plainpainter

So there is this guy in my area - and he is professional in the sense that he has all the equipment of a pro - has been in business in landscaping and pressure washing for 15+ years - but his pricing is soooo ridiculously low. You think it would make sense to reach out to the guy and invite him to join these forums? I am thinking maybe he would become better educated and not leave all sorts of crazy money on the table. What do you all think?

So I got this house washing job and deck staining. And I get the call yesterday that 'the side of the house with the green' - you know the infamous side of a home that spruce trees were growing next to and finally got cut down - and the whole side of a home with vinyl is green. Well - this was a borderline cheap customer, and now I got a complaint that there is a green 'cast' - but that you can't see it from up close, but from down the road when you are driving. Can you believe it? So I called and told them I would hit it again for them no problem, what else am I suppose to do? And can you believe another professional low-balled this job? I've always gotten those 'green' sides perfectly clean - and I thought this time was no different. I will have to go and take a look. I am thinking in the future of charging double my normal 'rate' for these green sides - if this is how it's going to be.

I went back today and re-washed that wall - it wasn't 100%. And I did get it cleaner - still not sure it's 100% but I threw in some butyl as well into my mix. And brushed half the side in front of they guy. In the end he was a very satisfied customer. And now I can say that the vinyl hasn't aged because it was on the dark side and under 'green' - so it didn't have any UV discoloration - but now the trees are cut down and the side is clean - that will change. I am glad I went back and re-did it, even chatted with the guy for a half hour afterwards.

discounting a $100 was your first mistake. Customers that pay full boat ride either a.) don't complain like cheapos do, or b.) they pay so well, you don't mind doing extras or coming back for a few details.

I just can't say how much I love Jarrod's responses - quick to the point, and always classic. I should this guy a DVD of Rosco's classic pricing program - whipper schnapper.

Rod, thanks for the advice. I think if anything - you know those homes that have gone way too long between cleanings - and not matter how much you rinse - there is some 'stuff' that leaches out from behind the siding after you leave. I think that is what they may be complaining about.

I went back and checked today - and I am literally stumped. I think I may buy one of those hose attachment house cleaners - and give that side a dousing, instead of a hauling a trailer for nothing. I swear to god some of these folks think it's all fun and games - that it's absolutely free for me haul a 1600lb trailer plus equipment. And I noticed it's the 'cheapos' too - they're the worst - they'll see stuff that isn't even there. My guess is that the sap/green stains on the north side protected the vinyl from oxidation - so with the right time of day and the sun hitting it right - you can probably see a difference in sheen. I looked this morning - literally stumped as to what they're seeing.

Ok - I will be posting some of my longevity results of Russell Cissel's WTW products. Here is the background. Had a slow period - so I ended up doing yard work and landscaping for a friends mother for cheap. I also painted some trim on her house - and then paid some attention to this little step. It was built for my friends father who had suffered a stroke for which that concrete slab was too high for him to step - so they put this intermediate step in. It was like 2 years old when I washed it. I basically had some 'swill' at the bottom of 5'er that was my from 'paint-prep' job a week prior - If I had an inch left over - I would be lying. So I basically added water to it - because there wasn't enough to coat this one step, and just brushed it hard for like 15 minutes with a bleach/TSP/nonylphenol mix - my blend. The bleach was probably 0.15% in strength - the reason it took a full 15 of brushing - but I hosed rinsed it off - no pressure washer - and it looked absolutely clean. And while sobbing wet - took out the remainder of some Fall of '06 formula and brushed it into the soaking sobbing wet wood - the stain was just pi$$ yellow as I was applying it. And then I ran - and this was done late June of '07. And as you can see - the step looks absolutely beautiful - for what it is. But the stain is beautifully intact and looks ready for another year. I will have to recheck another deck that I used the same stain from the same pail - to see if I gave it too quick of a judgement. But anyways - this is the product of total 'ghetto' in-the-hood prep job, and this is the result. This was just filler work, helping out a friends mom on fixed income. But it has taught me something - I sometimes do my best work, when I am not fussing all over something. And this was a bleach clean - no pressure rinse and certainly no brightener. Enjoy....

Thank God, my faith in woodtux has been renewed! I am looking forward to a lucrative deck restoration business this year.

Yes - but for how much longer, Scott?

Ken - this one step has reaffirmed my belief in it's durability - again I will revisit this other customer deck and look more carefully. Perhaps I passed it off without careful examination. And as well - I dont believe my methods were that bad - in comparison they both got a 'bleach' wash - and the step got the weaker of the two in terms of bleach percentage, and to boot was not 'neutralised' by the addition of an acid treatment. And the step was as wet as any wood right after a drenching rainstorm - where as my other deck looked visibly dry on the surface. And even further - as Rod pointed out - the application of woodtux to this step was much thinner - where as I really loaded it on my other deck. Who knows - maybe overnight temps dipped that night - it was in early May - which is a possibility, and that can adversely affect the life of any coating. I've painted trim in 70 degree weather - and watched temps dip to high 30's and then watched it all bubble off the following spring. And further than that - I stained a 'wet' deck - it could have froze several nights later, with all the high content moisture and ruined the finish from within- there is plethora of possibilities.

I have a mahogony deck coming up, does stain not last long on mahogony like ipe? I want to give customer realistic expectations. I think I will 'kill' it with caustics as well - and it is in the shade all the time, which should be more advantageous?

Rod - I actually don't like that real rich 'orange' color of warm honey gold - it's a bit too much for me. The color on that step reminds me of some of those baker's jobs. And as well - that step was soaking dripping oozing wet, and from what I am told the longevity is greatly compromised with this kind of application. But for my tastes that step looks pretty darn good shape. Looks like it could easily, easily go 18 months with just a slight touch up - but I think it will go the full 24 months. Because of this little 'experiment', I have much higher hopes for the durability of woodtux on older pressure treated decks that are still in good condition. This step lived I think 5 years, was totally greyed - but never got intense sunlight - basically lived it's life under the thick shade of 'muni' Maple trees growing on the side of the road. I will get some pics of another deck that was also greyed but was only 10 months old in comparison. That was a 'wet' application as well - the staining followed directly after a washing - although wood was not visibly wet like the step above. And I don't think it fared as well. I am now thinking that perhaps the newer the wood we are treating the more cautious we have to be with moisture content? And something like dried out 5 year pressure treated perhaps has improved capillary action of sucking in stain - so being wet is perhaps advantageous?

yeah that's warm honey gold - what are your thoughts - you think it's faded?

You know folks - just stop all your hem'ing and haw'ing over letting ipe weather. Just make up a real strong brew of oxalic 9oz./gallon and nuke the friggin decks. That will open up the 'pores' just fine. And allow you to stain the decks right away without telling a homeowner to wait for 6 months - talk about losing a job!

H Hey Jim - that parrot ever poop on your head?

Just got a call to strip this hardwood deck, mahogony I believe? Anyways those spindles/balustrades are steel tubes with an 'equipment' grade oil based exterior enamel. How the heck do you go about stripping handrails and stringer boards and yet protect these spindles? And if there is a way - how time consuming is it?

Correction that step was more like 5 years old at the time.

Just curious - why do all you guys advocate letting an ipe deck weather for a year after stripping? What's wrong with stripping a deck, then throwing some Ox at it - then coming back a couple days later and doing a little sanding and then stain? Why bother waiting a year?

So do you folks consider this a success? What is fading in general? Erosion of the toplayer? Or is it color fade?

Just to compare our deck resto business to floor 'sanders'. Guys that come in and sand down hardwood floors and apply 3 coats of oil based poly - what do you guys think they get per square foot? Remember they have to put on 3 coats - buff in between - with many trips - as they can't wait between coats - as oil based poly's take a long time to dry - so they have to leave jobs often and come back often. So what do you think floor sanders get per square foot? Cast your vote, just remember, I think their job is more labor intensive with much higer expectations as to the finish and of course the average expectation for durability is about 10-15 years. And they have to be super diligent for the dust they create.

Once you drop your pricing - then you are working for 'them', and trust me, it sucks being in the trenches. You will never have any money left over if you meet their requirements - it takes alot of overhead to run a pressure washing business well. Once you start working for 'them' you'll notice that you start putting off that 'brake' job on the truck - because cash is low. You'll start noticing you run 'negative' balances and get a $25 charge. Lots of things start going wrong - and then it starts draining you mentally and physically. You may cancel that health policy that start thinking is highway robbery - or that stupid yellow pages ad that is only getting you 15k a year in business. Don't lower your pricing - keep your pricing high - it also has the lovely effect whereby the hacks get all the 'cheapies' and they end up putting themselves out of business.

Rod - 'latex' is an industry term that represents resins like vinyl acrylics and 100% acrylics. There hasn't been an actual honest to goodness latex resin in 'latex' paints for over 40 years. Denatured alchol will remove all 'latex' products 100% acrylic or not.

Again - talking to the 'Fen' - and he had asked me if my winter was mild. I actually thought it was mild - and then realized what a world of difference Southern New England is to Pennsylvania. So I am including some shots of my home during an average 'Boston' snowstorm. It got me thinking that lots of these stain manufacturers perhaps aren't really formulating with my needs in mind. I would go so far as to say - between our harsh winters - and absolute brutal summers - maybe one year in the northeast is equivalent to 2 years of 'weathering' further south. So here are some folks of a what I consider a 'mild' winter.

LOL - Jim you are either the biggest clown in the wood preservation industry or the biggest genius, and you're laughing at the rest of us with your antics. Either way, keep it up. LOL