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Robert Hinderliter

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Posts posted by Robert Hinderliter

  16. Posted · Report reply

    Sidebar note as per Conversation with Robert today--Here is the PWNA BOD's the first year I served. This was at a PWNA Convention in Dallas around 2004/2005. That Sport Jacket was given to me from Rod Rodriguez because they wanted us in Suit jackets for this picture. I think I only owned one then and I didn't bring it. If you can zoom in you will see my shoes. I walked a mile plus in the snow every day to be at this Convention because I was to naive to book in the room block.

    I look back on this and I wish then we had been more involved with BMP's.

    Today I am happy to serve with my fellow PWNA Enviro chairpersons even though its been challenging already. If its not a challenge then what's the point:biggrin:

    Dallas only snow fall that year, about 12 inches. Dallas has no snow removal equipment. Thanks for the picture.

    Excellent show with IWCA

  18. Posted · Report reply

    I recommend that the existing PWNA Cosmetic Cleaning BMP's manual be reviewed in chronological order (after we identifying the exact document to be reviewed, pdf file or word doc),..... though forum members can review pages that are currently being posted, there is a greater chance of page omission.

    I recommend that an alternative photo be used here, possibly one showing no debris at the inlet (showing water draining into storm inlet it is not necessary, as this may conjure thoughts that the water must be of a certain clarity, clear water is not necessarily safer for the environment vs mildly turbid water) , this photo is better suited to show the need for street/parking lot sweeping.

    The phrase "Nothing Down the Drain But Rain", is a contradictory phrase, although I not aware of its inception/history and though it may have been developed in earnest, the reality is, it is not attainable, the EPA and localities allow exempt, permitted and non-permitted discharges to the "drain but rain"

    Recommend that no photo be placed at this point in manual or if one is to be placed, the alternative suggested above.

    {I am taking a steep back, looking at the big picture, .....................}

    I think there is a great deal of information in the current PWNA Cosmetic Cleaning BMP manual, (I am reviewing the pdf version), the manual appears as a combination of pressure cleaning BMPs and AHJ training.

    I dont believe the two should be heavily inter mixed as they currently are, there maybe some overlap but in my opinion there is to much non-direct information, which is not necessary to be placed in a Contractors Association Cosmetic Cleaning BMP Manual. A manual should be as clear as possible. The PWNA can engage in providing training to AHJ's and I feel this should be entertained.

    The PWNA Cosmetic Cleaning BMP manual should be focused with an objective being:

    Concise in identifying/recommending, reasonable rational and logical Best Management Practices for various cleaning circumstances, that ultimately contractors have researched, developed, tested/adopted, re-evaluated and validated to minimize negative impact to the environment from operations with necessary consultation and assistance form internal and external knowledge/beneficial sources.

    ..........................................................................................................................................................................................................................

    {I am thinking out loud here:}

    What is the historical perspective of BMP's? ,and in particular the PWNA proposed BMP's ?, we need to identify a vision for the manual, and ultimately its mission

    Hope this post can be understood in the positive nature it was intended.

    Nigel: You are correct in that the BMPs as currently posted are a combination of AHJ Training and Practical BMPs. I felt that if the contract cleaner was aware of the AHJ Training then they could do a better job of making a competent decision. Most of the AHJ Training were develop by Charlotte, NC with some editing by myself and Mike Hilborn.

    Another thing you need to be aware of is that almost everyone who was involved with the development of the ordinances and BMPs have retired. Very few people of the original development community are still working. That is another reason that things are not always consistent.

    I have no problem with reviewing everything, however, that is a very big effort. Everything could be split into contractor training and AHJ Training. The biggest problem I see is finding someone willing to lead the effort.

  23. Posted · Report reply

    Excellent points Nigel. I looked at these BMP's in the past but I haven't really studied them as of yet. It's on my list.

    Hey fast question. Why do you suppose it is that for snow/ice purposes it's OK to lay salt brine down on the roads which most of it will travel down the storm drains if it has dissolved first(probably still end up down the storm drain) and yet our waste water is a total no no to let it pour down a storm drain? Do you think because of the safety factor here where salt/brine can save lives makes it where they get more of a free pass then we do?

    What's are some thoughts as to why this is?

    The more votes you represent the more they pay attention to you. Good Ole American Way.

  24. Posted · Report reply

    While reviewing links on the PWNA's current environmental page related to Updated BMP Documents 2011 I noticed that there is different content for the various format versions of the BMP. (this creates confusion , especially when the word doc is compared to the pdf versions, the filtering requirements are different as I mentioned earlier (initially I had not realized that the doc I found on the web was still current to the PWNA's website), the powerpoint version does not open in powerpoint but rather is a copy of the pdf version (they both have the same web link).

    Robert, Post #4 and #5 made in thread seem to be following the pdf versions of the 2011 Updated BMP's , but not in order, this creates some confusion to followers, after your post #2 which ended with Always Filter Waste Water, the next review topic should be Waste Water Capture (lower portion of page 7 in pdf version of BMP document).

    I suggest streamlining the current environmental page BMP web links discrepancies on the PWNA website and identiy in no uncertain terms what is the screen mesh suggested requirement, also when identifying mesh sizes always reference the equivalent micron size.

    Lets continue from page 7 ?

    Nigel: That needs to be addressed in the next update. We need to start making a list of everything.

  25. Posted · Report reply

    I would love to see an answer to this, especially if they locked themselves into the statement of an exemption. Salt brine is more more corrosive than the 15% that we use for a lot of cleaning. For a testament to its corrosive ability, I would love to show a regulator a time shown event of leaving a piece of metal in a five gallon pail of the stuff and see how long it lasts. If that stuff is as strong as I believe, thy are gonna be hard pressed to make a good argument why it's allowed. In addition to that, the chemical properties are similar with salt as a main ingredient.

    Anyone else have more info on this type of thing being allowed???

    it needs to be about the environment, not hypocracy!!

    Michael:

    If you are really interested in how this was done in your area you will have to do some research.

    Go to websites where this information is (eats up a lot of time), start with the epa.gov, state website, Departments of Environment Management, Stormwater Department, health departments, local municipality, here are some examples:

    California

    California Environmental Protection Agency

    California Department of Conservation

    California Air Resources Board

    California Department of Water Resources

    California Integrated Waste Management Board

    CA, Calabasas Mobile Commercial Washing Operations http://www.cityofcalabasas.com/pdf/mobile-car-wash/Calabasas-Mobile-Car-Wash-Ordinance.pdf

    CA, CASQA Vehicle and Equipment Cleaning SC-21 http://www.cabmphandbooks.com/Documents/Industrial/SC-21.pdf

    CA, County of San Diego County of San Diego County of San Diego: Stormwater - Power Washing

    CA, Discharge Prohibitions San Francisco Bay Basin http://www.waterboards.ca.gov/sanfranciscobay/water_issues/programs/planningtmdls/basinplan/web/tab/tab_4-01.pdf

    CA, Greater Sacramento Area http://www.sactostormwater.org/SSQP/documents/PressureWashing_BMPs_Dec08.pdf

    CA, NAPA-SOLAND-SONOMA Stormwater Agencies http://city.ci.st-helena.ca.us/images/aad/Docs/SurfaceCleaner%20Guide12.04.pdf

    CA, Parker West Environmental pressure washing removes petroleum and chemical pollutants from driveways and facilities without polluting storm drain systems

    CA, Pressure Washing Regulations in California What are the Pressure Washing Regulations in California? | eHow.com

    CA, Regional Water Quality Control Board, Exceptions for Low-Threat Discharges, Side Walks http://www.waterboards.ca.gov/northcoast/water_issues/programs/basin_plan/081120_ltd/comments/1_29_09_DMcenhill.pdf

    CA, San Diego, http://www.sandiego.gov/thinkblue/pdf/mobilebusinessbrochure.pdf

    CA, San Francisco Bay Implementation Plans Chapter 4 State Water Resources Control Board - San Francisco Bay

    CA, Santa Clara Valley 7. Equipment Washing & Steam Cleaning http://www.waterboards.ca.gov/water_issues/programs/stormwater/docs/murp_appendix4cc.pdf

    CA, Title 8 Car Washing and Polishing http://www.dir.ca.gov/dlse/CarWash/CARWASH-RegsSections13680-13693FINAL-1121.pdf

    CA, Prevention of Groundwater Contamination in Southern CA Groundwater Contamination Prevention/Cleanup in the Central and West Coast Basins

    Took about 4 hours to assemble the above.

    Here are some search terms

    Power Wash

    Pressure Wash

    Cosmetic Cleaning

    Car Wash

    Boat Washing

    Airplane Washing

    Truck Wash

    Stormwater Storm Water

    Storm Drain

    Storm Sewer

    Sanitary Sewer

    NPDES MS4

    Most websites will have a search box, which may or may not give you acceptable results. Watch very closely:

    US Environmental Protection Agency Here there is a search Box, enter the items above.

    If you enter (Cosmetic Cleaning) it will take you to any document with any of those words in it. But if you enter ("Cosmetic Cleaning"), then it will only take you to those documents where those words are together.

    Now if you want to search with Google the do this:

    site:epa.gov/ cosmetic cleaning or site:epa.gov/ "cosmetic cleaning" which will take you directly to the EPA's Model Ordinance.

    Most search engine use Google already, but not always. Also, I have found sometimes that using the manual search as ( site: ) above gives different results.

    Happy searching.

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