Rfitz

That is kind of Tricky, because your net is your net, however, you must also include in your net, monies set aside for equipment and vehicle replacement this stuff doesnt last forever, and it isnt cheap to replace either, also in most folks replies are they including health care for family, retirement, etc.. or is that included in the biz expense column..? If all of the above is included in your net I believe it would be hard to make it on under $100K-$150K a year also you have to make the money for the off months which for me is 2-3 months, usually Dec. Jan, Feb which means you should be billing at least $200K a year, because your expenses will eat up at least 50% of your gross, and that doesnt include retirement, college funds, emergency funds, equipment and vehicle replacement with all of that maybe closer to $225K + a year, we are close to that now however it took 5 years and alot of aspirin, If the business doesnt grow much much more in the next 1-3 years I may want to sell as well, or at least diversify into other income streams, this is way to physically demanding, and a ton of headaches to do for less than $100K a year, Just my Opinion Hope this he;ps

That older woman should have checked his references first, anyway, we charge approx. $295 -$395 for your average 2000 -3000 sq ft house and by no means do we get all the bids but we do alot of house washing at those prices, as most wood restortaion contractors here do not offer that service, we also give the price over the phone based on the size of the home they tell us it is, and if they are not telling us the truth, we will adjust the price accordingly, and most are ok with that..

I primarily use 2 products to stain and seal wood with, 1 is Ready Seal and the other is Wood Defender, this is what I have found after several hundred decks, Wood Defender claims to have double the solids than Ready Seal, if this the case, wouldnt the stain last alot longer especially with a hint of acrylic in it as well not much maybe 1%, the problem I was having with Ready Seal was customers last year and beyond were complaining that with Ready seal, their deck was staying oily on the surface for months on end like when they tried and set their hands on the rail they would get a oily residue on their hands and this was months after I sealed them, but even months later the color on dropped by maybe 10-15% after I applied the second coat.. The problem I am having with wood defender is the color looks as though it is fading 30-40% even after only a month, not so much on the horizontals but especially on the verticles, the horizontals though were still lighter by say 25-30% even after 1-2 months anybody out there have this same experience with wood defender..? THX

Before we get to winter, yet, we still have a good 8 + weeks left of good weather, but for some reason it seems like this fall has been unusually slow here, has anyone else felt the pinch, we are usually alot busier in Sept. Oct and it has really slacked off, compared with the last 3-5 years..???

I would have to agree with the earlier post about getting a really crappy ,lazy, sloppy worker, thinking, hoping they would get alot better, they usually get worse, so what I do now is tell, all new employees, they basically have a 2 week probation period, just to see if this is for them, really it is for me to see if they lied on their application, about how much experience they say they have, also the last lazy piece of crap I just fired a couple weeks ago I kept on 6 months too long, at least on evry call back he would have to do on his own time, he was getting to the point of working 10-15 hours a week for FREE, keep in mind this clown has has 5 kids with 3 different women, now is married living with his mother, in her basement, and was always asking for time off, weekends off, getting off early at least 1 day a week etc.. I should have fired him in april or may, but like an idiot I felt sorry for this clown.. oh well , live and learn

at least for us, we have been fairly busy since march, doing OK not great, or even close but OK, luckily we landed a few commercial jobs in august and that helped carry the load, but residential in august usually sucks, that is when I schedule my maintenenace jobs from existing customers from past years.. What hurts our industry the most is newbies, start - ups.. and this applies to everyone on this board, so you all better perk your ears up and pay attention to what I will try and explain to you, because it affects us all, all the time every month, every year, and forever.. until legislature changes our business.. Most new guys buy a $500 power washer, a small Pick up, and sya Im now in biz as a pw company, they wash houses for $125.00 and decks for $400 BIG ones, soon they lose money, screw customers, and go out of business, within a year or less, then when that same customer calls a proffessional company like us and realizes that their deck will, cost 5-8 times what that newbie charged FREAK OUT at our bid, but that is for quality work, insured, bonded etc.. and will look for that next sucker newbie to get their deck done for as cheap as possible, or house wash, and get screwed again by cheesy low down crappy work, until we can get rid of these idiots we are doomed as an industry, just my opinion, for example look at lawyers or doctors, pricing, they are educated and know what it cost's to run a biz, therefore their pricing is all similar, Hope this helps...

Some Interesting Statistics.... From the L.A Times: 1. 40% of all workers in L.A. County (L.A. County has 10 million people) are working for cash and not paying taxes. This was because they are predominantly illegal immigrants, working without a green card. 2. 95% of warrants for murder in Los Angeles are for illegal aliens. 3. 75% of people on the most wanted list in Los Angeles are illegal aliens. 4. Over 2/3 of all births in Los Angeles County are to illegal alien Mexicans on Medi-Cal, whose births were paid for by taxpayers. 5. Nearly 25% of all inmates in California detention centers are Mexican nationals here illegally. 6. Over 300,000 illegal aliens in Los Angeles County are living in garages. 7. The FBI reports half of all gang members in Los Angeles are most likely illegal aliens from south of the border. 8. Nearly 60% of all occupants of HUD properties are illegal. 9. 21 radio stations in L.A. are Spanish speaking. 10. In L.A. County 5.1 million people speak English. 3.9 million speak Spanish (10.2 million people in L.A. County). (All the above from the Los Angeles Times) Less than 2% of illegal aliens are picking our crops, but 29% are on welfare. Over 70% of the United States' annual population growth (and over 90% of California, Florida, and New York) results from immigration. The cost of immigration to the American taxpayer in 1997 was, (after subtracting taxes immigrants pay), a NET $70 BILLION a year, [Professor Donald Huddle, Rice University]. The lifetime fiscal impact (taxes paid minus services used) for the average adult Mexican immigrant is a NEGATIVE number. 29% of inmates in federal prisons are illegal aliens. If they can come to this country to raise Hell and demonstration by the thousands, Why can't they take charge over the corruption in their own country? THE U.S. VS MEXICO: On February 15, 1998, the U.S. and Mexican soccer teams met at the Los Angeles Coliseum. The crowd was overwhelmingly pro-Mexican even though most lived in this country. They booed during the National Anthem and U.S. flags were held upside down. As the match progressed, supporters of the U.S. team were insulted, pelted with projectiles, punched and spat upon. Beer and trash were thrown at the U.S. players before and after the match. The coach of the U.S. team, Steve Sampson said, "This was the most painful experience I have ever had in this profession." Did you know immigrants from Mexico and other non-European countries can come to this country and get preferences in jobs, education, and government contracts? It's called affirmative action or racial privilege. The Emperor of Japan or the President of Mexico could migrate here and immediately be eligible for special rights unavailable for Americans of European descent. Recently, a vote was taken in the U.S. Congress to end this practice. It was defeated. Every single Democratic senator except Ernest Hollings voted to maintain special privileges for Hispanic, Asian and African immigrants. They were joined by thirteen Republicans. Bill Clinton and Al Gore have repeatedly stated that they believe that massive immigration from countries like Mexico is good. They have also backed special privileges for these immigrants. Corporate America has signed on to the idea that minorities and third world immigrants should get special, privileged status. Some examples are Exxon, Texaco, Merrill Lynch, Boeing, Paine Weber, Starbucks and many more. DID YOU KNOW?: Mexico regularly intercedes on the side of the defense in criminal cases involving Mexican nationals? Did you know that Mexico has NEVER extradited a Mexican national accused of murder in the U.S. in spite of agreements to do so? According to the L.A. Times, Orange County, California is home to 275 gangs with 17,000 members; 98% of which are Mexican and Asian. How's your county doing? According to a New York Times article dated May 19, 1994, 20 years after the great influx of legal immigrants from Southeast Asia, 30% are still on welfare compared to 8% of households nationwide. A Wall Street Journal editorial dated December 5, 1994 quotes law enforcement officials as stating that Asian mobsters are the "greatest criminal challenge the country faces." Not bad for a group that is still under 5% of the population. Is education important to you? Here are the words of a teacher who spent over 20 years in the Los Angeles School system. "Imagine teachers in classes containing 30-40 students of widely varying attention spans and motivation, many of whom aren't fluent in English. Educators seek learning materials likely to reach the majority of students and that means fewer words and math problems and more pictures and multicultural references." WHEN I WAS YOUNG: I remember hearing about the immigrants that came through Ellis Island. They wanted to learn English. They wanted to breathe free. They wanted to become Americans. Now, far too many immigrants come here with demands. They demand to be taught in their own language. They demand special privileges--affirmative action. They demand ethnic studies that glorify their culture. HOW CAN YOU HELP? Send copies of this letter to at least two other people, 100 would be even better.

Do all biz owners need it YES For Sure, unfortunately in this line of work you cant have it and be compmetetitive, just the facts, people do not care if you have it and will not pay the extra for carrying, sorry if I busted anyones bubble just the facts mam..???

Unfortunately, as a business owner you really cant compute that , at least in this trade, there are so many variables, each job can vary so much in how much you actually charge hourly for a typical job, sometimes I average $250 an hour and other times I only make $75 an hour, then you have to deduct all your employees hours per job, chems used, fuel, advertising, insurance etc.. basically you have to go on gross sales, deduct expenses and that is basically what you bring home, there are just too many variables in this biz to say ok I make a flat....$ amount per hour per year.. what I can tell you is this after our year is over, after all the major headaches of running your own biz, I aim for somewhere between $100 and $125 an hour NET 40 hours a week for say 35-45 weeks after all expenses have been paid, if you arent making at least that per hour I find with the hours, headaches etc.. it is hardly worth the effort... I hope this helps

I am sorry you are not busy, but so far we are swamped, through who knows when..??? anyway, all I can tell you is ADVERTISE, spend spend and then spend some more, especially Yellow Pages, newspaper etc..at least 10% of gross sales on Yellow pages it will pay off big 1-2-3 years down the road... you must spend in order to make, it is natures law.. Hope this helps....

The way I see it now is a win win situation for you the biz owner and the company you might do work for, basically, you have 2 options, either take it away from your workers hourly pay, (which is what I will do ) or add it on to each job which in most cases wont work, because most if not all customers are looking for the highest level of quality work at the absolute cheapest price in town, most customers of mine at least if they new my hourly rate would puke, $175 and up. although they dont see all the hidden cost of a small business owner, and most wouldnt believe you even if you showed them all your overhead cost, they would still believe you pocket / profit every penny of every hour you work / bill / charge etc.. and if were really really lucky we might net 40% of gross sales at the end of the year, and even that is a stretch, unfortunately you have to keep a microscope on each worker on each job, that is why it is hard to get big in this business, it is not easily duplicateable.. I find I have to be at almost every job, or something somewhere will fet Fuc$#@!&* up... almost always

No I did not to all your questions, I was told in the beginning, just the front sidewalk, and then all the rules changed, so as each store started adding more and more for the price, I would either add on the extra amount or drop the store if they didnt agree, which most didnt, so thank god for me it didnt last long, and I really didnt lose any money, because I basically told them as I went along I was billing them hourly $95 so if they added work, I added money, they were real good at manipulating vendors all vendors, it is how they keep their cash flow looking real high, anyway I am just glad I learned a valuble lesson, and get contracts signed, and that is something they wont do, no contracts, no long terms, so basically they hold all the cards, and the cash so to speak, it gets too confusing you would just have to experience it, that was a few years back at least 4-5 maybe things have changed by now Im not sure, nor do I want to find out

Dont waste your time with commercial property mngmt., at least that was my experience, and here is an example of a highly profitable, DEBT FREE company that has a store on every corner in the country,,, WALGREENS, we landed their accounts, for about 3-6 months it was a total of about 40 stores all within 40-60 miles of each other and they all wanted 1 c leaning a month, which included all gum removal, and cleaning the front sidewalks and trash cans, removing dirt and oil from drive thru pharmacy's area, cleaning out dumpster pads and picking up all the trash that was on the ground back there, plus washing all their loading dock concrete pads, average price they were willing to pay was $95.00 per store MAX, and you had to bill each store individually, which took hours each moneth for all the paper work, and then most took at least 90-120 days to get payed on, or they would say there store was never cleaned and you never got payed, it;s the store managers word, against yours, and to make things even worse, it was all 3 rd shift work you couldnt start any store before 12:00 midnite.. Anyway, I just thought I would help alot of you not waste your time and energy chasing these companies around.. to do alot of work for such little pay now maybe you know why all The Quick Trips in the country pay their own employees $7-$8 an hour to power wash their stores Hope This Helps..

I tell these freaking morons my hourly rate starts at $175 an hour and goes way up from there and that doesnt include chems , stain etc... and that usually convinces them to sign up there if not Im tell them to go to you know where, because this work is hard as hell, not mention all our cost are very high.and most people are very lazy and cheap thank GOD, because next year my prices are going up 50% per hour and my prices are going up 40% for material. and dont ever believe people cant afford us even at $350 an hour they cant afford not to have us

Claims, complaints, call backs etc.. it is all relevant in the amount of jobs you do in a given year / season obviously if company A does 500 jobs a year, and company B does 100 jobs a year, more than likely Company A will have more call backs, complaints claims etc.. That is why on the back of my contracts I have about 50 reasons how we are not responsible for about 95% of things that could possibly happen on any given job, and they sign the estimate before we perform any work, and most 99% never read the fine print, for example we did a pretty big job for a client last week and she keeps complaining about her windows having hardwater spots on her windows, I tried to go back and wash off but since they are on a well, we could wash her windows every day with our soap and low pressure and no matter how much we rinse, the hardwater spots will still be there. and she wants me to pay for a window washing company to come out and wash all her windows inside and out, I laughed and said no way .. I never told her her windows would be spotless after we did her house and decks, and most people realize they need to have their windows washed after we are done.. Anyway she threatened to call the BBB, I said go ahead, you signed the disclosure section stating we are not responsible for water spots or run off due to work process, it is just the nature of the business, not to mention I gave her over $800 in Freebees just to get the stupid job, and here she wants more, sometimes you have to stand your ground and just say no, oltherwise customers like this will drive you crazy, you can still be polite but be firm, and say, we did everything we could, and now we are finished.. Have A Great Day

When interviewing possible people, I always give them the choice .. either employee or sub contractor, now the difference is about $4.00 an hour so most if not all want to be subs, and I have them sign waivers, aggreements etc.. stating so, now I hope it all pans out if something were to happen, but you never know in this litigation happy society we live in...?

Unfortunately, My 3rd and 4th title is BABYSITTING, I can tell my subs/ employees how to do something or not to do something, and I'll be damned when I return in 4-5-6 hours after going on bids jobs whatever, that I see 5-10-20 mistakes literally, so I have to constantly babysit and watch their every move, or trust me they will Fuc$#^%&!@@ it up, and it will be another call back, and what is funny although they know they will be going back for FREE on their own time they just dont give a shi^%&%$#$%$^%...? it is amazing,now hwta is crazy, is I dont just make them work for FREE on call backs but they also have to pay me for all expenses occured while on the call back, so maybe it's only 3 hours to them, but I then charge them back $$3-$500 bucks for that call back, becasue that is billable time I am losing, and they wonder why at times their check is short $ 500 and then I explain why it cost me $500 for that call back, and then they realize they just worked 40 hours that week for FREE... AND THEY STILL DONT GET IT...? FOR A 3-4 HOUR CALL BACK nor do they care, you wouldd think after 2-3 of those weeks they would get it, but they dont... Go Figure, but I guess in time they will a 2 hour call back cost them 3 days pay Hello, wake up you get it now...??

It's all in technique, I can brush / Roll/ Spray decks fences etc.. all day long and go out for dinner in a nice restaraunt right after, same clothes and no one would even know what I did for a living.. However, my subs after working all day look as though they showered in stain for hours, and I do 3 times the sq ft per hour than they do... go figure... Employees / Subs you gotta love these folks, sometimes I wonder where their minds are, I would guess in the gutter, no pun intended...

Salesmanship is my strong point, however I see alot of stain on siding, patios, etc etc.. so whether they did it or a company did it, it really doesnt matter, they percieve brushing and rolling is better, safer, more bang for their buck, so to speak, plus 2 coats horizontal surfaces, sanding horizontal surfaces, striiping, brightening, back house wash, these are just a few in my arsenal of out selling the competition, we are by far at the high end of the price scales for deck restoration in our area, but we are doing 5-6 steps more than the competiton, so are we higher priced I ask..? and usually the customer will look at me confused, and say well you are double the price, of whoever, but you are also doing 5 times the work, so in actuality we are cheaper arent we I ask..? and they shake their head yes while signing the estimate,, it is all about perception, although we are better than most anyone here locally, in wood restoration, people percieve they are spending their money wisely when using us... and I do think they are, and that comes across when I am closing 15-30 deals a week

Im not saying that spraying and then brushing into the wood is bad, my point was stating that just spraying and never working stain into wood is not the greatest way to seal wood, and believe it or not a 2000 sq ft deck is not that big, at least for us it isnt, I can do a 2000 sq ft deck brush and roll my self in 1 day so if I had 2 guys experineced, they could stain 2 of those a day easily, while Im out washing or stripping 2-3 more to stain the following day, we average 5-10 decks per week 3 guys total and maybe another 8-12 house wash's and then some of our commercial work we fit in as well, it is all about organization and scheduling, and keeping a whip on your workers.. Literally

I noticed in the post by Beth and Rod he was spraying, we would not get alot of jobs if we were to spray, when I tell my potential customers we brush and roll all their wood, that usually seals the deal, most of our competetion sprays and alot of our customers have had damage in the past from other compaines spraying, I know it takes longer, but regardless of the product as long as it is a commercial grade product, Ready Seal, Wood Defender, Wood Tux etc.. your finished product will look so much better, one of the hardest things I have to re-teach the painters I hire is that staining decks and painting drywall etc etc.. are miles apart and in no way the same, I see their mistakes everyday, I try and teach them you have to physically work the stain into the wood with the end of the brush not the side of the brush, and spraying wont do the same as that either,.. and I do not have to be at the site all day while they are staining decks, they can be staining while Im out stripping decks, house washing or whatever.. because I know and I tell them I know the average person can average 150 sq ft per hour of staining, so If I come back in say 4 hours, and there are 2 of you, you both better have a combined 1200 sq ft stained, or they start to lose money, because they are subs that work for/with me by the hour, as long as they can do the neccessary work in due time, if not their hourly drops according to the job, and after 30 days all call backs are done on their time not mine.. Just thought I would share what works for me.. Have A Great Day...

Rick and Beth, Im not following either on that post to me about maintenance jobs..? am I missing something..? although I just finished another 14 hour day which is getting tiresome, so maybe my brain is a little slow this late..? anyway please explain yourself about the maintenance thing..? I am averaging about 80% of repeat customers scheduling the 3 year maint. program, basically I charge approx. 80% of the original price of stripping, brightening, sanding 2 coats ready seal etc..etc.. which is awesome it takes maybe 1/5th the time to wash and 1/2 or less the time to stain/seal and not to mention less than 1/2 of stain/sealer, so now is when the profit margins go sky high, maintenance on existing customers decks, and house washing is very profitable, I would love to only wash houses, buildings etc.. forever and never touch a stain brush, but that isnt going to happen, especially with getting more and more into the very large commercial contracts we are getting.. Hopefully that is where this business will lead us permanately, where we are at one job site 1-2-3 + months if not longer and have only 3-5 clients instead of 500-1000 residential...?

Im sure wood Tux Wet is a good product, I used the original formula Wood Tux over 3 years ago on several jobs, and it has held up well as I have went back and looked at a few, If the weather pattern doesnt change by Friday, I will try wood Tux Wet on some jobs, next week, what colors are basically the same as Ready Seal's Natural Cedar..?

I may have to break down and try wood tux wet if weather doesnt start cooperating here, we are 15 decks backed up at the moment, some have been washed as far back as 2 weeks ago, we just keep washing more and more everyday, we cant stop our biz just because it rains everyday, we can wash strip etc.. every day regardless of rain but we just keep getting more and more backed up because we need DRY days to start staining, although the customers do understand, when it does start to dry out of course they will all want theirs done first which of course they will be in line according to when they were washed, etc.. I guess my question regarding wood tux is, if it rains on say monday, and we stain on tuesday with wood tux and then it rains again a few hours after staining will the stain hold up, in other words lets say its wet when we stain it, and then rains right after will that impair its looks, longevity etc..??? at least with RS and wood defender if it rains lets say 8-10 after application it doesnt really affect it, the wood is sealed and water proof although the deck is 12% moisture content or less when we apply it....

The nice thing about RS, is it stays wet for a few days, any butyl soap full strength on that let sit 30 min to 1 hour should have got it up, and HD 80 is stronger than butyl so you shouldnt have a stain when returning, if you do keep applying HD 80 let sit for an hour or 2 and dont let it dry, then hi pressure off hot water, I clean trex decks all the time, I use stripper with hot water, its the only thing that will get these decks clean, cleaning trex is as tough as stripping behr stain from wood decks, so I charge the same for both, problem is people think trex is maint free, and really they are worse they need 2-3 cleanings a year