Beth n Rod

10/12/05 20:24:29 Beth_n_Rod: Hi Rich 10/12/05 20:24:42 Littlefield: Hey, How are things up north? 10/12/05 20:24:50 Beth_n_Rod: Wet. 10/12/05 20:25:14 Littlefield: I have a tarp over my truck tonight to keep my cob from getting wet here, too. 10/12/05 20:25:15 Beth_n_Rod: Russ will be here in a few... 10/12/05 20:25:26 Littlefield: Fine, just doing checkbook... 10/12/05 20:26:08 Russell_Cissell Logs in [172.162.205.126] 10/12/05 20:26:09 Beth_n_Rod queries IP of Russell_Cissell 10/12/05 20:26:09 Beth_n_Rod: Blasting g a house? 10/12/05 20:26:17 Littlefield: I like the new version of the board. Finally got my new avatar up with no problem. 10/12/05 20:26:17 Littlefield queries IP of Russell_Cissell 10/12/05 20:26:29 Beth_n_Rod: I noticed. Looks good! 10/12/05 20:26:31 Littlefield: Blasting an interior. 10/12/05 20:26:32 Russell_Cissell: Hello Rich 10/12/05 20:26:49 Russell_Cissell: Sorry I was not here, I didn't think this module was working 10/12/05 20:26:52 Littlefield: thanks on the business card avatar compliment. What a mouthful. 10/12/05 20:27:04 Littlefield: I Russell. 10/12/05 20:27:10 Littlefield: Sorry, HI 10/12/05 20:27:12 tropical_wave Logs in [24.13.142.208] 10/12/05 20:27:13 Beth_n_Rod queries IP of tropical_wave 10/12/05 20:27:13 Littlefield queries IP of tropical_wave 10/12/05 20:27:16 Russell_Cissell: Beth, I didn't have to log in either 10/12/05 20:27:21 Russell_Cissell: Welcome Mike 10/12/05 20:27:33 Beth_n_Rod: Neither did I. I like this upgraded module. 10/12/05 20:27:37 Russell_Cissell: I just went to the log in page and it threw me right in 10/12/05 20:27:43 Beth_n_Rod: Hi Mike 10/12/05 20:27:53 Russell_Cissell: Still no spell check! 10/12/05 20:27:58 Beth_n_Rod: Hey Rich, we have a log estimate this weekend. 10/12/05 20:28:42 Russell_Cissell: Rich, when are you going to teach me about cob blasting? 10/12/05 20:28:50 Littlefield: Cool. Is this beth or rod or both? 10/12/05 20:29:13 Beth_n_Rod: Beth. Rod's in the forums right now. 10/12/05 20:29:29 Littlefield: Russell, when you come down and work for free for a week or two. :D 10/12/05 20:29:53 Russell_Cissell: No problem! 10/12/05 20:30:14 Beth_n_Rod: Hey Rich, we want to learn cob blasting sometime! 10/12/05 20:30:20 Russell_Cissell: I work for free here is St. Louis everyday! 10/12/05 20:30:29 Russell_Cissell: Or at least close to it at times 10/12/05 20:31:07 Russell_Cissell: Sometimes those help wanted ads at McDonald's look pretty good! 10/12/05 20:31:16 Littlefield: Don't we all. I really wish after a week like the one I've been having, that I could just blast and do nothing else. 10/12/05 20:31:40 Beth_n_Rod: That doesn't sound good... 10/12/05 20:31:48 Littlefield: Got suckered into new construction work again, and the big thing is I know better. 10/12/05 20:32:14 Littlefield: Its more me kicking me than them kicking me. :) 10/12/05 20:32:21 Russell_Cissell: Last week I broke my big 3 rules all with the same person! 10/12/05 20:32:21 Beth_n_Rod: There are things about logs that intimidate me. Like repair. I will send them to you and Jon. 10/12/05 20:32:55 Beth_n_Rod: Why are you kicking you? Own worst critic? 10/12/05 20:33:33 Russell_Cissell: Sold to a Homeowner who was also a Friend and did it at a Discount! I didn't even know you could put 4.5 gallons of stain on a 10 by 12 deck! 10/12/05 20:33:46 Littlefield: I fall for the "you're a great guy, do this one and the next ones will be better organized" song and dance EVERY time. 10/12/05 20:34:11 Littlefield: Russ, I feel better now. "No good deed goes unpunished" 10/12/05 20:34:18 Beth_n_Rod: ahhh...working with a builder it sounds like. 10/12/05 20:34:22 Russell_Cissell: That is the worst!. . .Show us your work on this one and we will give you the whole complex! 10/12/05 20:34:32 Russell_Cissell: Exactly! 10/12/05 20:34:45 Beth_n_Rod: Chase that carrot! 10/12/05 20:35:14 Littlefield: Problem is they do love me...I've got a contract for 6 houses in and out. New construction manager, hes in training at the school of RICH. 10/12/05 20:35:49 Beth_n_Rod: lol an excellent school too I might add! 10/12/05 20:36:02 Beth_n_Rod: Littlefield University! 10/12/05 20:36:03 Littlefield: But the one day of blasting tomorrow will even me up for the week. 10/12/05 20:36:15 Russell_Cissell: Well tell him to make your check out to the C.enter for A.rt S.cience and H.umanity 10/12/05 20:36:23 Littlefield: Thats it, I'm starting a new business, my wife will KILL me. 10/12/05 20:37:06 Beth_n_Rod: Hey Rich what are you putting on interior logs? 10/12/05 20:37:24 Russell_Cissell: A painter I work with always tells me to make his checks out that way. 10/12/05 20:38:09 Littlefield: Good one Russell. 10/12/05 20:38:14 tropical_wave Logs Out 10/12/05 20:38:40 Russell_Cissell: Yeah, painters! 10/12/05 20:38:41 Littlefield: Beth, You'll kill me when you hear this, but the model has it and everybody seems to want the exact same thing. 10/12/05 20:38:57 Littlefield: Keep this under your hat.... 10/12/05 20:39:00 Beth_n_Rod: drum roll..... 10/12/05 20:39:32 Mike_Williamson Logs in [68.214.111.171] 10/12/05 20:39:33 Beth_n_Rod queries IP of Mike_Williamson 10/12/05 20:39:33 Littlefield: ******** 10/12/05 20:39:33 Littlefield queries IP of Mike_Williamson 10/12/05 20:39:40 Russell_Cissell: Welcome Mike 10/12/05 20:39:41 Littlefield: And don't breathe. 10/12/05 20:39:52 tropical_wave Logs in [24.13.142.208] 10/12/05 20:39:52 Beth_n_Rod queries IP of tropical_wave 10/12/05 20:39:52 Littlefield queries IP of tropical_wave 10/12/05 20:39:52 Mike_Williamson: Evening! 10/12/05 20:40:03 Beth_n_Rod: seriously? 10/12/05 20:40:06 tropical_wave Logs Out 10/12/05 20:40:09 Russell_Cissell: Welcome back Mike 10/12/05 20:40:11 Littlefield: Interior only though. I don't want anybody getting any crazy ideas. 10/12/05 20:40:19 Littlefield: Yup. 10/12/05 20:40:20 Beth_n_Rod: gotcha 10/12/05 20:40:22 Littlefield: Seriously 10/12/05 20:40:34 Littlefield: No brushing. 10/12/05 20:40:40 Littlefield: Natural finish. 10/12/05 20:40:43 Littlefield: No sheen 10/12/05 20:40:55 Beth_n_Rod: I have heard of folks wanting minwax, and see it on the logs, never applied it tho.... 10/12/05 20:40:56 Littlefield: Exactly what every one asks for around here. 10/12/05 20:41:13 Russell_Cissell: Rich, how long would you expect that to last indoors? 10/12/05 20:41:14 Littlefield: Mixing makes it like a toner, instead of stain. 10/12/05 20:41:20 Littlefield: Forever. 10/12/05 20:41:30 Beth_n_Rod: Gotcha. makes sense. 10/12/05 20:41:56 Littlefield: Sorry Russell sound smart like that. 10/12/05 20:42:01 Russell_Cissell: Do you poly over it? 10/12/05 20:42:06 Russell_Cissell: No, not at all 10/12/05 20:42:15 Littlefield: IN reality, I suppose the wood will darker as usual. 10/12/05 20:42:44 Littlefield: The golden oak is a very light pigment, but should stabilize a lot better than nothing 10/12/05 20:42:51 Beth_n_Rod: See? now THIS is a cool wood chat. 10/12/05 20:42:53 Russell_Cissell: Right 10/12/05 20:42:56 Littlefield: No poly 10/12/05 20:43:17 Russell_Cissell: Will it "wear" off like in the kitchen or near doors? 10/12/05 20:43:26 Littlefield: An you can sand a spot, slop the mix on and around, and no lapping. 10/12/05 20:43:34 Russell_Cissell: Sweet 10/12/05 20:43:34 Beth_n_Rod: Saw the inside of one once, what a mess. Polyurethane disaster. 10/12/05 20:43:44 Beth_n_Rod: oops polyurethane 10/12/05 20:43:45 Russell_Cissell: that negates the rest of my questions 10/12/05 20:44:01 Littlefield: Russell, I did see fingerprints on the doors 10/12/05 20:44:08 Littlefield: I haven' 10/12/05 20:44:11 Littlefield: t 10/12/05 20:44:42 Beth_n_Rod: It was on a house that was a horrible insect disaster. 10/12/05 20:44:43 Littlefield: Sorry, I haven't tried cleaning a spot yet, this is what the builder has been using, so I'm new to it as well. 10/12/05 20:45:04 Littlefield: Poly and lacquer can really be screwed up good. 10/12/05 20:45:11 Russell_Cissell: Rich, that is interesting stuff 10/12/05 20:45:14 Littlefield: I like water based poly, usually. 10/12/05 20:45:46 Littlefield: What I really want to look into, is if I can coat this tint mix with water based poly to finish it off better. 10/12/05 20:46:21 Russell_Cissell: We have been doing some lab work with different water based systems. I am having a hard time falling in love with them, for stain. 10/12/05 20:46:34 Russell_Cissell: Yikes! 10/12/05 20:46:53 Russell_Cissell: I am going to guess no, and let me tell you why. 10/12/05 20:47:30 Littlefield: I'm listening, something about wax...? 10/12/05 20:47:50 Russell_Cissell: With what you have on there already, the water based system is going to want to break up. Like painting plastic. 10/12/05 20:48:11 Littlefield: By the way, I'm really starting to agree with you on the water based stain thing. 10/12/05 20:48:24 Littlefield: So fish eyes on the surface, huh? 10/12/05 20:48:35 Russell_Cissell: Exactly, that would be my prediction 10/12/05 20:49:56 Littlefield: So, enough about me, whats new with you guys? 10/12/05 20:50:05 Littlefield: Beth, whats on the log home? 10/12/05 20:50:24 Littlefield: *bleep* 10/12/05 20:50:33 Beth_n_Rod: Which one? lol the one this weekend I don't know yet 10/12/05 20:50:38 Littlefield: I love this thing. 10/12/05 20:50:52 Littlefield: Like ringing a doorbell a thousand miles away. 10/12/05 20:50:57 Beth_n_Rod: The one with all the insect damage, the sale fell through for the buyer. 10/12/05 20:51:02 Littlefield: AH. 10/12/05 20:51:13 Mike_Williamson: *bird* *choochoo* *harp* *evil* 10/12/05 20:51:16 Beth_n_Rod: Serious log issues 10/12/05 20:51:22 Russell_Cissell: I have one I wouldn't mind talking about 10/12/05 20:51:29 Beth_n_Rod: Don't think we wanted that job... 10/12/05 20:51:36 Littlefield: How did that interior job work out for Rod? 10/12/05 20:51:44 Littlefield: Go ahead, Russ. 10/12/05 20:51:52 Beth_n_Rod: Waiting to get the contract back. I'm sure it will be fine. 10/12/05 20:52:14 Russell_Cissell: Just haired the nicest gal in the world. Her and her husband retired out to "gods country" 10/12/05 20:52:18 Beth_n_Rod: Owner is gonna have us roll up the wall to wall rug while we are at it... 10/12/05 20:52:24 Russell_Cissell: built a nice log cabin 10/12/05 20:52:47 Littlefield: Yeeessss? 10/12/05 20:52:50 Russell_Cissell: The sub who was contracted to stain it did not wash first 10/12/05 20:52:55 Russell_Cissell: stained with TWP 10/12/05 20:53:07 Littlefield: ;) 10/12/05 20:53:09 Russell_Cissell: if instantly was over come with mildew 10/12/05 20:53:19 Russell_Cissell: sorry, it was instantly. . . . 10/12/05 20:53:34 Russell_Cissell: That is nothing surprising 10/12/05 20:53:48 Russell_Cissell: when I went to inspect the job I found something new to me. 10/12/05 20:53:58 Russell_Cissell: White mushrooms growing out of the logs 10/12/05 20:54:10 Littlefield: Amazing how many builders think cleaning is an option. 10/12/05 20:54:13 Russell_Cissell: healthy looking white mushrooms 10/12/05 20:54:18 Littlefield: Mushrooms?! 10/12/05 20:54:19 shaner Logs in [66.210.117.240] 10/12/05 20:54:20 Littlefield queries IP of shaner 10/12/05 20:54:27 Russell_Cissell: Forgive my typing this evening 10/12/05 20:54:43 Russell_Cissell: Rich, have you ever seen these white mushrooms? 10/12/05 20:54:44 Littlefield: Big time rot there? Did you check with moisture meter? 10/12/05 20:54:51 Littlefield: No. 10/12/05 20:55:01 shaner Logs Out 10/12/05 20:55:18 Russell_Cissell: I don't put much faith in moisture meters, but the wood was sealed when damp 10/12/05 20:56:14 Littlefield: I'm just wondering if the state Ag dept at the college can identify the mushroom and tell you the moisture requirements for growth, you'll know if you're looking at a rot problem. 10/12/05 20:56:20 Russell_Cissell: Most of the inside of the home has mold and mildew before the painter came to seal the interior 10/12/05 20:56:25 Littlefield: Or just stick a screwdriver in the log. 10/12/05 20:56:32 Russell_Cissell: Right! 10/12/05 20:56:40 Littlefield: Did he seal that too? 10/12/05 20:57:02 Littlefield: Do they need it blasted off and sanded down? Cause I know a guy... 10/12/05 20:57:07 Beth_n_Rod: Catch you guys later. Rich, great talking with you again. Keep in touch. 10/12/05 20:57:12 Beth_n_Rod Logs Out 10/12/05 20:57:14 Russell_Cissell: No, the "kit" supplier suggested they hit it with bleach first 10/12/05 20:57:16 Littlefield: See you Beth 10/12/05 20:57:23 Littlefield: Figures. 10/12/05 20:57:55 Russell_Cissell: The poor lady is in a law suit with the builder, finish contractor and the kit supplier 10/12/05 20:58:02 Littlefield: Seems like that is assumed to be due diligence for all the stain manufacturers, log home builders, kit suppliers, etc. 10/12/05 20:58:21 Russell_Cissell: it is a big old point fest 10/12/05 20:58:23 Littlefield: I'm available for expert witness testimony.... 10/12/05 20:58:25 Russell_Cissell: What is that Rich? 10/12/05 20:58:46 Russell_Cissell: Well, unfortunately so am I. That is how I met her in the first place. 10/12/05 20:59:38 Littlefield: Basically that they think nothing will stand up in court against them if they have recommended that bleach be applied. 10/12/05 21:00:07 Aplus Logs in [68.42.235.8] 10/12/05 21:00:07 Littlefield queries IP of Aplus 10/12/05 21:00:14 Russell_Cissell: Oh, is that the trick? 10/12/05 21:00:20 Aplus Logs Out 10/12/05 21:00:23 Russell_Cissell: Welcome Tony 10/12/05 21:00:25 Littlefield: Either you then used it wrongly, because there is a problem, or didn't follow the directions and use it at all. 10/12/05 21:00:28 Russell_Cissell: Bye Tony 10/12/05 21:00:49 Aplus Logs in [68.42.235.8] 10/12/05 21:00:49 Littlefield queries IP of Aplus 10/12/05 21:00:52 Aplus Logs Out 10/12/05 21:00:55 Russell_Cissell: I know the contractor sealed over mildew 10/12/05 21:01:07 Littlefield: Obviously the surfaced prep is bad. I agree. 10/12/05 21:01:37 Russell_Cissell: It could also be the kit supplier. I don't know if the logs were too wet to start with. 10/12/05 21:01:57 Littlefield: Other than observation, how would you prove that the mildew is on top of or below the stain? 10/12/05 21:02:06 Russell_Cissell: Obviously the finish contractor blew it on prep too. 10/12/05 21:02:31 Littlefield: Still, if the logs were wet, the applicator should have checked the moisture content. 10/12/05 21:02:39 Russell_Cissell: Would be hard to "prove" but I know it from exp. I know how mildew grows when it is "sealed" in 10/12/05 21:02:52 Russell_Cissell: Fast and dark 10/12/05 21:03:01 Russell_Cissell: True 10/12/05 21:03:04 Littlefield: Like crazy, huh? got a lot of that under Sikkens here. 10/12/05 21:03:48 Littlefield: Mike, chip in here any time, don't mean to exclude you. *choochoo* 10/12/05 21:04:02 Russell_Cissell: Not that the stain will ever last 30 years, but there is enough to kill a bit of mildew 10/12/05 21:04:31 Littlefield: Any truth to the idea that you can only put so much in a stain or paint and ship across state lines? 10/12/05 21:04:31 Russell_Cissell: Yeah, don't mean to be rude! 10/12/05 21:04:49 Russell_Cissell: Depends on What you are talking about 10/12/05 21:05:09 Littlefield: Is that why most try to upsell the mildewcide additive, or are they just trying to make a buck on something they should have put in? 10/12/05 21:05:13 Russell_Cissell: if you mean anti-fungal, I have never heard of that. Sounds like paint store law to me 10/12/05 21:05:41 Russell_Cissell: It is so expensive. 10/12/05 21:05:58 Littlefield: No. I think mildewcide only, like M-1. 10/12/05 21:06:03 Littlefield: Gotcha. 10/12/05 21:06:47 Littlefield: And how long will a mildewcide last? Does it depend on the moisture than comes in contact with the product its in? 10/12/05 21:07:12 Littlefield: Like micro encapsulated pesticides? 10/12/05 21:07:20 Littlefield: I've heard a lot of things... 10/12/05 21:07:43 Russell_Cissell: You put in a % based on how long you want the protection 10/12/05 21:07:56 Littlefield: Did you get to read my post on the tinting vs. packaging thing with the wtw? 10/12/05 21:08:07 Littlefield: Ah. 10/12/05 21:08:08 Russell_Cissell: I would say moisture moving in and out of the system would speed up the dissipation of the protection. 10/12/05 21:08:19 Russell_Cissell: No, not yet 10/12/05 21:08:38 Russell_Cissell: I think we will go with both options next year 10/12/05 21:08:49 Littlefield: See which works? 10/12/05 21:08:59 Russell_Cissell: But hey!, lets not talk about our stuff tonight! 10/12/05 21:09:04 Aplus Logs in [68.42.235.8] 10/12/05 21:09:04 Littlefield queries IP of Aplus 10/12/05 21:09:16 Littlefield: I'm thinking you could get a cool thread or two on the swapping formulas thing in the future. 10/12/05 21:09:26 Littlefield: Hey tony 10/12/05 21:09:27 Aplus Logs Out 10/12/05 21:09:34 Russell_Cissell: How is that/ 10/12/05 21:09:43 Russell_Cissell: Aghhh, I am doing it again 10/12/05 21:09:48 Littlefield: Must be getting kicked out with his software or something 10/12/05 21:10:11 Aplus Logs in [68.42.235.8] 10/12/05 21:10:11 Littlefield queries IP of Aplus 10/12/05 21:10:13 Aplus Logs Out 10/12/05 21:10:25 Littlefield: Do you have two or three colors that get added to make the final colors? 10/12/05 21:10:39 Littlefield: Like red, brown, yellow? 10/12/05 21:10:50 Russell_Cissell: No, just red and black in the tint system 10/12/05 21:11:01 Littlefield: OK, so yellow is the base? 10/12/05 21:11:06 Russell_Cissell: black is added at 0.1% 10/12/05 21:11:12 Russell_Cissell: Right, yellow is the base 10/12/05 21:11:20 Russell_Cissell: yellow is at 10% 10/12/05 21:11:34 Littlefield: Do you have formulas do create several different colors? 10/12/05 21:11:42 Russell_Cissell: red you can add till your heart is content 10/12/05 21:11:45 Littlefield: To create 10/12/05 21:11:51 Russell_Cissell: Well, yes and no 10/12/05 21:12:04 Russell_Cissell: I will tell you on paper, but will never give you a picture of the color 10/12/05 21:12:19 Littlefield: Are the formulas for the old colors already on paper? 10/12/05 21:12:29 Russell_Cissell: If I give you a picture, you will show your customer and then they will expect the final result to match that picture. 10/12/05 21:12:36 Russell_Cissell: sure 10/12/05 21:12:38 Littlefield: Gotcha 10/12/05 21:13:01 Russell_Cissell: Brown sugar is Warm Honey gold plus 0.01% black 10/12/05 21:13:20 Russell_Cissell: Western cedar is WHG + 1/2 pint red 10/12/05 21:13:29 Littlefield: So, you create something that spans several popular shades, and the contractor has to pick which one to sample for the customer. 10/12/05 21:13:43 Russell_Cissell: I think that is nuts! 10/12/05 21:13:58 Littlefield: Obviously expectation management is the key. 10/12/05 21:14:02 Littlefield: Nuts? 10/12/05 21:14:27 Russell_Cissell: I tell the customer that they hire me because I am the professional. I ask them if they like natural or something a bit more red? Then I apply what I think they want. 10/12/05 21:14:45 Littlefield: No, no. 10/12/05 21:15:03 Russell_Cissell: For years I was TWP 101 or call someone else 10/12/05 21:15:32 Russell_Cissell: If you threatened to beat me I would apply 102 but that was it 10/12/05 21:15:55 Littlefield: Really? 10/12/05 21:16:08 Russell_Cissell: When I let a customer pick a color they expect it to match. I guess my way is taking expectation management to the max 10/12/05 21:16:28 Russell_Cissell: Yea, in St Louis there is more wood than workers. 10/12/05 21:16:54 Russell_Cissell: It's not like you have to fight for the work 10/12/05 21:16:59 Littlefield: I agree, give them three choices at the most. Something like brown, something like red, or something like natural. 10/12/05 21:17:22 Russell_Cissell: OK, that works! 10/12/05 21:17:31 Littlefield: I don't give a tone of choices, either. 10/12/05 21:17:40 Russell_Cissell: so with that, you can not mix a color "wrong" 10/12/05 21:17:46 Littlefield: Sorry, ton of choices. 10/12/05 21:18:19 Littlefield: You got it, no wrong mixes, just different than what they might have exactly envisioned. 10/12/05 21:18:57 Littlefield: I'm mostly with pine and PT here, no cedar to speak of. What color would you recommend? 10/12/05 21:19:11 Russell_Cissell: Not Warm Honey Gold! 10/12/05 21:19:22 Russell_Cissell: Base plus 0.1% black 10/12/05 21:19:24 Littlefield: What, no pumpkin houses for me? 10/12/05 21:19:35 Littlefield: How much does the tint cost? 10/12/05 21:19:49 Russell_Cissell: The black makes it finish more cedar colored on yellow or white wood 10/12/05 21:19:57 Russell_Cissell: $19.95 per pint 10/12/05 21:20:02 Littlefield: What happens if I go to 0.2% black? 10/12/05 21:20:17 Russell_Cissell: Green 10/12/05 21:20:37 Littlefield: And how many oz is .1% in a fiver? 10/12/05 21:20:37 Russell_Cissell: 1 pint of black will last you forever 10/12/05 21:20:45 Littlefield: Yikes on the green. 10/12/05 21:20:59 Russell_Cissell: it is 45 ml 10/12/05 21:21:12 Littlefield: Is it set up with a syringe or something? 10/12/05 21:21:20 Russell_Cissell: I supply lab pippets so it is exactly 3 squirts per gallon 10/12/05 21:21:27 Littlefield: Cool. 10/12/05 21:21:44 Littlefield: And the red added makes it look like what, redwood? 10/12/05 21:21:47 Russell_Cissell: The red is like up to 1/2 pint per 5er 10/12/05 21:22:08 Littlefield: What does black and red get you? 10/12/05 21:22:18 Russell_Cissell: At 1/2 pint per 5 er it is that western cedar color we used to sling 10/12/05 21:22:27 Russell_Cissell: A nice rich brown 10/12/05 21:22:56 Littlefield: Just for curiosity sakes, wondering exactly how badly a helper or something could screw up the house....:) 10/12/05 21:23:05 Littlefield: Browns not bad, though. 10/12/05 21:23:13 Russell_Cissell: Oh, they could total it! 10/12/05 21:23:21 Littlefield: So if you get crazy with the black, just add red... 10/12/05 21:23:28 Russell_Cissell: We are talking burn it down and start all over! 10/12/05 21:23:36 Russell_Cissell: Pretty much yes 10/12/05 21:23:40 Littlefield: Not that I would ever let them see me mix up. 10/12/05 21:23:59 Russell_Cissell: Black is much more sensitive, that is why we have the lab pipettes 10/12/05 21:24:16 Littlefield: I'd have to talk in mysterious tones about going to the lab again to get the color "just right". 10/12/05 21:24:31 Russell_Cissell: If you go a squirt or two over the 3 squirt limit you will not destroy anything 10/12/05 21:24:35 Littlefield: *evil* 10/12/05 21:24:43 Russell_Cissell: Oh yeah 10/12/05 21:24:47 Mike_Williamson Logs Out 10/12/05 21:24:58 Russell_Cissell: Good night Mike 10/12/05 21:25:30 Aplus Logs in [68.42.235.8] 10/12/05 21:25:30 Littlefield queries IP of Aplus 10/12/05 21:25:35 Aplus Logs Out 10/12/05 21:25:38 Littlefield: I guess its getting late, I'm going to call Sunbrite in the morning to see about some of the WTW I want to try on a couple houses coming up. 10/12/05 21:25:57 Littlefield: Use the DMC if its old and dry, right? 10/12/05 21:25:58 Russell_Cissell: Good, that will make Pete happy 10/12/05 21:26:02 Littlefield: Do I tint that? 10/12/05 21:26:13 Russell_Cissell: You could tint it 10/12/05 21:26:19 Littlefield: Pete's always happy. ;) 10/12/05 21:26:19 Russell_Cissell: DMC is overkill 10/12/05 21:26:29 Littlefield: Overkill? 10/12/05 21:26:36 Russell_Cissell: unless the wood is on it's last leg 10/12/05 21:26:42 Littlefield: Ah 10/12/05 21:26:52 Littlefield: WTW is deep enough, huh? 10/12/05 21:27:06 Aplus Logs in [68.42.235.8] 10/12/05 21:27:06 Littlefield queries IP of Aplus 10/12/05 21:27:06 Russell_Cissell: It is like a miracle on really neglected cedar siding 10/12/05 21:27:14 Aplus Logs Out 10/12/05 21:27:16 Russell_Cissell: yes, wtw is plenty deep 10/12/05 21:27:41 Littlefield: Is the DMC more to match up with RS? 10/12/05 21:28:02 squirtgun Logs in [68.217.222.47] 10/12/05 21:28:03 Littlefield queries IP of squirtgun 10/12/05 21:28:14 Russell_Cissell: Welcome Squirtgun 10/12/05 21:28:19 squirtgun Logs Out 10/12/05 21:28:24 Russell_Cissell: chat is not working exactly right 10/12/05 21:28:30 Littlefield: Guess not. 10/12/05 21:28:47 Russell_Cissell: I am thinking some of these guys are not able to stay in here 10/12/05 21:29:12 Russell_Cissell: I am thinking I am about to hit it too 10/12/05 21:29:16 Littlefield: Must be something with their software. 10/12/05 21:29:28 Russell_Cissell: They are working through an upgrade 10/12/05 21:29:31 Littlefield: thanks for talking so late, see ya, too. 10/12/05 21:29:47 Littlefield Logs Out 10/12/05 21:29:50 Russell_Cissell: I didn't think it was working at all until Beth called and said you were sitting in here 10/12/05 21:30:04 Russell_Cissell Logs Out 10/12/05 21:30:13 squirtgun Logs in [68.217.222.47] 10/12/05 21:31:13 squirtgun Logs Out 10/12/05 21:41:36 squirtgun Logs in [68.217.222.47] 10/12/05 21:42:27 squirtgun Logs Out 10/12/05 21:48:28 squirtgun Logs in [68.217.222.47] 10/12/05 21:48:30 squirtgun Logs Out 10/12/05 21:50:09 Aplus Logs in [68.42.235.8] 10/12/05 21:50:11 Aplus Logs Out 10/12/05 21:50:14 squirtgun Logs in [68.217.222.47] 10/12/05 21:50:27 squirtgun Logs Out 10/12/05 21:50:38 squirtgun Logs in [127.0.0.1] 10/12/05 21:50:38 squirtgun Disconnects 10/12/05 21:51:00 Aplus Logs in [68.42.235.8] 10/12/05 21:51:07 Aplus Logs Out 10/12/05 21:52:04 Aplus Logs in [68.42.235.8] 10/12/05 21:59:20 Don_Phelps Logs in [68.18.25.238] 10/12/05 21:59:20 Aplus queries IP of Don_Phelps 10/12/05 22:00:14 NEWHEIGHTS Logs in [67.165.209.190] 10/12/05 22:00:14 Aplus queries IP of NEWHEIGHTS 10/12/05 22:00:14 Don_Phelps queries IP of NEWHEIGHTS 10/12/05 22:00:23 NEWHEIGHTS Logs Out 10/12/05 22:00:31 NEWHEIGHTS Logs in [67.165.209.190] 10/12/05 22:00:31 Aplus queries IP of NEWHEIGHTS 10/12/05 22:00:31 Don_Phelps queries IP of NEWHEIGHTS 10/12/05 22:01:07 NEWHEIGHTS Logs Out 10/12/05 22:02:02 NEWHEIGHTS Logs in [67.165.209.190] 10/12/05 22:02:02 Aplus queries IP of NEWHEIGHTS 10/12/05 22:02:02 Don_Phelps queries IP of NEWHEIGHTS 10/12/05 22:02:04 NEWHEIGHTS Logs Out 10/12/05 22:03:52 the_GUNN_man Logs in [24.247.252.102] 10/12/05 22:03:52 Aplus queries IP of the_GUNN_man 10/12/05 22:03:52 Don_Phelps queries IP of the_GUNN_man 10/12/05 22:04:04 the_GUNN_man: Hey Tony you there 10/12/05 22:05:26 the_GUNN_man Logs Out 10/12/05 22:06:52 Don_Phelps Logs Out 10/12/05 22:08:50 NEWHEIGHTS Logs in [67.165.209.190] 10/12/05 22:08:50 Aplus queries IP of NEWHEIGHTS 10/12/05 22:09:00 NEWHEIGHTS Logs Out 10/12/05 22:11:41 Don_Phelps Logs in [68.18.25.238] 10/12/05 22:11:41 Aplus queries IP of Don_Phelps 10/12/05 22:11:46 Don_Phelps Logs Out 10/12/05 22:37:36 Aplus Logs Out 10/12/05 23:32:21 Aplus Logs in [68.42.235.8] 10/12/05 23:32:58 Aplus Logs Out 10/12/05 23:33:13 Aplus Logs in [68.42.235.8] 10/12/05 23:33:17 Aplus Logs Out 10/12/05 23:36:10 Aplus Logs in [68.42.235.8] 10/12/05 23:36:13 Aplus Logs Out 10/12/05 23:36:20 Aplus Logs in [68.42.235.8] 10/12/05 23:36:43 Aplus Logs Out 10/12/05 23:40:02 Aplus Logs in [68.42.235.8] 10/12/05 23:40:05 Aplus Logs Out 10/12/05 23:50:58 squirtgun Logs in [68.217.222.47] 10/12/05 23:51:14 squirtgun Logs Out

Jeff, We also have a mobilization fee for trips over an hour in duration and as Beth mentioned, we have to pay for the employee's time from the shop and back. Not to mention the fuel, insurance, tags, maintenance...it adds up. Set up and break down time are not considered job production so this time is eaten up by the clock in necessary procedure relevant to the project. We calculate 15-30 minutes on each end that needs to be covered as well. As a rule, $75-$150 mobilization fees pertain to the number of crew sent per vehicle to a site. This is listed as a line item for our commercial projects and no one has ever balked about it. It is common in commercial contracting when hiring long distance contractors from a home location that they prefer to use. I guess it saves them time in trying to find another contractor more local to the project that is reliable. Hope this helps. Rod~

Hi all, The chat module was upgraded yesterday evening, and we had a chat, but no testing was done prior to that event. We saw a whole bunch of folks pop in and out of chat. Question is...was there a problem staying in the room, was this a BBS issue or what (a few folks have had issues staying logged in on the BBS)? We want to make sure we know if there are any technical issues that need to be addressed. If you get error messages we need to know what they say specifically, or if the chat or BBS acted a certain way repeatedly we need to know what happened. You can also download the most current Java software here: http://www.java.com/en/ Thanks :) Beth

A simple philosophy to use is one that is derived in the basic essence of community support and growth: Keep others in mind before you. We are all here for our own reasons but those reasons should never be for negative pursuits. These as we have seen, only create negativity in the community and as proved by so many posters who have made it clear that they do not want any part of that, it is something that is the responsibility of each of us to make sure we are representing ourselves in the best image possible. Your character and professionalism imparted in each post contributed becomes a reflection of the community as a whole. Let us reflect the best of ourselves here. Many are watching. Thank you Everett for joining us, we have missed your presence. You may have not been talking about TGS but in light of your recent posts, we feel we would be missing out if we didn't look at this also as an opportunity to better our community. Thank you in advance for all who are a part of TGS and are willing to help make it one of the great BBS's for all to benefit from. Rod~

Hi Jeff, Here in Maryland, you have to pay employees for the time as they travel to and from jobs. If you go out of town to work, they are on the clock then too. What we do, is take all of that into consideration and it is a part of the price estimated. We have in the past had to explain to folks why our price may be higher, and that's fine. Most folks when you explain it to them, understand and then have a way to compare the estimate they are looking at. If contractor A is higher than contractor B, but B is in their town and A is an hour away, it's easy to see the costs are higher. Bottom line then becomes is your service worth the additional expense in the mind of the consumer? Hope this helps. Think sunshine! Enough rain already. :sunshine: Beth

Tony, I hear you.... One reason (there were several) why we gave up kitchen hoods so quickly was...working in the middle of the night....ugh. Beth

Hi Cindy! Pat yourself on the back! That is quite an undertaking for a homeowner. Post pics of the deck when you are ready, and I'm sure you'll get feedback. There are lots of folks here online who do deck work. Enjoy that beautiful home in all that snow you guys get. Beth

Thank you, thank you, thank you! Boy did you nail it! Beth

At times it can be a real challenge managing this BBS. All the Forum Leaders here are volunteers with only as much time to offer, as their busy schedules will allow. We don't get to each and every thread on here, and they don't either. There are times a post gets missed that should get caught and dealt with. For that, I apologize. If the professionalism on this BBS has slipped at all, I am sorry for that and believe me it will be addressed. There are times I get caught up myself in threads. It's not easy. I believe a good step for anyone online is to embrace professionalism and live it. By living it and embodying it we will emulate it. That's not as easy as it sounds, when you are sore, tired, and running low on energy. When you have a day where a piece of equipment goes out and throws your schedule out the window, when an employee doesn't show up, when you are working long days and weekends, it adds up. It takes a toll and makes it hard to remain professional. I have thought about this all afternoon. Everett's post speaks volumes. I've also spent quite a bit of time on the telephone, with various people whom I respect. This BBS could be better than it is. Continuous improvement is important in our personal lives, our businesses and in our communities. I miss the posts from some of the folks who have not been around in a while, and I echo Everett's sentiment that it would be nice to see them return. Some of the folks I spoke to today, made positive suggestions to help improve the community here, and I want to say thank you - you know who you are. Anyone who wants to help make this BBS a better community than it is now, let me know. Member participation is always encouraged here. Maybe I have not made that clear enough, but it is. Beth

I am one who cannot see the benefit of only removing the gum and leaving the rest of the concrete dirty. To me it is just doing half the job and I dont bid these. The whole enchilada or nada. Otherwise, like Tony said Rod~

Just a thought, sounds like a spike in the electrical system but it is hard to tell from the description. Anything else unusual going on around the burner unit? Rod~

:lgangry: I have already edited two posts for content. There is no need to bicker, or try to push each others buttons or call one another out here. Any two adults who have personal problems need to take them offline, and resolve them privately. We're trying to focus here on bettering the BBS and the industry, and our goal is to provide helpful, professional information and support through networking. Thank you! Beth

Mathew, did you see the film Koyaanisqatsi (Life out of Balace)? You might like that too if you have not seen it. Beth

Anyone ever read Future Shock by Alvin Toffler? Change is inevitable. :lgbugeyes Pass the Excedrin. You know, as I think back a few years, it occurs to me Everett has a point. Maybe a part of it, is the new folks who we see each year, and some folks, who don't need to be here like they used to. Some also go out of business, others just don't share like they used to. I do remember that the BBS's on the net overall, seemed a little different in attitude and to that end, culture. Does anyone remember in school what it was like when you were in the youngest class? Then when you were a senior? After you moved on, it was strange coming back. I'm not saying this is the same thing, but it does have a feel to it, that reminds me of that. BBS's in general are great tools. But they will only ever be as good, no matter how well built, as the community that embraces them and works to build them. BBS's are a product of the users and their input of data. In PC terms, the acronym GIGO comes to mind...Garbage In Garbage Out. What you put into any forum, is what you and others who will come after you, will take away from it. I'm going to risk staying on my soapbox here for a minute... Folks, if you want a professional forum, full of helpful information to come to, it is up to you all to keep it this way. The TGS staff can't do it all themselves, it's your community. Help it grow and be what you all need it to be. If you have found these forums to be helpful, give back. Help others here. I could go on, and I'm sure I'll post more at another point, but I really would love to hear more from others on this too. There is no reason at all we can't have this forum be like forums were 5 years ago as Everett recalls them. Only thing is, it takes the work of all of us to do it. Beth

I know a guy in VA. Bates McLean of Spray and Clean. He has one and loves it especially for the price. Rod~

Here's a helpful guide to Boolean searching. The recent upgrade to the forums included the ability to perform Boolean searches. Hope this helps. Happy searching! http://catalog.loc.gov/help/boolean.htm Beth boolean.doc

Doesn't that guy ever get tired of banging that bell? Why hasn't it gotten dented yet from all that banging? When will the stick break? Inquiring minds... Beth :cup:

We have run into this before. There have to be periods of less foot traffic. The manager should know when they are least busy. Also we used traffic cones and caution tape and sectioned off areas to work, then moved cones, and did the other area. Even in the least busy time you still get foot traffic. Hope this helps. Beth :cup: <--- starbucks!

There is some great info on corporate structure and taxes here. How about starting another thread for it? Thanks... Beth

Oh oh oh!!! Can we have Germantown? Sorry Henry, couldn't resist ribbing you in your moment of generosity. Beth

I bought one of those handy pumps that you mentioned to fill my machine on the Ford so I didnt have to climg into the bed to add gas. Works really well for me and for just under $20 from northern tool, it saves on my back... Item #169471-2601 "HAN-D PUMP" Rod~

Now that's scarry... Anyone ever had a chemical respiratory burn? Beth

We have a forum here called The Library. There is also quite a bit in the FAQ area. (see buttons up top) Beth

Ya'll have been sniffing too much ... Bleach. hahaha :banana: Beth

lol..you have to be on the wagon for a week...just one week...you can do it! Just think...new games....must wait for....new games...new features...better arcade!!! Beth