When selling quality doesn't work

[staudend 14]

I bid on a 2200 total square foot deck for $1 a square foot and lost it to a lowballer. They are getting ready to sell the house so they didn't care if it was quality or not. I use EFC-38 with hang time for spindles, citralic to neutralize and wood tux to finish. It gets pretty expensive as ya'll know and I thought $2200 was pretty reasonable for a huge deck in mid-missouri. I even gave her a paper spelling out each step of my process and she actually went and looked at some incredible looking wood tux decks I recently did. Is that a reasonable price? And we are talking a huge deck on a huge house.

Just venting.....

[reed 500]

That is a very reasonable price. You stated they are looking to sell the house and that is why they may have gone lowballer. They don't want to spend anymore money than necessary to get rid of it. I have run into this scenario several times. Bet your bottom dollar they are ONLY getting what they want to pay for and nothing more. Know that you gave them more than a fair price and they were interested in a cheap fix. Not the pro fix.

Reee

[staudend 14]

Thanks Reed-

I feel better now.

[RyanH 14]

Perhaps they would want to split the cost with the new owners...being the buyer of the house I would want a quality job done as opposed to a cheap job....no sense buying a plastic lemon.

[Firedkm 14]

Nick,

It does get frustrating when you loose a bid to someone who is cheaper. One rule I always follow is when I set a price I will not budge. I take pride in my deck skills and the customer will have to pay for what I know.

I have had several people that I have done quotes on and during the process I was told they were going to sell the house. All of those quotes I did not get. They wanted a quick fix and I will not do that. My price would have been a little higher than that but your still in the ball park.

[staudend 14]

Ryan, I don't think they know who they are going to sell it to yet, good idea though.

Dale, That's what I get for putting my flyers in Real-estate agents boxes..... Still not a bad idea for house-washing. I take the same approach, I'd feel guilty for using an inferior product at a lower price trying to low ball the lowballer. There's a company by the name of Weathershied here in mid-mo that usually bids 60% of what I or other reputable companies in the area bid. They seem to do a good job of prep and staining, although I don't know if they use quality products or not. They spend a ton on marketing and have alot of work, but my observations watching them do several decks nearby have been that they brush and roll the floor and a couple spindles out, then they spray the rest without covering anything but the concrete patios beneath. I went back and looked at the house and there was spray everywhere where the wind caught it. The plastic prep work is what takes me the longest, which is a corner they cut. I don't know how they stay in business!! I consider them a low-baller with a professional image. I'm done venting nowww.......

[charlie 14]

When I started out I would run into the situation you wrote about. The only way to combat against it is to find out what other people are doing and then do something that they might not be doing. Always set yourself apart from the other guy. Every year I change or add something in the way I do something or on how to sell my service.

Charlie

[Everett Abrams 501]

I subscribe to Charlie's way of thinking. Always keep amending your company and services to do something different than the competition. At times I will go so far as to tell a customer that is comparing prices that the other company IS NOT my competition. I actually give them a worksheet that compares my company to two other companies. This way they are comparing "Apples to Apples."

[charlie 14]

My biggest competition is my self. I always tell that to new businesses that ask me for advice. By the way you think powerwashing has alot of lowballers try the pest control industry. Right Everett.

Charlie

Everett how long have you been in the pest control industry?

[seymore 90]

I very seldom get lowballed but on occassion I do.Mostly because my buisness comes from referalls"the best kind" so i don't have to do much selling to do.I just try to be fair on my price for the job i'm bidding.The harder the job sometimes calls for a higher price it just varies.The quality of work always stays the same,If it's 100 sqft or 6000 sqft.

When i do have to sell my services to a customer and my selling points are have been in the biz for 12 yrs is right at the top.I only stain decks,cedar houses and fences.I will sometimes clean n seal flagstone pavestone and that's about it.

Customers like the fact I "specialize" in staining exterior wood.

If i had to bid for example P/washing a driveway...there are so many P/washing "companies" out there "IE Joe with a P/washer in the back of his truck." That it's not worth it for me $$ wise to break even on P/washing a driveway.Now if i can sell a driveway cleaning while i stain a customers deck or fence that's even better.

See what i find here in Houston that there is not a lot of companies that "ONLY" clean and seal decks fences etc..

SO many fly by night guys out there that if you come up against their bid and you lose the job to them so be it.You go on to the next job and wait for that customer to call you back after they have ruined their deck. So you have to charge more to strip whatever mess they made.

"seen it many times"

[Everett Abrams 501]

Charlie,

This is our fourth season. The biggest accomplishment for us is that this year in Bulington County,NJ we were voted one of the 3 Best Pest Control companies by the Burlington County Times. This was big with the "larger" name companies involved. A testament to our customer service and loyalty of our customers to support us. I agree with the lowballer comment regarding pest control but, I would say it is true of many service industry trades as well.

[staudend 14]

So I made the mistake of pursuing this deck because it is slow this time of year for me. I called and told her I could cut 200$ off if I used clear wood tux on it, easier to apply, less drips etc... She told me she had another contract and to please not call again. I can bet you she had an extremely low bid from a low-baller. Some customers just don't care about quality. Somebody tell me I'm charging the right price for a 2200 Square foot deck!! I feel like she thought I was cheating her after a much lower bid from a low baller.

Anybody else feel my pain? I can't work for nothing....

[charlie 14]

First of you were oky on your pricing. Second you called here back and said I will knock $200.00 off never do that it just told her you are not comfortable on your pricing structure. Third you are to worried about one job. If you have enough proposals out there one won't make a diffence if they don't go with you. I am not trying to give you a hard time. You have what the customer wants portray that to them. We all don't get them all.

Good Luck

Charlie

[staudend 14]

I gotcha totally, but dang, I just bought a $375 digital camera for before and after pictures, and now I need a $600 computer to handle it cuz my old one is about spent. In thinking of these recent purchases, I thought it would be nice if I could swing the deck. Otherwise I would have let it slide. This deck was the one where she wasn't really looking for quality, just to sell, so I should have let it slide. The lure of a big deck is sometimes too much!!

Off the subject at hand, I bought this camera for before and afters to put in a portfolio for the customer. I got this nice little folder for 15 cents apiece, then card stock with "before" and "after" on it with some more info. I figure I can put this together for a couple bucks a deck after developing at Wal-Mart and the customer can then show their amazed neighbors and friends or keep it for future reference (hopefully). We'll see what happens. They ought to be pretty professional and convincing. Plus I can write it off and use it for fun too!!

[seymore 90]

I think you were right on with your bid of a job that size so don't sweat it.You are right you can't work for nothing and you don't want to give away your hard work and knowlendge that you have learned about deck restoration.

Building a portfolio for your buisness is a great idea and it will even sell your jobs for you.Cause pictures are a worth a thousand words.

[charlie 14]

Now you are thinking. Chances other people in your area are not doing before and after pictures.

Charlie

[staudend 14]

How should I go about telling the customer before hand that I am going to do that? A informational paper? There will also be some lag time between deck finish and portfolio delivery. I'm still trying to figure out the logistics of this. Nick

[charlie 14]

What do you mean?

Charlie

[staudend 14]

I am going to add this service of before and after photos to my deck portfolio. Should I tell the customer this during the bidding process or when? As of now it's new, so I'm going to just spring it on my first customer... see the result. It will take a little while to prepare this portfolio, it's not an instant thing. It might be a couple of days before I can have it prepared and delivered. I don't know if this would be a problem or not.

[Dale 16]

How about just mentioning you have some pics of other similar work you've done and asking is they would like to see them....everyone of them will say yes.

[seymore 90]

Having before and after pics of your work is just a way to show the customer how good you are.It's just another tool to get you more buisiness.

It's taken me a lot of time to get all my before and after pics and they are still growing.

You can print them out or you can create a cd rom of pics and give them to your customers if they have a pc.

[CCPC 26]

I think Nick is talking about providing a before and after pic profolio of each customers deck and putting it together after the job a droping it off at there house or mailing it to them. Just a way of showing the customer what a big differece his efforts had made on there deck.

[seymore 90]

Ahhhh i seeee now

[Brian Keating 14]

Nick,

What I would do is go back to the house next year and leave your card and a free estimate for the same amount you quoted the current owner. I guarantee the deck is going to have to be redone next year. The other thing is don't lower your price to compete with low ballers. If you do you will be out of business just as quick as them. I see a couple a year and they usually don't last the whole season.

Another thing is, get a website to display your before and after pictures. It is very professional and not thiat difficult to maintain. People love to look at pictures online.

[Jesse 15]

Hey Nick,

Put that marketing degree of yours to work! Also check out this link:

http://www.thegrimescene.com/forums/showthread.php?t=2267

Here is some info from Russ about pricing

PRICING:

It's always a good idea to look at businesses that provide a similar service in a similar market. This will give you an idea of what others charge, but should not replace carful research and calculations based on your unique circumstances. Each business is different and therefor only by analyzing your overhead can you accurately determine what it will take for your company to be successful.

When talking with new business owners I am surprised by how often their pricing strategy is to charge less then the competition in order to get new business. Their thinking is if they bid a job for 2/3 or even 1/2 of what their competition charges they are sure to get plenty of work. It stands to reason that being new to restoration it is going to take them longer to complete the job. It is also true that being new, they will be more likely to make a mistake that will add additional time to the job. That being the case, in that same amount of time their competition will restore more square feet AND make 30% - 50% more money per square foot. This is a guaranteed strategy for failure.

BIDDING

Before I discuss bidding formulation I want to touch on a very important point. If you are new to wood restoration, it is crucial that you do a test patch in an inconspicuous spot. The reason for the test patch is to determine the appropriate products and dwell times to complete the restoration job in a safe and effective manner. There are times even after restoring wood for over ten years that I catch myself saying “I wish I had done a test patch”. Most often it is when I think there is only one coat of finish on a deck and it turns out to be multiple coats of different products. In order for you to properly calculate profits you need to have a very good idea of the amount of time it is going to take to complete the job. Try to do the test patch in an area that has had the least amount of wear. The idea being if you can restore the toughest part, you can restore the easiest.

To determine your price per square foot you need to take into consideration all of the costs that go into a job. You should determine what material cost and labor are per square foot as well as all of the other things that go into the operation of your business (your overhead). For more information about determining useage and costs for materials read Calculating Material Costs in the ESI research library. Http://www.woodstrip.com/artman/publish/article_24.shtml

Most companies charge between $1.50 and $3.00 per square foot for decks and $2.00 to $6.00 per square foot for cedar and log homes.

When determining the total square footage it is important to measure and calculate all of the surfaces that you intend to clean. This should include the deck surface, handrails, band board, steps, stringers and support columns. For cedar homes and log cabins be sure to measure soffit and fascia if these are to be restored. Typically for a cedar home or log cabin windows are not deducted due to the fact that time is needed to mask them off and protect them. Once you know the total square footage you simply apply your price per square foot and you’ve got your bid.

Jesse

[staudend 14]

Yeah CCPC, that's exactly what I'm talking about.

Thanks Jesse, I have some marketing under my belt that deals with target market and various differentiation techniques, but my degree is in finance (stocks, bonds etc..) Should have gone the marketing route. This before and after idea is an attempt to differentiate from the other quality deckers in the area and set way apart from the lowballers.

Website is a good idea, but I have never actually had a full season of work because of school (this year still being a partial). Because of this and school loans my bank account will begin to suffer over the winter season, so any excess marketing tools have to be scrapped til' next year. Great idea though.

Nick