plainpainter

This is an irritating little dilemna I have, that I can't seem to figure out - it has to do with customers always quizzing me on how long the job will take? How do you approach this? I don't know if they are worried I will be there too long - or looking to see how much I am making 'hourly' off their back. I am little disturbed by this - should I answer their question with another question? Like - what are your requirements m'am? I don't want to answer - yeah I'll be in and out in an hour and btw - thanks for the $400. I know we're all selling a service - I mean heck if you saw how fast a tree cutting crew can take down a 150 yr. old Silver Maple - you'd think you were paying them $800/man-hour. But they just figured out how to do a very tricky time consuming service extremely fast - and deserve the compensation. It has nothing to do with actual time.

Maybe speed will have to become a 'selling' point in future marketing. At least this way it will pre-qualify homeowners that want to pay extra for this service. So I don't have to deal or worry about the hour 'counters' who want to know why I am making more than $15/hr.

Thanks Rick - this is some of the most constructive info I have seen on these boards.

ABR products has a stain that contains borons which I think are attracted to moisture - and they even advertize that it's preferable to have wood at around 20% before staining - just some food for thought.

Do you like it as much as readyseal, Jim? What kind of durability does it have?

And????

Ok Mr. Petry - this experiment we started almost a year ago to the date is ready to conclude. As well - I think it's fair that we some photos of the deck boards as well - I want to see for myself what kind of performance we can all expect on a customers Ipe deck with a product like readyseal one full year after application. And as well - how are you going to treat it for another application? Strip? Simple bleach clean? Remember if you use a product like efc-38 and then your citric acid - that's basically the same thing as a full restoration.

I love it - I am on another painting board - and I am networking with this other painter in my area. And he has this customer with a mahogony deck with ATO - then black spots and another coat of ATO on top of it by the homeowner - and he has no clue how to deal with it. So I tell him my service and what I would do. Turns out he runs a highly succesful painting business - keeps like 15 guys busy doing lots of commercial work and some residential - and he is telling me he just couldn't be bothered or wants to invest in the time to understand the correct process - so he asked for my contact info, and maybe I will be bidding the job.

I found out these homeowners bought their home for $192,000 ten years ago. The present value of the home according to zillow's is now $450,000. So the wealth of their home has increased dramatically. So on paper everything looks good - but then again they didn't pay that much 10 years ago either.

I can assure you guys about confidence being low or anything like that wasn't a factor. I've sold many jobs over the phone last year - this was a cheapie.

I never met this one homeowner - and she was thrilled over the phone as to how clean her home came out - and man was it tall, I had to climb an 8 foot step ladder and shoot with a 72" long lance with a 0040 to hit the top. And she was like - you must some real big ladders and stuff - which in fact I do - but not for washing. But it occured to me - the less homeowners know - the happier they are - it's when they start 'snooping' around and looking into our methods and how we do our business - that they start getting irate. I deliver results - what's more important than that?

I put 2 coats of a parafinnic stain on my deck last Fall - and it badly needs another recoat this spring. How do you go 2 years between recoats? Is this after several years? I am thinking perhaps 2 coats each year for the first couple of years - and then it can go the distance - am I wrong?

I think my total estimate was like $700 that I itemized between the different services - I don't think my confidence was low.

Ken - I hear what you are saying. I just can't imagine that $270 seems expensive to anyone making 50g's or more. I am setting up my database - but anyone field like value of home, age of customers, or town they are situated on - is going to take at least 30 data points before I can derive meaninguful results - and that will take a while - man If I could buy these statistics and circumvent this - I wouldn't have to deal with this. $270 is alot? People have nice home, a pool, a deck - 3 sheds, some nice vehicles - and they're going to try and do it themselves? I am astonished. Man Jim I don't know the New England where you live - my New England is Yankee cheapness all the way.

Jim, some guys get lucky. Do you really think the money you make is 'mainstream' for most guys - or do you think you got lucky?

Rick - I think parafinnic has a shot on pressure treated. I just think deck staining with parafinnic based stains is a yearly thing with hardwood decks. Do your customers absolutely love seeing you every single year? I know many love the idea of repeat business - but I don't want to hand a bill each and every year over and over again. Heck as bad as trex mildews - I am sure most of my customers can get by with every other year cleanings. What is our customers' 'uncle' point? The way I see things, at least for ipe - if we can't get a product to go two years before a full strip/resto, then what's the point - and on softer woods - two years before a 'maintenance' coat - and three years before a full resto/strip job. Those are my requirements - and I need a product to fulfill those requirements - so I can build a deck business. Otherwise I fear pi$$ing off customers - or at least scaring many of them away if I am totally 100% honest upfront about the reality of how much deck maintenance will cost - if I can get a stain to perform.

Honestly thats all about setting yourself apart from the others by selling your services, experience, technique, and building trust with clients. She has to know why they are able to offer a $99 housewash and why your $240 wash is som much better. If you let people shop on price you'll always lose.

Ron - I love the enthusiasm - but the definition of a bad economy is 'negative' growth. How do you sustain growth in a time when people lose their jobs, businesses cut back - and people are wary of spending? What makes the pressure washing industry so immune from these greater market forces?

Terry - either times are real bad, or New Englanders are real cheap - but I think it's fair to say that the painting trade got flushed down the toilet. I mean let's face it, painting, especially exterior painting is about the most expensive trade to break into. And I see evidence - how many painters deny themselves the 'basics' in safety equipment - just so they can compete. Like a rack full of ladders, that are all at best 200lb test - and just real beat up looking. So if this trade can get flushed - why not pressure washing? Heck I even read about roofers in the midwest - that will rip up 2 layers of old roofing and put down new roofing - materials included for $200 per 'square'. The hacks are there too!

Depends what you want to do. If you want to remove it - you can coat the whole deck with liquid laundry detergent just before the onset of winter - and let it sit like that for a few months. Or pressure wash it clean - go to Mad Dog Primer and call them up and ask for the improved primer for deck surfaces - coat the whole deck - repaint - and it will last 7+ years.

So, Ron, I am to assume you don't think the profitability will end in the next 5 years? I just want a solid 15 years - I have seen so many of my careers toppled by the whims of the economy - I just need this career to hold out long enough that I can make some money.

LOL - I know you don't use that crap - how about a few pics of a readyseal deck 12 months after application? 18 months after application? And 24 months after application? My pressure treated 6 months after application don't look absolutely wonderful - but the wood is still protected and looks like a simple bleach clean and reapplication in a couple months. I just don't understand how readyseal or any parafinnic stain can last more than 12 months on ipe? And is it just a simple percarb/bleach clean? Or is it a hydroxide strip?

Had some good encouragement from the Fennerator today - he also drilled the importance on the 'follow-up' call. And I decided to put it into practice today. I had done an estimate last week - suspected the people weren't going to pay much. Didn't really have a great chance at doing a sales presentation - explained some things to 'hubby' while wife was at work - and got the 'will run it by the wifey' routine. So I did the follow up with wifey - as I can tell she is making the decisions - and although she said they weren't going with the house washing part, wasn't that dirty, she was mostly interested in the deck, and was going to get several more estimates - another sign of cheapness. But I did manage to life her eyebrows with how trex was sold in the industry as a no-maintenance product - and has turned into a nightmare - that raised her eyebrow, and she didn't know that - although her trex was very badly mildewed. So I further explained that if she was going for other contractors - that she make sure they know not to 'overbleach' the deck, causing the color to go away. I explained how I could use a lower bleach strength, still kill the molds, and not affect the color much - she was impressed. Now I am not saying I will get the job - but I definitely feel I injected some more 'reality' into the situation and raised the probability in my favor of acquiring a sale even in the face of cheaper pricing from the competition. So I did what I set out to do - sell the customer on value, and differentiate myself from pricing alone. Still not a perfect sales - but another thing - lots of our competition are lazy too, I bet she won't even get another contractor to come by.

As a sidenote - I am finding that it's better to perhaps callback at least 3 business days after submitting proposal. I may be wrong - and no definitive statistics - but I suspect it gives the customer time to digest and get other estimates, and if the others haven't come in - just shows that you are serious, where as callbacks the next day - don't accomplish as much

Sometimes Jeff, the easy things don't come easy - I use to submit tons of proposals without following up. And I suspect most of my competition is the same way - and I think it's kind of nerve-wracking to those that don't like customer interaction - it can be hurtful to egos for some. Like Ken said, it helps the closing percentages. And it reminded me how last fall I got one of my biggest contracts which included deck restoration and a house wash. I closed the deal over the other guy that was much much much cheaper. So price isn't always the whole story. In the end the customer realized they were getting superior work anyways - so that made her happier. But now I will do call-backs as routine, just making sure to be more consistent and round out my sales approach.