John T

Don't ever lose track on what happened on 9/11 which is exactly what your doing. There where innocent Muslims killed there as were other different Religion/nationality backgrounds. With your thinking your condeming over 1.5 billion people of Muslim faith that live on this Planet. 9/11 was an act done by the terrorist group called AL Quida. Because this Hard Core group happen to have a Muslim Background they don't represent 99.99999% of Muslims as the KLU KLUX KLAN don't represent 99.999999% Baptist or whatever Religious background they have. Hitler had over 6,000,000 Jews put to death but does this make all Germans bad and condemmed to hell?? Think about it and never ever lose sight of the TRUTH!!!

Kobe Bryant on the other hand who did commit Adultery(Not a Criminal offense) I would speculate did not have *** with that woman(Clinton).....err.. I mean rape that woman. Check that let me rephrase my above answer....If Kobe did rape that woman he has an easy way out to be found NOT GUITLY just like the way that Kennedy(Smith) guy did about 10 yrs ago and this answer is simple. For a person to be found guilty in the court of law they must be found guilty by "Beyond a reasonable doubt" by the jurors. The way to kick that out by the Jurors is to show this Girls behavior leading up to the rape and if it isn't to good which hers wasn't then you will get a few Jurors who can't vote for a conviction because now they have a little bit of doubt put in there minds. People love to Judge others even though there not suppose to but when they see that this girl had *** with at least one other guy that nite etc. etc. she is doomed. SAD but TRUE. Then on top of that add Fame and Fortune in the mix and....LIGHTS OUT!!!!!!!!!! Who ever said life is fair.

Here's an article concerning Reclaiming on the West Coast. Is it possible that a guy like this could be tipping off the authorities not for the right reasons but to only make $$$$ ?? Just wondering http://www.signonsandiego.com/news/metro/20040103-9999_7m3clean.html

5 to 1 he gets off and thats not in his... The poor Kid with Cancer that is at the center of this mess with Micheal Jackson gets ZERO recognition and none of Micheal Jackson fans could care less about this poor kid....Who by the way is the one that is on that Tape of Micheal Jackson where he admits to sleeping with him and other young children. A very disturbing story especially if you have kids like I do. There is no fair explanation for that behavior. He's lucky some deranged parent doesn't go looking for him. Also IF Micheal Jackson is found guilty(Extremely unlikely because of his fame and Fortune) he will get his by those tough nuts in prison. If the Notorious JOHN GOTTI who was the head of the Gambino Crime Family in NY got the **** kicked out of him in prison that tells you that no one is safe behind bars especially a HE/SHE like Micheal Jackson. I could see those tough guys behind bars just licking there chops to get at him....

Another tastless MIcheal Jackson joke of the day: What Does Micheal Jackson and little boys have in common?? They both come in small cans.........

OK you got me:p I know someone that were much better looking then and he lives in MESA and his name begins with the letter R.:D

Way to step up girl! Your mug shot looks refreshing compared to mine, Scott Stones and many others....Especially Scott Stone:D You should put it in your profile.

Professional Sport players today are pretty much soley driven by Money so they can do whatever they want. Thats just the way it is. Micheal Jordan probably gambled alot more then Pete Rose ever did. If they keep Pete out then they should probably look at alot of other players in other Sports and possibly throw them out of there respective Halls. Here's a list of people who I would never kick out but anyone could make an arguement that they should go. 1-OJ Simpson 2- Mohammed Ali who wouldn't help defend our country when called to service 3-Lawrence Taylor for Smoking Crack with Kids of the street,Sending Hookers to other players and probably gambled like crazy 4-Ty Cobb- among many other reasons such as beating up a Handicapp person at a game and also possibly Murdering someone. etc.etc.etc.

Those answers sound nice and I wish I could believe them like you guys do but I always look at both sides of the coin its just the nature in me. On the other side of that coin is all those people suffered greatly and they came from a very religious country Columbia. Its like last year when a Tornado swept down in one of the midwest states and heads towards 2 churches that were full of people. The Tornado hits one of those Churches and kills a bundle of people in Church no less. You get the picture with me. I look at things for better or worse with an even eye. If the lucky can thank the Lord then the others should be able to blame the Lord because the Lord made us. I do respect your answer of course but at this time in my life they don't make complete sense to me.

I believe Pete Rose should be allowed into the Hall OF Fame and Shoeless Joe Jackson(Say in aint so Joe) should never be allowed in. Reason is that Joe Jackson took the Money to help throw the World Series. Unless if they ever prove that Pete Rose actually had games fixed then he deserves to get in. The problem that Pete Rose has is that he broke that sacred Cardinal Sin of gambeling on the game itself. Still if he didn't fix any games then he still gets in. Also I am biased because I loved Pete Rose as a player. Nobody in any sport have I ever seen give it his all Like the way Charlie Hustle did.

I dealt with an Horrific Jet Crash almost 14 yrs to this date(Exact date January 25,1990) I was pretty much there before just about everyone. When I went into that JET(I was young and fearless) it felt very surreal. I almost felt a presence there kind of like what you guys/gals expressed but when I saw all the dead and broken up bodies that presence evaporated. Seeing those people like that and also seeing the lucky ones with minimal injuries nothing really made sense. Even when the Jet was about to explode but never did it still made no sense because of all the suffering. So maybe the thumping was there for me but not for the others. Still doesn't make sense but maybe one day it may. Either way I don't loose any sleep over it and I still live the life that I like with no guilt...OK almost no guilt.......

Ditto to what Squirtgun said above and if GOD ever thumps me on the head I will definitely change my thought process but untill then......................... Dale and Paul are just to intellectual for me. Maybe next time I'll bring up a controversial sports subject to give those two a run for the money;)

The beauty of science is that alot of it can be proven. Example is having that machine on Mars Right now. Religion can not be proven that is factual. This is where the problem will always be and the reason why Religon can always be debated where 2+2 will always equal 4 and thats not debated. Unless of course if someone puts a spin on the 2 grapes + 2 apples etc etc. People that except religion fully have there reasons and I'm sure there Honorable ones. I'll never debate that but I will always debate the fact issue mainly because if one religion is the RIGHT one then there has to be a ton of them that are flat out wrong yet none of them can prove to anybody that there's is that RIGHT one. Plain and simple/Cut and dry....These are the Facts

Mike Williamson, The reason I say you have to have blind faith with religion is a simple one. Since most if not all points about religion is passed down thru Hearsay and the Bible which was written by man just about all of it can't be proven. So since we all know most of it can't be proven what does that tell you?? It tells you that you either believe it or you don't. If you do its only because of faith and since just about everything in religion can't be proven you now have what is called BLIND FAITH. The Human mind is easily tricked and I think Religion plays off of that. Alot of Religious leaders know this which is why you will see someone like a Luis Farakkan from the Nation of Islam rise to the top of his religion because he see's this as clear as day. As does Graham, Orel Roberts, all TV evangelist,...just about all of them.

One Call Powerwash I disagree with you 100%. I brought this thread up awhile ago because a couple of guys from Steve's bb tipped me off about it. IF you feel that anyone can use your pictures maybe even the guy accross your town thats fine because you say it is but the person that had thier photos used didn't like it and that is where the problem started. Also we had this problem here before with a guy who lives close to me who's pictures were also used without authorization on another website. He wasn't to happy. BETH had this happen to where another website actually showed her husband doing the work!!! I'm glad I brought this thread up here and happy to say that the site owner did the honorable thing by taking care of it. IF he feels I went about it wrong for that I'm sorry but in the end it all worked out.

OK back on the Podium:) I can only conclude that Religion is based on Blind Faith and you shouldn't Question it because if you do you will fall into my catagory where Religion will never make sense. Its like My Father in-law told me a while back "You either believe in Religion and accept it or you don't. You have to have Faith." My answer to my "Never miss Church" Father in-law is I believe in some of the things concerning religion but not all of it. If God wants to condemn me to Hell for being Honest there really isn't much I can do about it unless I lie and that won't work. In the End I can only hope that if there is a Heaven God will let me in because he/she can do anything that he/she wants no matter what anyone says here. GOD may not be as predicable as alot of Religious people think that he or she is. Either way I enjoyed this Thread that I started. It stayed very Professional.

I'll add this in my closing here. GOD/Religon is great if its mixed in with LOGIC but and here is the big BUT Man has to answer for his actions and hiding behind a Religion to answer it is flat out wrong. Also when they say he will answer to his GOD -still no good to me. He will answer to us his fellow Human beings which is why we have our Judicial sytem in place which tries but doesn't always succeed to bring out the FACTS. This is also why I will never except that someones kills because of ALAH or any other GOD. Once again do the right thing and be logic and use COMMON SENSE. If your child needs a Blood Transfusion but your religion doesn't allow it then you must make the LOGICAL CHOICE to save your Child then pray to your GOD afterwords. Thats it I'm off the Podium..........

Scott, Sorry about your daughter. This is where I'll say that she is right now in a beautiful place. This is where I think Religion works. Also your story about you finding GOD is why RELIGION is good. This is where Religion serves its purpose which is comfort. Nothing else I can add here except I'm glad that Religion works for you.

Mike Williamson, Of course we can disect the Word Discriminate and how we use it in every decision we make but in the way that most people today relate that word to it should not be done. Discrimination is unfair and I'm not talking about picking cookies over cake. Also the way you explain the above its like you give all the credit to GOD but in all fairness when anything that goes wrong then you should give GOD all the blame because God created you...for the better or worse. Its unfair that religion always takes credit for the good things in life but they will NEVER step up and take the blame. Just look at all the Child Molester Priest and the cover up that followed for YEARS!! Also when one wins something they always thank God which is nice but when ever there is a winner..you guessed it there has to be a loser. Can the Losers then blame God??? If no why not?? Whats fair has got to be fair. In all Honesty what ever point you bring up I can counter point it with Facts and this is what drives Religion crazy, also most likely is why alot of people today at least in our Country don't hold Religion in High Esteem like they used to. These are the Facts.

I can understand completely why these ideas/Debates can go on for ever because we all have our own thoughts and some are so dear to us that in the end we will fight for what is right. Its the nature of the Beast. Whats great though is if we can discuss these CONTROVERSIAL idea's with level heads. Some of the greatest people were Religious and also used a ton of logic in there thought process. Here's a term which is probably agreeable to all sides COMMON SENSE!!!!!!!! Religious, Logical etc. the best answer by far is COMMON SENSE. Do the right thing. IF its Religion then do it RIGHT. If its Logic then do that RIGHT. You could be the smartest guy on the planet but if you have no COMMON SENSE...........we all know people like this. Example of this could be OSAMA BEEN LADEN. He probably is extremely bright but he will kill many innocents to make his point clear. He's lacking some serious COMMON SENSE and he will pay for this.

Quote by Robert WielohourThat's the main problem with the world today is moral relativism, political correctness and people being afraid to discriminate. . All makes sense except for the last part and once again this is the problem with Religion. They want to discriminate and you just confirmed it by that above quote. Religion is not put here for you to pass judgement but by discriminating that is exactly what you/Religion does. You don't have to like what someone does or is such as Homosexuality but its unfair to discriminate against them. If you really delve deeper into Religion you will see that they also discriminate against females. Religion has some SERIOUS faults and a big part of there faults is what they consider to be fair and unfair. I'd be willing to bet you will see most Churches will allow same *** marriages before you or I are dead and buried. Personally I don't like the idea of this happening but whats fair is fair. By the way a famous Chaplin here in NY was killed during 9-11 when he went in to help his fellow fireman and he was killed. A real hero who was most likely a non practicing Homosexual. I never had the Honor of meeting him but I know a few who have and this person was considered a top notch and beyond as a Person. I bet you I know where he is right now and it sure isn't Hell even if he was a Homosexual. God would never ever deny a man of his caliber.

If Religion is true then which religion is right because there not all the same?? Why does one religion have a major dislike for another?? The answer would be that Christianity, Moslem,Jewish, etc. think there religion is the rightous one and the other one really isn't which can cause that dislike. But if you ask what is the right thing to do in life as far as being good you would get a universal answer which is to be good to eachother regardless of relegion and once again it falls down to logic. Religion is a Belief and logic is a fact. The choice is anyone's...

Question from Jon Does believing OR not believing in a God make you a good or bad person? . My guess is that the religious people who are not supposed to not judge others in a negative light will judge you to be bad if you don't follow there religion. My answer is this- Don't hide behind your religion like a Mike Tyson or soon to be Micheal Jackson. You are either good or bad by your ACTIONS whether you are religous or not. Sounds logical:)

Dale, I feel your thinking is correct and of course I'm just voicing my own opinion. When I read Paul's responses alot of it is based on that term once again which is "BLIND FAITH" and religion is all about this. You can even debate about Jesus dying for us because the truth of the matter is this while I consider Jesus an honorable person for standing up for his beliefs he was Hunted down and killed. He was a marked man. I don't think Jesus ever wanted to die. I look at it that he was Murdered as where many great Men in the past. The other thing that hurts Paul Defense is that Religions all think that there right and most other ones are wrong so what do they do.....They Kill. This my friend is why Jesus was killed and these are the reasons why I see Religion for what it is which is a BELIEF SYSTEM that states where right and YOUR WRONG and cross us and you may pay with your life. Why do you supposed King Henry started Protestant religion??So he can make Divorce legal and instead of Just killing off fhis wives. Where's the logic to that?? Today there are millions of Protestants. As for the 10 commandments so many of those rules were broken and the thing about Adultery so many Married couples with kids can get there marriage annuled in the churches eyes like it never happen so they can live with there new found Lovers. Years ago this would take Money and the rich people did just that. The logic here hurts and being a LOGICAL person that I am you can see my dilemma with Religion.

All above post from all sides are well written no matter what one's belief is. Me personally I fall in the middle in this discussion. I believe in God but I don't believe in alot of what the Bible states. I also believe in Evolution because it makes sense to me. I am holding on to God but sometimes I wonder if I am really doing this because of the guilt that is installed in me thru my Roman Catholic upringing. Who knows. One day I'm sure I will get a better understanding of this but for now I just do the best I can which is to be a Good husband,Father and provider for my family. Also to treat everyone fairly no matter what there race,religion or sexual orientation is(Tough one but working on this). This is my belief system