JFife

Sprinkler, This is a Ford/Chevy argument. What you should determine is what is right for YOU. You may find one product works better, but their contractor support costs you time and money. And some products work better than others in certain situations. Personally, I like to keep my choices on such things limited. One, it reduces bookkeeping if you can buy most everything from one or two places, and they bill you monthly. Two, if you have employees, the more they have to remember the harder it is. At this point in your "career", I'd get lined up with someone that can not only provide you products but excellent support not only for application but for pricing assistance, sales support, equipment advice, etc. Find something you like the advantages of and stick with it. For instance ESI makes a stain that can be applied to wet wood. This will boost the efficiency of a lot of guys in the country. Maybe that doesn't matter to you. Maybe you like that Readyseal is lap-free and easy to use. That makes YOU more profitable and happier. Maybe you like the fact that Benamin Moore stains look nice, and there is a store one mile from your home so it is easy access. Whatever it is, find what makes you YOUR best and stick with it.

Rich, As I expected, your thinking is right in line with mine. This probably would have been a better question to just ask a log restoration crowd, but it would not have got many responses. The reason I say that is because there is a vast amount of ways to properly restore a log home, many different types of stains, all which perfom/appear/maintain differently. The deck market has, well, fewer ways to properly do a job. With homes, there are a hundred different ways to do things correctly. For instance: Strip, brighten, TWP (basically what everyone does to their decks) Strip, brighten, BUFF, TWP Cob, borate, TWP Cob, borate, sand, TWP Cob, borate, three coat waterbase Cob, borate, buff/sand, three coat waterbase (etc. etc., etc.) There is nothing wrong with any of these methods, all will look different and weather differently, and be maintained differently. Where it gets tough, is trying to sell this idea. "Here are your five choices for a job." "homeowner: which will last the longest?" "Depends on what kind of maintanance you want to do" "Why should I pay more for sanding, blah, blah, blah" I was just curious if others offered a tiered approach. I've tried it and been unsuccessful, and nothing short of confusing to the customer. Now I just look at the job and determine what is the best thing for that SPECIFIC job, when looking at the desired appearance, what kind of maintenance they want to do, the value of the home, the customers "perfection" level, etc.

LOL, Mike--that little one looks like he'd/she'd be a rascal. He probably torments the big dog:) Celeste-----come on!! Dog pics! Xmas is over...this is not a hijack......I want to see more pics of your dogs!!! :)

hey celeste-- I got a new blanket for my bed...but lost it during a hostile takeover:) This is Abby:) Any xmas pics of your dogs?

You fish for DOLPHINS??!!??!! When is Koala Bear season?? Did you guys go Dog Hunting on the way home?? Kinda jokin' I guess......Just the thought of catching a friendly little dolphin was a surprise.

arrgghh, ....wrote a big long post last night and my comp. kicked off before i could submit it. I think we've missed the direction I had anticipated this going in. I agree, one right way, but..........I was moreso considering adding a buffing package, a sanding package, a multiple-coat stain package, etc. Not doing things wrong.......doing things differently and more intensive.

sprinkler, I am quite familiar with your area, and I'd say you have close to a nine month season. yes, things will get slower in the colder temps, and yes, the profit margins will adjust slightly, but you can compensate for it. I work year-round. I am staining a home today in northern Missouri. For the next month and a half, I'll focus on something different, and by Feb15, I'll start prepping houses for finishing the 1st of March. You gotta know your products and methods, and you can make things happen most of the year, especially where you are at. The deck guys in Denver go year-round.

One thing that annoys me about storing stripper and brightener (i think) is that they absorb water and crystalize (is the term 'pentahydrate'?). One thing that is aggravating about working out of small tubs of powder is this issue. Do you guys deal with this?? Minimize it? Transfer stripper into managable containers to be added to a 5er? Carry MIXED product??

Rod, I'm talking about how you open your tub of (say) HD80 after you've done three decks with it, and the product is in chunks. The term may be "anhydrous", but it is something like that. Basically, those chems absorb moisture. For instance, I had a bag of Naoh half full in my garage that I didn't seal the top of, and within a short amount of time it was as hard as concrete. The trick (like shane said) is to keep moisture away from it, as well as Oxygen, but easier said then done. That is why I asked how everyone kept theirs from getting chunky.

I'll write on next post

I do think you nailed this one, Rod. Ken, I've never heard that concept. A high conc. of acid essentially creates a more porous substrate?? If that is the case....what is the downside?? Obviously, you'd have a greater usage of product, but that would mean deeper penetration, and more solids to re-bulk the wood fibers with. If you are a proponent of oil base theory, I'd think this would be a good thing. Russ----thoughts?? (if you see this, i plan to call you tomorrow with some wrapi Q's if that is ok)

Sprinkler, Welcome to the board, sounds like you've got your head square and that will lead people to help you more than you can imagine. You are in an area with lots of wood and a surprisingly-long work season. I am sure housewashing is fine, but remember you won't have the yearly mold re-growth like back east. I know a guy in your state that does WELL with a biz building custom decks and refinishing them, and that would be a year-round biz. Might go well with your const. background, though wouldn't be as repetitive of a biz. Keep asking--we'll keep helping.

Rod, I humbly bow to the King!! I think you are EXACTLY right, Rod. When I stripped this deck, I used a sample of a product that had been sent to me, enough for one deck. Worked great. To brighten, I used another sample from another company, but the product had a "name" as opposed to being called a "brightener". I remember at the time thinking, "this doesn't smell like brightener", but it did lighten the stripped surface. In hindsight, I think it was a percarb cleaner that i used as a neutralizer, which would mean your conclusion about having alkaline remnants left in the wood would be dead-on. I think you may have solved this problem. So I am going to strip w/ efc38 and then apply copius amounts of neutr, rinse, and do half the deck w/ TWP and half with WTW (anyone have a gallon to part with? I dont care the color, just something natural looking. I'll send postage if someone has a left over gallon). Gonna be a fun test!

Thanks Rod, I'm with you, I'm surely pleased to be the guinea pig in this scenario rather than a paying (and talking) customer. Is performance like this what you expect with your SRD decks?? When you say 'one yr product', do you mean that it is 'gone' in one year, or just needs re-coated?? I've used SRD on plenty of decks (and a handful of homes) and have never had it perform this poorly.

So you'd strip this and not just percarb it?

Rod, Not really two coats, more of a wet on wet coat. The same way anyone would apply most anything i imagine. You spray a side of railing, then go back and re-mist and brush out. That is what I did. There was an area of a rail where i applied a small amount after the first coat had set up, and at that point it creates a film. That part actually looks fine. Believe me, if I thought I did something wrong to cause this I'd own up. But everything was done by their instrucitons, with the exception of that I didn't sand. Ken, I'd be happy to try the WTW on this. But this doesn't seem like an ideal job for a conditioner, does it?? I'd think that would be more for something like an untreated 10yr old fence or something. What do you think?

....since you mentioned it, I actually think i bought it specifically for this job. Stain was fresh. Good call though. Hey Jimbo Foley, any ideas for a treatment you'd like to see?? Maybe one of your pre-condition/stain jobs?? I'm for anything.

SRD is a one coat penetrating stain. Their other products perform totally differently, creating a heavy film. Any critiques are welcome. Perhaps you think I did something wrong?? I'm all ears. I'm anxious to try some new solutions for this deck.

And the winner is.......ehh, Beth was fairly close, pointing out the full exposure and all. Here's the deal: This is MY deck. My house was built in 96', I moved in this past May 1. Deck just looked grey and dry, but I used a low concentration of F18 to strip, and once I started stripping, I saw areas where stains had been tested in small spots, I saw about 5sf of CWF, etc. Deck boards were already cracked, warped, etc. This deck gets 100% sun, literally. Comes up on one side, goes down on the other, above the deck all day. Gets grill usage and abundant dog traffic from my two boxers and their friends. So I stripped this deck properly, brightened, dried, did not buff, and applied some left over Sikkens SRD/Natural Oak to the deck. I personally did it all, applied to saturation by brush with thorough backbrushing, allowed to soak for about 15 mintues, and re-applied to saturation. After awhile, I'd wipe up any shineys. I've appplied SRD to many decks, but never seen it perform this poorly. I know it gets extreme exposure, but were talking six months old here. I'm going to recoat it in the near future with my Gold Standard (TWP) and see how it performs under this condition and report back. It won't be really fair since the SRD had to work with the really dry wood, but it will still be interesting. Actually, if Russ or anyone else has some ideas of something they'd like to see me try, I'm all ears. I wouldn't object to doing half my deck with one thing, half with something else. Maybe I'll try a few different things. Don't question my white-trash credentials:)

I also like home/auto shows, but unless it comes to DVD, I just don't get around to watching it. I'd love to get a TIVO, but I'd watch so much TV I'd have trouble discerning reality from fiction. Scott, ...ah my friend, with those tools you'd be better suited for the Sopranos or the like. This guy is faaar more surgical--everything is sensory-related. But it would be cool to see him appear with a mace or something.:)

That does look cool, Celeste. What about this--could you attach the decking with a super-strong adhesive?? I have a cousin that builds cabinets and says the wood will break before the glue lets go....i dunno. Could you try it?? Worst case scenario--you have to come back later and install ss screws?? Struggling to find the downside to this idea---but I don't know of anyone that does it so I am sure there is one.:)

Tronman, My most unique add-on deviation has probably been babysitting for some customers. Seriously.

Tronman, I veer further from your intended question, what have you deemed to be the demographic of the people hiring you as a one-stop-shop?? Middle/upper, upper class, or high-end?? Curious, as I and another member of the board discussed this very thing the other day. He thought people liked the idea of OSS, while I tend to notice the high-end customer likes "the specialist." Anxious to see your take,

Great Question! For comedy, I'll agree with Ryan with "south Park". Truly, it has probably the most accurate social commentaries of any show on the tube. For drama, I'll third for "24". I cannot see how a human could actually watch this show week-to-week.....I'd go nuts. I wait for it to come out on DVD and then I choke it all down in about 2-3 days. I sure did miss Elisha Cuthbert this year--just not her role in the show:) A close 2nd place would be "Alias". Another nail-biter. I don't find Jennifer Garner the least bit attractive though, which is a negative. Favorite character is definitely Cartman, followed by the guy (Edwards) on "24" whose sole job is to torture information out of people. Seriously, he just stands outside the interrogation room with his briefcase full of torture instruments and waits to answer the call of duty. What a cool career.

LOL, you guys are gonna LOVE the answer! I'll wait for a couple more analysises (or whatever the plural for 'analysis' is)