topcoat

You guys are playing Gilligans Island, this is Survivor.

You're killing me.

The final two would be obvious.

I am very interested in the responses. And I intentionally didnt include women because that would have seriously skewed the results (unfair advantage).

Certainly is Dan. The pw industry is quite a show though. There are not characters like this in the entire history of literature.

Ok, your in. Lets see what your fellow survivors have to say about that.

Yup. Well, my employees do anyway.

Its snowing here. I'm sitting by the fire eating christmas cookies listening to "Glory Days".

Oh for sure. Between steroids, changes in the core of the balls themselves and players being afraid of injury, its not the same game. Ricky Henderson was the man in the 80's. He took a couple of years off his career stealing all those bases. He was the first 4 million dollar man. Now that is about the average. So, guys want 10-20 mil.

I dont see whats so spectacular about this thread, other than the fact that at least we arent talking about 501c technicalities.

I remembered a post from last year where you mentioned your speed. I used to be fast. I was the leadoff hitter on my high school baseball team and set the school single season record for stolen bases at 27 in 16 games, which still stands to this day. That was in 1984. In 25 years, no kid has come along to break it. I think its the obesity plague of the current generation.

Dan What is your 40' yard dash time these days?

JF I didnt even know you were a fellow painter. Nice! I like the new avatar btw.

Ok so is this some sort of alternate universe? Daniel Tambasco is optimistic, and everyone else is gloom and doom? Huh. I must be dreaming.

The Mystery Machine! Scooby Doooby Dooo where are you??

I did an interior painting estimate for woman in her late 30s who owns a 35 year old house that she and her husband have been in for 6 years and never hired a contractor for anything before. She told me she was getting 3 estimates, showed me the scope of work, asked me what I thought it would cost. I told her I would put together the formal estimate and email it but off the top of my head it appeared to be in the $2700-3000 range, but dont quote me on it yet. She almost fell over, telling me that her husband had gotten an estimate of $900 for the same work from a painter whose wife had recently lost her job, and this painter thought that he and his wife could easily do the work in 2 days at that price. I explained to her everything that was wrong with that proposal, and she said "how am I going to explain this to my husband, I really want to use you." Before I emailed the estimate she emailed me and asked if I could think of any way to get the price down. I said that a reduction in the scope of work would be the best way, maybe take out one of the bedrooms or the 18 doors or something. She said that would not be possible. After some back and forth, I expressed to her that I did not think that my company would be a good fit for her needs, that I was going to decline to submit the estimate, but that I would be happy to advise her via email on her selection or come in as a paid consultant to inspect the process and finished product if she chose a low priced painter. Two days later she sent a brief email. We have decided to hire you. Please call me to schedule. We are doing the work this week. Good customer.

Dan I am not going to say what your volume was, but you know that I know, and it is not enough of a sample to build a model around. Did you work 200 man hours this year? If your goal is to work as little as possible and make as much per hour as possible, you are right on. If your goal is to build a sustainable business that is more of an entity than yourself running out doing jobs when you get them, you might re evaluate. Having said that, I think you are perfectly happy with what you have and that is all that matters. I think sometimes people read your posts as high horse reverse snobbery coming from someone who hasnt figured out how to build a business. If your business is what you wanted, who cares.

Dan People above $250k consider it a given that the service is going to benefit them. What they are more concerned about is the people who they enter into financial transactions and business relationships with, as well as to whom they give access to their property. First impressions are important. The first thing they see is your truck pulling in, and you getting out.

When I go to an estimate, I am sizing up the customer as much as they are sizing me up. Would they be a good person to deal with in a financial transaction? Can they afford my service? Do they seem to be honest and reasonable in what they are seeking from me? Are they listening to me as much as I am listening to them? It is a two way street. I think Dan is focused on one side of the relationship and holds some preconceived notions based on a microcosm that is flawed, and people detect this on the first meeting. What you are describing fits with my experience in dealing with people. And often, it is the female in the house who is requesting the estimate and writing the check.

Nice truck!

Dan Again, I dont think you are basing your conclusions on enough of a sample. Your gross sales, based on many of your posts, are clearly well under $100k. Many of the guys here are talking about patterns that emerge in the $250-750k volume range, I would think. Different strategies come into play at different levels. You are thinking and speaking in terms of "me me me" and that is fine. Just about anyone out here ought to be able to sustain a workload and decent margin to support 2000 man hours per year. Ramp that up to 3, 5, 10 guys and things are very different. Your marketing, estimating, selling, execution, cash flow all changes and for the better. So, no, I dont need my truck to make the phone ring. It is a visual manifestation as part of an integrated plan. It contributes within the overall marketing for sure, but there is no "hey I am behind you on Rt 7, you paint interiors?". I dont want that or need that. If my reality was $60k per year in sales, it would probably become more of a critical component. I have bought our last 3 trucks new. Most recently in '07. If anyone here has a business that has established significant enough credit to purchase new, and at 0% in recent years, why wouldnt they take advantage of the opportunity to use someone elses money for free rather than dumping even $5k of their own money into a truck that will require immediate and ongoing maintenance? Your van isnt that bad Dan. You said yourself earlier that you dont give a hoot, and I know that deep down inside you see the humorous side of it. I think its kind of cool, but it wouldnt fit with the image that I want my business to convey. Its quirky, which some people will appreciate, but as Rick mentioned, you have to really know your demographic and what their perceptions are. For a middle of the road demographic, they will embrace your presentation, thinking "hey this guy is keeping his costs down and I am not paying for him to drive a sweet truck." Consumers of higher financial standing have a different take. They are more likely to think "this guy wants us to pay him $68/hr and this is the level of financial responsibility and reinvestment into his business that we would be supporting?" Your customers are investing in you. Show them something worth investing in.

Are you guys going to work together on a job?

If this is true, its gotta be a supply and demand experiment, which I have actually thought about doing. Chris, if you think about it, if you are a painter and you refuse to paint, you limit the supply of your craft to the consumer. Theoretically, demand would go up in response to the limited supply, if the dynamics were right you could name your price. So you take a loss leader like gutter cleaning, which you know you cant build a business around but you can make decent but limited money at, and you get your leads that way, park a truck in the yard that says PAINTING on it and if there is crossover, you could play very hard to get and perhaps land at a very desirable price point. Its a cool idea from a business standpoint, but from a practical standpoint my wife would surely kick me out of the house.

As much as I like Dan, it is frustrating when you are right in the middle of a discussion and the dude just disappears. Sometimes for days. And I know what you're gonna say Chris, he's probably pulling up some video footage of fenway park and studying the signs or something like that, which is a really good point actually. The signage at fenway park is geared to a very captive audience. Thats more in johnthepaInters realm.