other 2 using just less then fur damage.

    I'de almost bet that only one would be more prone to being able to scrape off a fingernail full of dead stuff that logic says changes the stain absorbtion.

  14. Posted · Report reply

    {singing} It's all coming back to me now..

    In school they would have told us to change C to fraction, then multiply across both the top and bottom and then devide the fraction back to whole number......Feels like grade school again...thanx Philip....

    I'll probably print and paste the formula to my machinery since the math will deal with products of any % , or any gal. amount, or tank size that I might want to dilute down.

    Doesn't Osh have a tad higher % SH in 2 gal. boxes? muriatic and bleach both I believe..

  16. Posted · Report reply

    Forgiven. It's right but there is an easier way. Follow my logic.

    For your tank 12 / 35 = .3428571

    Whenever you divide something by one, you can instead just flip over the fraction and multiply. Hence,

    1 /.3428571 => 1/(12/35) => 35/12

    This also means that all these are the same

    1.5/.3428571 => 1.5/ (12/35) => 1.5 * (35/12)

    Now, for PW chemistry 35/12 is close enough (2.92) to 3. So I'd just say that 1.5*3 = 4.5 gallons.

    Philip,

    So please verify... we take c (desired tank percentage) x the flipped fraction t (desired tank volume) over b (starting bleach percentage) ?

    Formula being C x (t/b)

    ..And both our "/" within the "()" are really supposed to be a flat fraction sign?.....

    My lady had me all confused this morning wanting me to think ratio of 3:1 and I just knew that a math teacher would want us to just flip or convert to fractions to multiply or some such thing...

    This stuff confuses the heck outta me...arggghhh

    p.s. ...

    In practice I could just count off on my fingers how many half cuts it took to get to the end desired % I want and use that figure x the desired %...

    p.s. ... well nope that don't work hu...lol

  17. Posted · Report reply

    Your like at 1.5% bleach after your first cut in tank. (before downstreaming or xjetting)

    Surely there is better way to write it but for liquid 12%SH ya figure something like this:

    b(12%) / t (tank size)= gp (per gal. %) , then take c (1.5% desired cleaning percentage) / gp= b gal. of bleach to add to tank

    so for a 1.5% mix of 12% bleach in a 35 gal. tank it be such:

    12/35=.3428571 , then 1.5/.3428571= 4.350005 gal.

    ....Hey folks, please forgive if this is wrong and there be a better way to figure. I don't know how to write equations.. I suck at math!! argghh

  18. Posted · Report reply

    I been adding info to a ph chart I ran across..feel free to add info or adjust for own use. Chemicals are complex and are not always absolutely at these ph's due to processes that could have been performed to them for specific industry use. Tried to range them as bit best I could tell though and added some generic names and brand info.

    umm err..how come I can't seem to upload any file formats??

  19. Posted · Report reply

    I think the soul of Ron's comments are that you can't judge a process just by the ingredients you use.

    after reading more then half this torturous thread..I think I'll stay away from calling someone for explaination as I might be belittled or might even not become more educated from said phone call.

    But anyways......Daniel do you think the use of absolute language can actually speak to and be interpritted better by ears that might be uneducated on processes that should be used while handling chemicals?

    For instance..When I speak to a child I adjust my skills in a way that the child can understand as the child needs discipline and they deal in absolutes. When speaking to a child I speak as a child with my best adult judgement and their safety at heart. In my business I often speak absolutes to customers when dealing with their maintenance procedures cause I usually make early attempt to understand their abilities or knowledge and I have adult discriminitive ability. The moment I know they are uneducated on process or amounts they can use of a chemical I have to deem them irrresponsable enough to use the chemical at all until they are. I can relate this to my usual speal of how freedom without responsability is anarchy..Anarchy will blow ya up,poison ya, or pretty much ruin everything.

    So what ya think about exceptions to the usual advice of not speaking in absolutes???,, :)

    Phrases like "such as" like you used above are so important but can be ignored by some..aren't they?..

  20. Posted · Report reply

    yes..it has to be sized for 3 tips worth of volume escaping. Experiment with 10 degree tip and adjust angle of tips so as to not be spinning excessively. Is a fine balance between how fast you want it to spin and how fast you want to walk.

    There is a good thread about large surface cleaners ifyou do a search you should find it..

  21. Posted · Report reply

    Daniel, yer darn tootin right on all that... my father painted his whole life and is a broke old man. Where I imagine someone getting rich inthe painting business I picture a very active sales/managing oriented owner that delegates the jobs out to others in a very upscale exclusive area or construction market.... haha, where is that at?

    Regardless of what I charge I always end up the working poor.

  24. Posted · Report reply

    Owner/operator syndrome involves two things that will drain you.. ego and perfectionism. I fall prey to them just like everyone else.

    ..Extremely valid in all trades..

    People are impressed by neatness, finishing quickly, and good quality work.

    ..many potential customers have been so damaged by unscrupulous labor practices,material selection, and slow work that they don't believe me when I say I can do better in half the time.

    I really like Daniels low tiered grayed out idea and although the dollar amounts seem high at my first glance for house painting they apparently work out to only $50 per hr. with materials included??

  25. Posted · Report reply

    update:

    -----------------------------------------------------------------------

    Exterior Wood sealants and/or stains and what we know about them

    1. water based=
    2. oil based= RS, WT, Baker's Gray Away, Sikkens SRD, Cabots (all), Deckscapes (Cuprinol), house brands from MAB, SW, Ben Moore, Wolman's F&P, TWP
    3. parafinnic oil replenishing type product= RS, TWS, Bakers Gray Away
    4. silica densifier product (non-strippable)=
    5. acrylic top coat=
    6. outter topcoat/film forming= Cabot's
    7. permanent or 7+ year=
    8. low sheen= RS,WT
    9. high sheen=RS(multi-coat)
    10. penetrating= RS,
    11. transparent= RS,
    12. tintable= RS,
    13. offered pre-tinted= RS,
    14. available mail order only= WT, Baker's
    15. available from nationwide suppliers= RS,
    16. not available to California=
    17. avg's under $30 per gal.= RS,WT,Baker's Gray Away, Sikkens SRD, Cabots (all), Deckscapes (Cuprinol), house brands from MAB, SW, Ben Moore, Wolman's F&P, TWP
    18. avg's under $50 per gal.=
    19. can be applied to wet wood=WT, Cabot's SPF
    20. initially usually requires more than one coat= RS,Baker's Gray Away, Sikkens SRD, Cabots (all), Deckscapes (Cuprinol), house brands from MAB, SW, Ben Moore, Wolman's F&P, TWP
    21. usually needs stripped before reapplication=
    22. usually lasts 2 years or more= RS,
    23. reapplication after 2 years usually requires full strip=
    24. lasts more then 1 year on ipe=
    25. wood must absolutely be neutralized prior to application=
    26. must be brushed on=
    27. can be sprayed on with airless= RS,
    28. can be sprayed on with pump up sprayer= RS,
    29. can be water diluted prior to application= WT
    30. can be sprayed on with pressure washer downstreaming or xjetting=
    31. accepts foot traffic within 2 hours= RS,
    32. accepts foot traffic within half day= RS,
    33. accepts foot traffic within one day= RS,

    RS=Ready Seal

    TWS=Thompson's Water Seal

    WT=Wood Tux

    TWP= Total Wood Protectant

    Please help the above abbreviation area..

    ..and please think additively..if it seems that we end up getting too many conflicting ideas we'll have to just chalk it up to the fact that yes indeed this other fella might like to spray with this or dilute or walk on and recoat, etc... This certainly not going to be soley a manufacture spec sheet or what they recommend and but of course they are welcome to offer info.. I want to know more so what can be done more so than what can't be done if ya get my point....beyond slander or known dangerous misuse of their chemical makeup's outside of safe practice, that should be acceptable to manufactures and our own sensibilities..

    "We need to be careful not to post untrue information about products here. Field experience by contractors may or may not be based upon correct product usage.

    http://www.thegrimescene.com/forums/...uncements.html

    We encourage manufacturers and distributors of the above mentioned products to participate by providing accurate information about the above mentioned products, or links to their sites where this information may be found.

    Thank you.

    Beth "

    Format should stick if you just quote the person before you.

    end--------------------------------------------------------------------

    Beth, ...Your site, your rules of course. :) Let us know if a line is crossed beyond subjective experienced based info provided by your professionals here at Grimescene and I'll update list to satisfy and/or add disclosure language full of "weasel words' to seperate fact from opinion... Forum has plenty of opinion and safe DIY info already and I for one want it to stay as such.

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