RPetry

Rambo's little sister, What a great moniker, bet you are nowhere near tough as that. Listen to Beth. Cabot's use to make a good solid oil, assume they still do. May take thinning with mineral spririts to apply. Go to their web site and read the specs on the product. Follow the instructions. Just do not use any of their acrylic products on your exterior wood. Either oil, or nothing at all.

The European division of the BDA is coming through with flying colors. Very nice job Roger, "bleach bathed", love that terminology. Try talking like that in Texas and they'll run you out of town on a rail. Furniture and pavers look good. Guess that sodium hypochlorite is doing a job against that nasty English mold and mildew. Who makes your "Golden Teak Finish"?

Jim, Congrats, that is a nice job. A real power lunch. Guess the competitor is no competition! As for your concern of having ADD, do you know there is a bird on your head?

I love cedar. It's above and beyond a PITA but even with all the problems for a contractor, the wood has character. The more knots, the better. Looks great, smells great, and will drive you crazy. Or broke.

Roger, We had water restrictions a few years back here in the northeastern US. At least in NJ it did not affect contractors. Public perception, maybe, I did not notice it but I'm a small fish in a very big pond. Bust on Tony Blair, but I assume he's getting to be stale crackers. Resurrect Winston Churchill. Now there is a man that had gumption and fortitude when it counted.

Stripper, NaOH, commonly known as sodium hydroxide can harm wood? Gee, there's a novel approach to caring for the love of our profession, wood. Common sense, its Draino, lye, oven cleaner. NaOH is a must for nasty stripping, a near crime for anything else.

Rfitz, Bingo. Nailed it on wood. Best luck on other endeavors.

jquick77, As far as I know to this point, there are two woods that do not need anything as far as stain or oils to stand up to our climate without treatment. One is teak. Teak has been around longer than we or our grandparents have lived. Check that, longer than that. If it is real teak of heartwood origin, sun, rain, freezing, hail be damned, it lasts for a long, long time. Problem is that so called teak has been on the market for some time. This is wood that is either/or sapwood, and not dried sufficiently, or young stock that has not had time to grow and imbue the wood with enough natural oils. The other wood is ipe'. I have no doubt that there is or will shortly be ipe' wood on the market with the same inferior attributes. Bottom line, good wood has become very expensive and often hard to get. You get what you are willing to pay for.

Beth, Ok. We both believe what we have seen and have learned. Peace. No further arguement. Unless others have more pertinent facts. If my customers ask about their teak deck or garden furniture, I will defer and say I think it will outlast at least your lifetime. As long as it is good wood.

Beth, If it is teak, must be sapwood. Or the wood was never dried properly before fabricating furniture. Teak when cut has a moisture of ~ 40%. Air dried ~ 25%. Kiln dried ~ 15 - 12%. Good enough for outdoor furniture. if the teak is cracked, it was not dried properly. If it is rotted, not decent quality teak. Ever seen any rotted ipe'? A good friend owns and runs a commercial dive boat out of Pt. Pleasant, NJ. Teak deck and the boat is 23 yrs. old and the teak has never seen a drop of stain or oil, only a fresh water wash, sun, and the marine environment. One small corner where the scupper and deck meet stays wet all the time. There is a small spot of rot (that will only get worse over time) where the wood is constantly immersed in water. Our good friends in the British Isles have many park benches remade into teak from the decks of sailing ships, built over a hundred yrs. ago. These decks were cleaned with salt water often. From what I understand, these benches are still going strong in a climate that is condusive to mold, mildew, and rot. From everything I have read about good quality teak, it does not rot. It does not need an oil or stain. At least not in a lifetime.

Jquick77, This picture may help. From left to right, Ready Seal dark brown, dark red, and a 50/50 mix of dark brown and dark red. The wood is not teak but an unknown hardwood, probably from Asia or South America. Very dense and hard though, so the colors on teak may well be similar.

Mike, Thanks so much for the good info. Your grading description is especially helpful. In my business, have seen quite a bit of the "unknown hardwood" deck and pool furniture. It just does not seem to weather to an acceptable patina like teak. More discolored and splochty looking compared to teak. Working on exterior wood for 7 - 8 months, I know that my furniture will be the last to be finished. Thats why I want teak, it looks good and lasts without staining. Same reason I reskinned my own deck with ipe'. The "shoemakers kids have no shoes" syndrome. I like the idea of custom made furniture, but with the cost of living here in NJ, cannot fathom labor prices being anywhere near competitive to production furniture. Attached is a picture of the chairs we want. With shipping, these are $340 each. Cannot imagine a local furniture maker trying to make something like this for that price. Never would have thought imported wood might be cheaper here but due to local seaports I am sure you are right. Less shipping. Conversely, had a discussion with a contractor in Ga. last year. His cost for PT pine was half of what we pay. Makes sense, they grow it down there and shipping is minimal. Agree. I'm looking for a source from local nurseries. Great story of a potential comeback for the king of the eastern forests. Thanks again for your help.

Mike or anyone else, Any suggestions on teak deck furniture? Being a "woodie", just can't bring myself to buy the S.A. who know what hardwoods while I can spend, jeeze, only twice as much for teak! From what I have read, the quality wood now comes from Indoneisian plantations. Any idea? Aside from fabrication practices and craftsmanship, it seems the kiln dried teak to 12 -15% moisture content is the way to go. Learned that from staining decks. Without question the wood must be heartwood. Does the term "one side clear teak heartwood with a mix of straight and free grain" mean anything to you? Sounds good, but I'm not a furniture maker. Knew the brand Smith & Hawkens but they did not have what we are looking for. Guess I should not hijack the thread for personal use but maybe others can learn something about teak. Thanks.

jquick77, Or if your customer doesn't mind the silver patina look of unstained teak, just clean and brighten the wood. Teak does not need any stain to protect it, the wood is very hard and dense and near impervious to sun and moisture damage.

Mike, No doubt. The problem seems to stem from the importer/growers. I would guess that many lumber yards do not have a clue to species, only a trade name. When the trade name has "mahogany" in it and the wood is not of that family, I think it is deceptive. I put an aside comment on " African Ipe' " earlier today. If you do a google search, there are some people that state they have "African Ipe'". As far as I know, ipe' is only indigenous to South and Central America. The misinformation and buyer ripoffs are occuring and will only get worse. Even if I only work on the wood, it would be beneficial to know what I'm working on. The builder, installer, and ultimate customer may not, and in my limited experience, do not have a clue.

Rod, Went to the site and had a quick lookover. What is it with these wood importers? Looks like, sounds like, almost tastes like ipe'. But could not find any mention that it is actually ipe'. More addition to the confusion. Whats the matter with " Pau lope ipe' ". Its like they are trying to establish a new species for pure market postition.

Brings back memories. One of the best workers I ever had, in any business, was a young man who just graduated college. Diligent, polite, quiet, steady worker who liked to work on exterior wood. One small problem. He was a "Phish" fanatic. For those that are not aware, Phish is the younger generations Grateful Dead. Two years ago was their last tour. He must have gone to 4 or 5 Phish ins throughout the summer. At least 4 days and sometimes 5 day trips. The guy was just so good, I really couldn't get mad for more than a day or two! I'd hire him back in a heartbeat.

Jquick77, To answer your specific question, yes Ready Seal can be used on hardwoods such as teak. Apply with lambswool. If possible and the wood will take more oil, do a 2nd very light application. The trick is to get as much oil into the wood as possible. No matter what stain you use, if the teak furniture is exposed to sun and rain, it will have to be cleaned or stripped (depending on the stain) every year and more stain applied to keep the wood looking good.

While looking up info on exotic woods yesterday, came across this site. http://www.umass.edu/bmatwt/publications/articles/wood_myth.html The title of the article is "Wood Myths: Facts and Fictions About Wood" from the University of Mass.. Some varied info for those of us that work on wood. In one section, the following...."The real problem is that many lumber yards sell you Meranti (Shorea spp.) as mahogany. Philippine mahogany is meranti. It is not mahogany. Merchants separate 125 species of Shorea into 4 groups of meranti." On other sites, saw a lot of references to the Shorea species and the various names associated with it. This species is not mahogany, but there is prevalent marketing from the importers to sell it as such. Buyer beware. It is becoming more difficult to correctly ID all these so called "mahoganies" and exotic hardwoods. Some genius is going to wake up one day and start selling some wood as "African Ipe'" and make a quick fortune.

Yes. I have had good results hiring college students. Getting the good ones back for following seasons is tough. They are usually pretty smart, learn quickly, and have some work ethic. As I do not as yet speak Spanish, communication is not a problem.

Mas, Thats it! Baku' mahogany, not Balau or some such name. Thanks.

Man, where have all you guys been? There has been more interesting stuff posted and great links to exotic wood sites than I can remember on any thread on the TGS at anytime in the past.

Scott, We cross posted. You just made my day. Put some more oil into that cedar puppy later on, it will look richer and last just as long as any premium oil stain on the market. Again, another scary question. The wood was dry enough when you first applied the oil, wasn't it? This is the RealDeal with Ready Seal!

Scott, Well, well, very well done. Put the capital "W" back into the "Woodie", you have earned it. You 'aint StainlessDeal, you is the RealDeal! Terrific work on a sometimes difficult wood. Especially from one that is fairly new to the trade. Almost afraid to ask, but what are you going to stain the cedar with? You're flying in to help me work on your B in L and sister's job, right? Just let me know the flight # and I'll grab you at the airport! Storms are past, the sun's out and the forecast looks good. I'm emailing Eric with a proposed schedule. Book the flight for next Thursday or Friday!

Hey Scott, I've also heard of luan or something like that, and also a wood called balau, again, something like that. One other clue I forgot to mention is that this wood is dense. Probably got the equivalent of 450 sq. ft. per gal. coverage with Ready Seal, which penetrates into stainless steel! Dan, Real good article with an upbeat ending on the American Chestnut. I copied it and put it in one of my hard drive directories that is for wood information. I'm going to call some nurseries today and see if these trees are available locally. It would be nice to have a tree in the yard with a story, a history, a tragedy, and a rebirth.