Consumer Reports, Wrong Again

[Guest rfitz]

Anyone see the new consumer Reports about Decks, ?

They say using a paint, not an oil, is best for your exterior wood...?

[Beth n Rod 1,279]

Figures...

Keep the US Forrestry Labs report with you to counter theirs. After all, they are the wood experts.

Beth

[Guest rfitz]

Beth, Where can I get those reports...?

THX

[Everett Abrams 501]

This is the article from their site for 08/2003 rankiings and story. I personally don't see anything that recommends paints. Is there other info that I am missing?

August 2003

Deck treatments: Long-lived colors

Opaque and semitransparent deck finishes used to come in a very small selection of colors, most of which had all the pizzazz of battleship gray. Today, manufacturers offer dozens of off-the-shelf premixed shades as well as colors mixed at the store.

Also in recent years, manufacturers have reformulated many opaque and semitransparent treatments, especially to improve their ability to fend off dirt and mildew. We’d like to think that’s a response to previous findings from our six-year testing program to determine how well the leading deck treatments hold up to the elements. The details:

Opaques rule. One opaque treatment, the Cabot Decking Stain, has outperformed all others in its third year of our ongoing tests. Besides resisting mildew, it has proven the best at keeping its original color. Several other opaque finishes are in their first year or two of testing and look promising so far.

Other deck finishes rarely last. One Wolman semitransparent and one Olympic clear finish still look good after three years. But most clear finishes haven’t resisted dirt buildup or mildew. They also wear away, exposing the wood to moisture.

HOW TO CHOOSE

Consider the wood. If your deck is made of pressure-treated pine, the most common material, an opaque treatment is the best choice (see Three finishes). Not only does an opaque treatment last the longest, saving you money on materials and a few weekends of time, it also lets you have a deck finish that complements the color of the house.

If you’ve chosen cedar, redwood, or a similarly showy and expensive wood for the deck, you’ll probably prefer a finish that reveals the wood’s natural grain. A semitransparent treatment is usually a better choice, since it allows the wood grain to show while providing more protection for a longer period of time than most clear treatments.

Consider your locale. If you live in an urban area, your biggest problem may be keeping the deck clean. Choosing the right brand of treatment can make that job easy because some resist dirt buildup while others seem to act as a dirt magnet.

Consider the deck’s location. If your deck is shaded by trees or out of direct sunlight on the north side of the house, you’ll probably want a deck treatment with good mildew resistance.

In contrast, if your deck bakes in the bright sun, it can be damaged by ultraviolet light. Colors may fade or shift. Ultraviolet light turns exposed wood gray. While the weathered-gray look may appeal to you, it doesn’t bode well for the longevity of the deck material.

IN THIS REPORT

• Main report

• CR Quick Recommendations

• Ratings

• Three finishes

RELATED REPORTS

• Exterior paints 8/03

• Exterior stains 8/03

[Guest rfitz]

Everette, if you look closely at manufactures products like Sherwin Williams for example, they have a stain they call solid deck stain, meaning an opaque finish, I tried everything but a sandblaster to remove that finish from a deck

and ending up charging the customer $2500.00 to strip that 10X10 deck...

They call it Opaque stains, but they are acrylic paints, solid in color, Im not sure how legally they can call those stains but they do, I refer to them as paints, which in reality they are...

Once again, it is a cheap, easy solution to a deck that a customer see's as a liablity, not an asset, unfortunately, consumer reports hasnt been doing the test's long enough to see the damage that will occur in 10-15 years from using these finishes, the customer will be tearing the rotten decayed deck down, and rebuilding a new, when if they would have used the proper oils decks need to survive, they would have a beautiful, life lasting deck,

for pennies on the dollar compared to rebuilding a new one every 10-15 years,

Just another hurdle we as wood restoration specialist, have to explain to customers, deck builders, and contractors....

I have found people with money, good educations, and common sense,

see the need for the service we offer, it is the middle class, that doesnt see the need for our services, nor do they have the money for a quality job..

[Everett Abrams 501]

I understand what your point is. The difference between a stain and a paint is that a stain has penetrating qualities and a paint forms a film on the surface. If your point is that "opaques" as it is used in this report have similar characteristics as paint I will only agree to a point. Specifically, the article refers to Cabot's Decking Stain, 1400 Series, this is a product that has linseed oil in it and IS NOT an acrylic. The Cabot 1800 series is an acrylic-based decking stain. In this article Consumer Reports calls the decking stain an opaque and in this instance is not an acrylic. I would venture to say that there are many contractor's, who when using a pigmented stain use the Cabot products.

The other question I have would be "What is your basis that by using a solid stain that you will only get 10-15 years out of the deck? I have not experienced this myself. Again, while I understand what your point I don't see these results.

[Guest rfitz]

If it is a solid stain, but still puts penetrating oils into the wood, Im sure

that is fine for the wood, I am referring to products like Sherwin Williams

Solid Deck Stain, that is an acrylic that just covers the outer layer of the wood, as you know wood is like our skin, and our skin needs oils, like moisturizers, to keep it from cracking, peeling etc.. and these solid paints as I refer to them, not all, but some, do not moisturize the wood if you will,

therefore not protecting the wood from the moisture, heat , sun etc..

and I have seen 10 year old decks, that had film forming finishes on them,

Benjamin moore to be exact, that were rotted out and decayed after 10 short years, and I am talking about Cedar Decks, as a matter a fact, I just helped my brotherenlaw rebuild his cedar deck, and it was only 10 years old,

and it too rotted and decayed , this time I convinced him of using PT wood, because of cost savings, longevity, and the fact that I can make pressure treated look like cedar with the right mixture of Ready Seal, now his railings,

are still cedar, but all his decking is PT, and you cannot tell the difference..

I might add, his deck gets about 16 hours of full sun all summer, no shade,

this is one of the reasons I like Ready Seal so much, is you can just keep adding it every year, and your deck should always look brand new..

I tell my lady customers, it is like what oil of Olay does for their complexions

[Everett Abrams 501]

rfitz,

If your point is that oils are better for exterior wood surfaces than other finishes, that's fine. I honestly think you are going a bit far with your explanation though. Bottom line is a paint is a paint and a stain is a stain. There may be characteristics between the two that are common. Some of the differences are that a stain is supposed to ba able to "breathe" and a paint seals to protect. Many solid stains do not have waxes that paints do. The differences are truly in their content. An easy way to describe the difference is a solid stain is a "cheaper" or "watered-down" version of a paint. Again, I understand that some of the characteristics between paints and solid stains are the same, however, they ARE different. There are many sources to read on all the differences between the two. "Painting and Finishing" by Michael Dresdner and "Understanding Wood Finishing" by Bob Flexner are good starts. They also provide excellent other information on our trade.

I still don't understand your claim that paints or solid stains will be the cause of wood rotting in 10-15 years. If this were the case no one would use them for protection at all. These type finishes are also used to protect. Are you trying to say that wood be better left exposed rather than painted? I would submit that there are other reasons that the wood rots(poor design, boards placed crown side down, constant standing water, and other factors).

I do agree that acrylic finishes while being more durable are difficult to strip and in high traffic areas, like decks should not be used. The problem I see moving forward is that this may be an only option in certain areas. There has been much talk about the use of oil-based finishes. Specifically around water ways which could lead to more popularity of the water-based finishes. The EPA is looking closely at this in NJ at this time.

This is a great topic you brought up as this question is very often asked. In regards to Consumer Reports, they have credibility with our customers. This is a fact and the perception that a reader gets from their publication(right or wrong) is a perception that we all will have to manage. As Beth posted, it is always great to have articles and documentation to support any of your claims when estimating. I carry many such items to provide with estimates that range from "artillery fungus" to "types of stains and sealers" to "why hire a professional to restore your wood." Again, great topic to dscuss and post about. What are others opinions of Consumer Reports and how it effects what we do and their findings?

[Beth n Rod 1,279]

The Sherwin Williams product you're referring to could be compared in composition to something like Wolman Extreme, in that it leaves a coating or film on the surface, rather than being a penetrating oil with a solid color to it. Such films can be removed, but typically need a longer dwell time. Additionally, these products shoud not be applied in certain climates, depending on the product and the climate, and also tend to crack and peel when exposed to multiple freeze and thaw cycles. Another factor to consider is the elevation of the deck from the ground, as such finishes tend to do better on raised decks where the wood can breath than they will if the wood is ground level with less than two feet of space to the ground.

Thanks for posting the report. I had not seen it myself. After reading it, I think I would have to say simply educate the consumer with these facts and let them decide. Most people don't want something to peel and crack, realizing of course that there is a cost to remove or repair the finish.

Typically we see rotten wood associated with latex paint, improper conditions when painted (wood far too moist), and the wrong type of lumber used to build with. We have seen several local builders say they used pressure treated lumber, and they used non PT pine, painted over it when above 20% wood moisture content, and the result was dry rot.

I'll look for the forresty labs link for you... I think it's off of www.usda.gov, but where I am not sure.

Beth

[reed 500]

Great subject folks. That's the kicker, "CONSUMER". That in itself is one of the reasons I don't use consumer products. Professional products only, hd80, citrallic, oxallic blends, efc38, woodtux, readyseal. Not one of these are a typical consumer product as referred to by the article. If you are not telling your customers you use professional products only I think you are missing a great sales line.

Anyways, I look to see threads like these. Professionally handled and no NAME CALLING. Congrats.

Beth, did you find the exact link?

Reed