Pricing for wax add on

[mas3372 14]

Hello,

I have a home to do with some major chalking and the home owner wants a wax rinse done to help the chalking from returning. She is aware that it will still return. I ordered some wet wax from sunbrite - I wish pressur tek sold some. My question is, what is a resonable amount to charge to add this service on. I was thinking that after rinsing the house, to rerinse with the wax in a seperatae bucket and then rinse windows would not take long, perhaps 20 minutes. I feel that an easy way would just be 25% of the house wash price could cover the wax application and turn a nice profit.

Any thoughts.

[mas3372 14]

Anybody???

[JohnW 14]

Mas,

I use a housewash that includes a rinsing agent to avoid spotting the windows and a waxing agent that creates a nice shine. We do not charge extra for this, it's already included in all of our house washes. Hope that helps answer your question.

[Barry M 73]

I don't charge for the wet wax either, it's included in the housewash. It's pretty cheap and it's a good selling point.

[PressurePros 248]

I have a much different philosophy. Upcharge all the way. Why make someone pay for something they may not want or need? I do understand the above made points but if you include it to a customer it has zero value. Barry says its a selling point but I have found that when built into a basic price structure, it was not.

The system I came up with was a multi tiered pricing plan for housewashes. My second and third tier plans include this service, though I use a product a little different than just a wax you add to your housewash mix. The product I use enahnces the color and restores luster. That's a value service, why give it away? If you go to a carwash, you pay extra for wax.

I find it is better (and more profitable) to offer customers choices. The customer feels empowered by being able to dictate what they want as opposed to one-size-fits-all-take-it-or-leave it approach. The same goes for gutter scrubbing. Its a value service. You upcharge for it. Guys will argue this with me day and night until they are blue in the face, meanwhile I sell $750 housewashes every day of the week.

I feel a huge thread comin' on.

[plainpainter 217]

I'm all for $750 housewashes. If you guys are feeling guilty give your time to charity or something. Residents should be charged fairly for every item.

[Barry M 73]

I feel a huge thread comin' on.

Well since you got your dukes up, here goes nothin ; )

I've looked into a 3 tier system but just can't come up with something I like. I understand customers like choices and that could very well help sell your services. It's a fact that MOST won't choose the 'budget' or lowest tiered service, most will go middle of the road which is also a plus for the contractor.

The reason I have a problem with it is that if someone did choose the lower package, I just can't walk away from a house without it looking terrific (wax application, gutters scrubbed clean, and so on). I don't care if I know they bought the budget package but I don't want the neighbors, friends, and family of the customer seeing a half a**ed job and thinking that my service is mediocre. It's not like the customer is going to explain to them that they went with the elcheapo package.

Maybe I'm over thinking again Ken but I want to walk away from every house with it looking as good as it can, I think that will reap me profits down the road.

[plainpainter 217]

Barry - do what I do, make up a tiered system, come up with pricing - the whole nine yards - but then don't offer the lowest tier. I do it. I give estimates for different services - basically they have 'greyed' out check boxes besides them. In other words customers that go with me, are picking a higher tiered service. And it gives them a better comparison to the competition. If I give three different price levels for house painting - with a basic scrape, spot prime, one coat of house paint - as the lowest estimate, say for example $5,700 - and then all the way at the top of the list I give a deluxe house package for $11,340. Then when they compare other estimates I tell 'em that so and so competition does the bottom job - and the reason they went with me was that they wanted a better job. The competition may off - let's say $5,900. But my customer already know that would be comparing apples to oranges. And that I am competitively priced at $5,700. It's just I don't offer that lower tier service for reasons you explained - it comes off as half a##ed. That kind of paint job has loads of paint failures in as little as one year in my climate - so I tell 'em I don't offer the service - but if I did, it would be at that low price. So now you really sold the customer value - because you already convinced them your job is a better job, and if they go with the competition - they aren't getting the same quality for less money.

But in regards to pressure washing - I am all for different tiered services, it's like going to a car wash where there is everything from the 'basic' package to the all out balls to the walls super duper package. Most people who walk by won't notice if you made the gutters super clean or not. They will just see a nice clean home - it's just a picky customer who will look with binoculars - and you already took care of that with a carefully worded contract. Heck give 'em discounts off of the tiered packages once in a while - it will make 'em feel like they are getting more value. Variety is the spice of life. Pressure washing is very different from painting - if a customer pays $4,000 for a paint job - that is money waisted - and is unethical for an honest painting contractor to offer such a minimal job - because it will not accomplish anything in the ways of longevity. The customer would be better off doing nothing and using that $4,000 for something else. Minimally prepped exterior paint jobs that run 4 to 5 grand accomplish little else other than making a contractor looking bad - because he did a 'crappy' job - even though he did honestly charge for labor and materials - and it does nothing in the ways of making the paint job endure the elements - in this arena, painting, you truly have to go high end - but pressure washing I don't think you need to.

[PressurePros 248]

Barry, I understand and am the same way, or should I say I used to be. But, this is a business. Our responsibility is to give the customer what they pay for. If I call a deck company and choose pressure treated pine for my wood, can I expect it to look like an ipe deck I saw in a magazine? If I choose stock windows on my new addition, can I expect them to have the same visual appeal that my neighbor's custom Pella windows have? Don't you think the contractor would rather showcase Pella's? There is arguement on both sides so I can play my own Devil's advocate and say a contractor can use only Pella windows and thereby set himself apart.

Let's look at this from a seller's standpoint, your viewpoint above ("It's a fact that MOST won't choose the 'budget' or lowest tiered service, most will go middle of the road which is also a plus for the contractor" ) and my experience with the tierd approach. In the windows scenario: I am a contractor that offers options. I am an experienced and respected contractor. I have a good reputation. I'm not selling them windows anyway, you know that. I'm selling them appeal. I let the customer choose what SHE wants. I'd prefer she chooses the more expensive option and will sell that option but its not my choice to make. Nor is it my obligation to give her a free upgrade because I want her neighbors to be impressed with my work.

People are impressed by neatness, finishing quickly, and good quality work. We give them all of that plus some. By your own hand you wrote that it is fact that customers will choose the middle option. That includes gutter scrubbing, except I offered it as a value service, you just through it in. I increased my ticket price, combatted lowball bids and the neighbors ooh and ahh just as much as the homeowners. Same results side by side but I made more money. Is that some kind of crime? I'm not in this for my health. I know you aren't either.

You know who chooses the low priced option after they hear a presentation? 2 out of 100 and thats because I think they don't need the upgrades. They have brown gutters, the siding is relatively new and upgrading them would just be milking them. I am not in business to do that.

Trust me, we never leave a house looking mediocre. The way my guys are trained, the chems I have refined again and again, my equipment and our procedure are systematic to produce the same results again and again. Owner/operator syndrome involves two things that will drain you.. ego and perfectionism. I fall prey to them just like everyone else.

[Barry M 73]

Daniel

Very interesting approch, I see the merit in it.

I will add to your theory of going high end in painting and not necessarily PWing. I have noticed that when I don't use the wet wax on a house that the mold and mildew come back within a year, meaning the house needs washed again in that short of time. But with wet wax houses I did two years ago are still free of mold and mildew. Now it's not the same as a year later failing paint job compared to a high end paint job that could last 10 years or more but it does make me wander if a contractor is really doing the customer a favor by offering a lesser PWing service to save a buck intitially.

[Barry M 73]

Ken

You posted just before I did but point well taken. I guess the challenge for me would be to come up with a tiered system that I'm happy with and that I feel confident in selling.

[plainpainter 217]

I understand Barry about the mildew coming back after a year. But if you don't upsell - what do you do to combat lowballers? Offer a tiered service, and show your customers pics of homes one and two years later with and without the additional service. And sell 'em value - but heck some customers want to clean the house for a quick sale or something. This is much different than painting - where you price a scrape and paint job for $5,000 that lasts not much more than 6 months - something so expensive as painting - you are screwing your customer over by offering a lower tiered service. Basically their is a 'floor' that you can't go below. If I paint your home for $10,000 - and it goes a good 7 years before it starts showing it's age - and the competition charged $5,000 and it only lasts 7 months - that is abysmal failure - even though both contractors estimated fairly for their labor and materials plus markup. Having mildew coming back in 12 months isn't so catastrophic - especially at the much lower prices for a pressure washing that only took 2-3 hours. Charging a customer $5,000 for 100 hours of labor plus materials for a home that really requires a much better prep job that will take 200 man-hours instead @ $10,000 - is just criminal.

I would never cheat a customer by offering lower quality jobs - even if it is fairly priced - it just doesn't make any business sense. Do it right and pay $10,000 for 7-8 years or do it wrong and charge $5,000 and have failure in as little as a year.

[MMI Enterprises 289]

Owner/operator syndrome involves two things that will drain you.. ego and perfectionism. I fall prey to them just like everyone else.

..Extremely valid in all trades..

People are impressed by neatness, finishing quickly, and good quality work.

..many potential customers have been so damaged by unscrupulous labor practices,material selection, and slow work that they don't believe me when I say I can do better in half the time.

I really like Daniels low tiered grayed out idea and although the dollar amounts seem high at my first glance for house painting they apparently work out to only $50 per hr. with materials included??

[plainpainter 217]

Kevin - you ain't gonna get rich in the house painting business - I was more thinking $40 per hr. plus a grand in materials - and trust me, it's hard getting those prices! I have upped my services to $45/hr. I can't run a contracting business on any less. Even though my customers see that and start thinking immediately that I am making a $90,000 salary and they only make $30/hr. First off - why do customes ego always come into this? They don't own and operate a business - all they do is show up for a job - not that is belittling them - but it's true, I should make more for running a business. But when you factor all my overhead, insurance, comp, investment in ladders, equipment, storage fees, gas costs, vehicle repairs - all comes out of that $45 man hour - I don't end up making a whole lot. And everytime I have helpers - all it ever seems I ever do is create a 'job' for the commonwealth - I don't see any profits, just more aggravation. And nobody is helping out the small business owner in this country

[MMI Enterprises 289]

Daniel, yer darn tootin right on all that... my father painted his whole life and is a broke old man. Where I imagine someone getting rich inthe painting business I picture a very active sales/managing oriented owner that delegates the jobs out to others in a very upscale exclusive area or construction market.... haha, where is that at?

Regardless of what I charge I always end up the working poor.

[plainpainter 217]

It's my believe Kevin - that you can't charge less than $75/man-hour in any of the contracting trades - to me that's lowbucks for an above board company. I compete with guys that charge $25/hr plus materials - but after being here for a year - I am much more focused on setting myself apart from those folks. But for now I am surviving on $45/hr. Believe it or not guys who charge $50/hr around these parts are considered 'painters for the stars' and other wealthy estates. That's why I am trying to get more into pressure washing - keep making money even on the rainy days. Ha - there's another good one - I don't get paid for rainy weather so my $45/hr is more like $30/hr - since New England weather seems to wreck 1/3 of the days - god it's pathetic. So if I have a helper - my gross over a period of several months during 'the good parts of the year' i.e. 7 out of 12 - is $60/hr total!!!! That's running a company and managing two workers, one being myself - yikes!

[mas3372 14]

Well I do agree that upselliing is everything, I must disagree with upselling gutter scrubs. Scrubing the gutters is including in all my hosue prices. I did one job in which the gutters were extra, the howner said no and the house looked like crap with the dirty gutters. They are now included in everything and I charge accordingly.

Foundations, wax, steps, decks, porches, gutter cleanouts etc are all upsells. And I do well with getting them.

My pickle now is what to charge for offering wax. The wet wax is affordable at $92 per 5 gallons which goes a long ways. I am thinking of charging 25% of whatever the vinyl wash was for the wax upsell, or 2.5 cents per foot square - both the same in my case. My hope and question is,will this be a fair price to charge for the upsell and will I make a consistant profit with what I make now. I figure to wash and rinse a house will take so long and the wax rinse afterwards will only take about 15% of that time. by charging 25% I am covering cost of the was and makeing a the same hourly income I need to achieve to stay afloat.

Any thoughts, Thansk.

[Tmrrptr 164]

Hello to the group...

I just gotta put my 2 cents in here. 'cuz that's abt all I got left after painting for 5 yrs or so .

We ran just over a mil in contracts a few years ago and the owner never got the wolves away from the door. Painting is labor intensive and the workers ate up what the suppliers didn't. then there was gas.

Prob is that everyone has an out of work shirt tail relative that is out of work, so he can paint it...

or the immigrants have bid it dirt cheap...

God only knows how many ways they can come up with to destroy paintwork, or the surrounding vicinity, but that was my job, to fix the blunders and indisgressions... there was no end to the different ways they mangled things.

But, some could lay down paint as good or better than I've ever seen.

And others were a literal tornado at prep work.

Waaah ! It's hard to compete...

Not sure abt the quote, but... give a customer what they pay for ?

50% of my contacts are grinders... they want 30% off the lowest tier, and then some.

Million dollar properties and all they want to do is cut corners.

Quality paint starts at $30/g, cheap is $20, and the client says they'll provide and they show up w $12g junk from glidden. After a significant investment in prep work!

Go figure.... No, i don't anymore. I just plug along.

If a decent client comes along that pays well, they get the best advice, meticulous prep, and end up with a glorious topcoat to be proud of for many years.

If they want, or pay for blo n' go, by golly we can do that too. but it hurts.

r

[mas3372 14]

Has anyone used wet wax for vinyl. If so. what conc. do you use. I want to apply thru my downstreamer. Thanks

[Don M. 14]

Mike,

I have used 8 oz to 5 gallons of mix. If it is the wet wax from Steve R you are talking about.

No need for a separate applicaton. Just add it in with your mix. I would stir your solution before you used it everytime to get the junk from the bottom of your tank.

[mas3372 14]

I actually bought it from sunbrite Don. I checked Steve's site and did not see it but found it at sunbrite so figured it was the one everyone was talking about.

If you add it in your regular mix, does it have as good of an effect than if you were to put in on after to minmize how much comes off.

How is it on windows. Does it leave them filmy?

[Barry M 73]

I actually bought it from sunbrite Don. I checked Steve's site and did not see it but found it at sunbrite so figured it was the one everyone was talking about.

If you add it in your regular mix, does it have as good of an effect than if you were to put in on after to minmize how much comes off.

How is it on windows. Does it leave them filmy?

Steve's never had it on his site, you have to call him. I'm not sure he even sells it anymore because I use to get it in the gallon size and he posted awhile back that he's not dealing with small gallon size of anything anymore. It doesn't bother window just keep them wet and rinse like normal. I think it gives the vinyl a nice luster and it definately keeps it cleaner longer.

[mas3372 14]

Thanks Barry. So for the most part, it is just a normal old house wash but with 8oz of wet wax. Thanks.

[Ron G. 14]

Mike,

Did you wash the house yet? Curious about your results. Wax?

[mas3372 14]

I did try it on one side of my house mixed with the house wash and noticed little if any difference in luster or feel. I will play again on thursday by doing a warm water rinse application to see how that works.

[Ron G. 14]

I did try it on one side of my house mixed with the house wash and noticed little if any difference in luster or feel. I will play again on thursday by doing a warm water rinse application to see how that works.

Interesting.

At the start of this thread you refered to a "chalky house". Did you wash it yet?

This friggin weather has been rediculous!:lgtear: