Tonyg

I was hoping to donate the leftover WT to TGS as a contribution :lgwave: Now if you have AC laying around I will stock up

Terry, I was actually trying to go in the other direction. Its not that I don't like all of their colors but I think I would rather come up with some that are a bit more marketable (sorry Jake). I have found this spring that too many colors means inventory - and inventory can be expensive and turn into wasted money. I wanted 9 colors with 3 in each group. I cut up a 2x6 replacement board into 4in blocks and present them together in one tray. Ive found too many color choices, just like paint, can complicate decisions and this way I can limit what I need to keep on hand for custom mixing. I also can utilize the leftover cans better when I use a partial five. I still have about a gallon and a half of each of the WT colors taking up space. Ken, the CS looks really good but whenever I have used it I always think the same thing - too orange. It looks good and that and the Super Cedar are in my sample pack.

Thanks guys. I used a fairly strong NaOH solution to strip and added about 3.5%-4% SH because of the black in the WT. I was afraid it bred mildew under the stain. The neighbors fence was typical ugly cheap fence - never cleaned or stained. My PT fence did not discolor but the cyprus definitely changed over the week. I wasn't sure if the softer wood would change like that. I used a strong enough SH mix that I would think it wouldn't be residual mildew. I will wash again and try to stain it quickly. Is the discoloration on the cyprus "silvering" or is it is it a matter of the PH not being balanced? I know it looks bad now but it really did look fine last weekend and seemed to discolor more as the week went on. Will it make a difference if I juice up the Ox? I will order some citric next time I place a chem order. Is there a surfactant or buffer that can be added as well?

I'm happy that it has held up so well but I think I would go with a toner or Natural when it comes time. That almost looks like a semi-solid.

Shes a regular customer so I might give it a try. She hired someone a few years ago and they buthered the fron of the house with too much pressure. The liability talk scared me away a bit.

Be careful. This was a white brick house with stains & rust from the chimney cap. Sent pics in to Eacochem and the brick was "lime face". I had actually ordered a couple of small bottles of Safe Restore and another chem to do a test but never really pursued it. The lime is sitting on top and will come off with too harsh of a chem or too much pressure. Very sensative with huge liabilities and Eachochem cautioned use of anything. I did her deck but never got around to doing a test on the brick.

Wow! A quick look at the web site and a pound is going for $38! A small break to $30pd, or $150, for a 5lb bag. I would have to try it first before sinking that kind of price.

Starbucks Silawasi (sp)or 7-11 Brazilian Definitely wholebean

I believe they sell a sample pack

I do things a little backward I guess. I will cover/tape tight where needed but most walls will get covered "loosely" which will also cover the few inches of the wood next to the house - sometimes even using a 2x4 or rolled up runner at the bottom. I will spray a section, pull the plastic, and cut in when I back brush it. AC will lap if not careful but to me it is very forgiving and gives you time to work.

Mine has been 140sf-170sf on older wood and in the 200sf-215sf on newer wood

Dan, you have a tendancy to sometimes overcomplicate.. This is what I am talking about. In this case I did the bottom level and then the top level. The overspray from the top, although looked much better when dried, was still noticeable. I also noticed it in the Sequoia/Natural mix. It's always better to back brush by the way, and keep a wet edge.

Ive notice in the reds that it will lap in a way. Pretty easy to work with but you still need to be careful about going back on areas soaked in. It's not bad just noticeable. Didnt seem to have the same problem with the Super Cedar or the Cedar Semi

Although some areas such as the South/Southeast like SC, GA, MS would be considerably more humid, Mildew is hardly regional. If I had to compare NC/VA to the NE I would probably consider us to be anything but dry. I wasn't defending WT because I am planning on stripping my own fence today that was WHG turned Warm Honey black with the first year. I had considerable disapointment in the product. This job was an exception as the fence and porch looked pretty good - though I always hated that color. EDIT: Picture of the fence in the middle of stripping.

I did this porch in October 2007 with WT. HO called last week to have their gutters cleaned out and I was very pleasantly surprised. The water beaded, and although the pictures of the closeups doesn't show the true color, there was really no color fade or discoloration. This is a covered porch with limited sun.

I agree. The goal is to have a tool for sales and that would be only accomplished with the manufacturer. I would not send a customer/prospect to a bbs or really even to the supplier. Using TGS may also show favoritism to one brand and it seems there are several contractors that are loyal to other brands. This would also be another reason AC should think serious about it because it would help them to compete better

That's very kind of you. I'm just here to glean from this field of knowledge. I would like to be able to expand next year so it's time to work on the learning curve this year.

Just a suggestion - or a thought. I would consider a type of contest for each quarter or even monthly and instead of coughing up materials and other items of expense offer recognition instead. Though free stain is ALWAYS GOOD. If Jake would set up a page on his web site to promote his contractors this would be of more value than stain and sundries. Similar to the "Homearama" or "Parade of Homes" for builders this would be a page where the manufacturer could recognize several contractors by listing them on his site. Similar to the Alan Broom pics but I would dedicate a separate link. The advantage to the contractor would be a great sales tool that we could send the prospect a link to the stain and get some brownie points, that may seem more important than it really is to the prospect, but could make a great impression. The advantage to Armstrong-Clark would be samples of there stain being used on projects all around the country. Since it would be a contest you are bound to have some of the nicer projects being shown. Sort of an employee of the month mentality but pick three jobs/contractors and award the Gold/Silver/Bronze. This way when Celeste, Rick, or Rod throws some Purple Heart or Mahogany decks out there it wouldn't discourage low-life's like me from still posting for the Bronze. You would get more participation and it would mean long/longer term benefits for everyone all around. It could be billed as a national contest and give some PR to the contractors. Just a thought. On a side note: I know all of the color mixing has been somewhat of an oddity for Jake but he should take advantage of it. Promoting color mixing opens up tremendous potential and makes it possible to increase the product line without doing anything. A page with color samples from decks/projects from the contractors would be very useful to tie all of the bbs' together when searching for a color. That way if I wanted to know what Rustic Brown/Cedar Tone looks like I don't have to go looking through Jason's posts - I could stop in at the ArmClark.com and see his picture along with others on a separate page. This would also be beneficial for both contractor and manufacturer - the featured color (with contractor) would be listed, other contractors could see it without having to play chemist mixing colors, and Armstrong Clark and suppliers would benefit with more exposure and closer ties with their end users.

I'm not allowed to watch anymore. My son tried out in Philly a couple of years ago. It was a little bit of a sham. Thousands upon thousands show up for the first weekend. They pick 50 I think make it to the audition for Randy, Simon, and whats her name and are told to come back the next weekend. That means that those guys that are really really bad - they are told they they made it and have to foot the expense to stay in the city for the week or have to make the trip from out of town. More production than reality.

Most of the decks I have done have been significantly older wood/decks. The deck I am doing this week is PTP approx 2yrs old with quality lumber but had heavy mildew caused from an abundance of shade from trees that were just cut down. I have only done one other deck this age and experienced the same problems. The problem I am having is the wood is very splotchy with grey areas especially around the summer ring marks and knots, almost a brighter patina in color in those areas. Also, stains from heavy mildew or pot rings that did not come up. I am using a Deckster and used a light NaOH that I think would be equivalent to about 3oz per gallon, SH of about 3% (plus washed with house wash prior), and then neutralized with Ox at 6oz per gallon. I did get some furring so I don't "think" my mix was too weak. The boards had beveled cuts so I used a 25 degree tip at around 470psi and a 65degree tip at under 1000psi to hit the bevels. I washed it yesterday and today it looked terrible and had to do significant sanding to get the wood presentable. I will be staining tomorrow. I feel like I am not handling the age of the wood right. The last deck that I had these problems with was very cheap lumber and using Wood Tux. Other than the problems the decks could not be different. Is there anything I should be doing differently with these type decks?? I would have attached pics but my computer just deleted the before and after pics of my last two jobs during the download from my camera somehow.

Rick, I tried to talk him out of it since he changed his mind from a Cedar Tone to the Red/White after he saw the pics from the first 2-tone deck I did last month. I didn't want to do a mini-me deck. The Sequoia/Natural was a compromise. I was able to recover the pics from the cleaning so I thought I would post what I was talking about. I did sand it out clean before it was stained but these are from after the cleaning. Not enough chems? Not enough pressure? Or is that the best I could expect?

I'll take encouragement any day. Thanks! I was painting their kitchen yesterday and it was a little embarrassing when looking out the window the HO made the comment "looks like you need to clean some of it again" :thinking: I could tell when I was sanding that it was closing some of the grain up by trying to get out the blemeshes but it would have looked bad either way. I need to get a few more of these under my belt.

Here are the samples for the mix. One side Sequoia and the other the 50/50 mix. I believe I will use that when the HO wants a red instead of even offering the semi-solid. Just gives a nicer finish with more grain showing through and it really isn't a big difference in color. These are samples on some boards I replaced on another deck. I needed some old wood samples for a more realistic customer choice so I wouldn't have anymore surprises when comparing it to my new wood samples.

Thanks for the replies! Buffing was not enough to get a good finish. I had to use a floor sander and then still hit many spots by hand. It wasn't a matter of getting stain to soak in but to get the pre-stain finish more of a consistent. James I think "The areas that are grey have not degraded enough to come off" I think is the best answer for what I was looking at but a stronger mix wouldn't help? I know I would fur it up a lot more but would that clean it better? Stained it today and outside of a few spots that were lighter because of some spot sanding it came out OK. I think the color helped as well. This is a 50/50 mix of Sequoia and Natural which gave a nice semi-transparent with about twice the pigment of a semi-trans.

I define protection as a coating or sealant that can minimize UV damage, minimize moisture penetration that is also permeable enough to allow escape, and minimize external pollutants. Solid stain will last longer than typical penetrating stains both in color and protection. This is fact - whether one likes them or not. UV, climate, and moisture will do more than damage the top 1mil of wood. Splitting, cracking, splintering, cupping, etc. will all result from the lack of protection. I also doubt many want to resurface their decks every year an thus damage will occur when the sealer/coating begins to fail or lose it's effectiveness. I believe you were even unhappy with your own deck that you have done every year. With a solid coating many will "simply set it and forget it" like it was an infomercial and outside of washing it periodically it should last 5 years or more. I disagree that it offers "utterly no protection" and a solid deck can look good. Solid stains can be applied without stripping every third year. If you have overall adhesion then problem areas can be sanded, primed, and recoated with great results and longevity. In your OPINION solid stains may be inferior but I disagree. In my opinion MOST of the time they may not be aesthetically appealing but they do serve a purpose on neglected wood and verticals but they can also look very nice. They don't always turn out to be "peely messes" What? It's ok that you have such a strong opinion but that does not make it the only correct answer. Dogmatic statements ruling out all other possibilities sometimes makes it hard to tell but in the end - it's still just your opinion - and we all have one one.