Beth n Rod

The word isn't exactly the best choice in my opinion either. I feel very badly for those who are displaced from their homes and have lost so much, but as I understand it these folks had days (plural) of notice and plenty of urging to leave. That's hard to ignore too. It's really hard to wrap my mind around leaving yourself in harm's way, and their children or other loved ones in harms way. Personally I would have beat feet out of N.O. I would like to see areas that are frequently victims of hurricanes do things like take all public transportation and school buses and take them into the area of the city where folks migh be less able to leave, for not having transportation of their own, and get them out. (of course not all are willing to go and refuse the help) The looters - well, stealing is wrong. (Though Shall Not Steal) I can understand the food and water and medicine, but I have no compassion for looters taking TV's, jewelry, and other things they are trying to create an income with. (yes, they sell and trade them) One entry found for refugee. http://www.m-w.com/cgi-bin/dictionary?book=Dictionary&va=refugee Main Entry: ref·u·gee Pronunciation: "re-fyu-'jE, 're-fyu-" Function: noun Etymology: French réfugié, past participle of (se) réfugier to take refuge, from Latin refugium : one that flees; especially : a person who flees to a foreign country or power to escape danger or persecution - ref·u·gee·ism /-"i-z&m/ noun Beth

Hello Everyone, We're please to announce the launch of The Grime Scene's latest feature, our online chat module. It is our hope that this feature will provide our members with yet another means of communicating and learning. Up on the button bar there is a Calendar button. Our members can schedule chats they wish to hold, by placing them in the calendar. When I see a calendar item, I'll email members and let them know about your chat, so others can join in. Please be specific in your topic. Examples: Fleets Kitchen Exhaust Wood Care Floor Care House Washing Marketing Sales Business Basics Computer Basics There are tons of them...this barely skins the surface. Have fun! Beth & Rod

As an update....we encourage all vendors to schedule chats. There is no fee for this. To do this, simply: 1. add your topic to the calendar to book your time 2. place a thread in the appropriate forum. We suggest doing this between 3-5 days before the event. Even longer if you can. 3. remind people via the "shout box" (water cooler) about the event the day before and the day of the meeting. This is the responsability of the chat host. Beth

There are two sides to every issues. Then there is the saying about walking a mile in another man's shoes... This is a heated topic. This is also a reminder to remain professional and respectful of others opinions. Not saying anyone is over the edge - yet. But I can see the tension mounting. Let's keep it cool all.... Beth :cup:

Yes. Call me in the evening, and I'll give you the info. For hosting we use www.f5hosting.com and are very happy with them. I can give you some solid info on building sites too. Beth

Do a Test patch first! Rod~

Some lessons are the hardest learned...I wont even touch a painted deck anymore. When customer ask what they should do, I will make a striking gesture with my hand akin to lighting a match and just laugh. All I can offer the client is to rebuild the deck from the joists on up. Replace the floor boards, rails and spindles and anything else that has paint on it. When they ask me why I wont strip it with strippers meant for paint, I just tell them that I will not expose myself or anyone else to that stuff for any amount. Rod~

I have stripped Cabot and it comes off well with HD-80 at about 6-7oz/gal. You can also offer the customer 2 options... 1-strip it and then prime and stain 2-wash it then prime and stain The options offer some price breaks there but #2 is the least offensive to the wood. Also, keep in mind that this is w/o me seeing the previous job and whether or not there has been any peeling or leveling problems with the prior coat. Take it into consideration as you have probably seen the deck. Rod~

I would suggest stripping the deck with HD-80, neutralize with Citralic, then I would suggest using the Cabot's solid stain if they still wish to go with a solid. Get Cabot's Problem Solver primer, prime it, then apply the Cabot's solid deck stain over top. I would be leary of applying a semi-transparent - only because you might have residual blue pigment left. Beth

There is a saying about how one person can ruin things for so many others. Any one person can leave a bad taste in someone else's mouth. Multiply that, and you can see why people are so upset with those who would make the relief efforts harder than they need to be. If everyone would pitch in and help, dig down deep and find some compassion in thier hearts it would help. But one thing people feel when hurt, is anger. No escaping it. Makes it harder to be compassionate. No matter how you slice it, this is a horrible event. Natural disasters are terrible things. Beth

Pam & Cujo, Bravo! What a wonderful thing you have done to touch the live of those who really needed something to uplift them. God bless you both for sharing the love. Beth

Scott (racechaser)- Yes, Dad's in Hammond. I'll PM you some info. I have been out of town for a few days. Beth

Hey Leevitalone - Actually, the vendors who are in the lst all give GREAT SUPPORT and are VERY helpful and patient with newbies. There is nothing wrong with suggesting he call them. By the way....aluminum is NOT a self cleaning surface. If it were, algae and mildew would not grow on it now would they? There is no such thing as maintenance free. Also searching and reading yields some really helpful results as well. By viewing the FAQ area that we have that is specific to house washing, you'll also get more info. http://www.thegrimescene.com/forums/faq.php?faq=new_faq_item5000 Have a better day.... Beth

Camille Hammond 7651 Blueberry Hill Lane Ellicott City, MD 21043 410-796-6370 Deck wash & seal

Hey Paul, Happy birthday to you! Hope you have a great day! :cheers: :bday: :bandplay: :dancing: Beth & Rod

Jim, We didn't have a learning curve. We have also been using Cabot's and Sikkens in prior years as well. We didn't have to change marketing, or learn anything new. All we had to do was thin a few pails down of the first release of the Wood Tux Wet formula, until the thinner sprayable release was out. It might have been a surprise initially, but not a show stopper. Also, true to their word Extreme Solutions stood by the product and upheld promises they made. It may not have happened overnight, but it did happen. Beth

Dock looks great though... Beth

Way cool Jon! Looks great! How did you keep the stripper and sealer out of the water? Beth

Saw it here for $3.25 today.

Actually Jim....There is. We just received ten beautiful pails today of nice...THIN...sprayable...Wood Tux Wet. Ta Da! Beth

Welcome Trent! Glad to see you here. Beth

08/31/05 19:44:41 Russell_C: Welcome to Wood-Chat! 08/31/05 19:44:55 Russell_C: We will be getting started in just a few mins. here 08/31/05 19:49:43 BethnRod Logs in [63.28.39.188] 08/31/05 19:49:57 BethnRod: Evening all 08/31/05 19:50:01 Russell_C: Hey Beth! 08/31/05 19:50:15 Russell_C: Just getting ready to get started here 08/31/05 19:51:24 BethnRod: Im sure Rod will pop in for a little while... 08/31/05 19:51:39 Russell_C: That would be great 08/31/05 19:52:56 Rod Logs in [63.28.39.188] 08/31/05 19:53:57 Russell_C: Hey Rod. . .gonna kick things off in a bit here 08/31/05 19:53:59 Rod: Hello, 08/31/05 19:54:15 Rod: good on ya mate' 08/31/05 19:54:49 Rod: I think it will be a good nite for all who come in to chat. 08/31/05 19:54:57 BethnRod: Brb - helping new users get signed on and such. 08/31/05 19:59:38 flimmy11 Logs Out 08/31/05 19:59:51 flimmy11 Logs in [68.162.184.65] 08/31/05 20:00:34 PressureProsInc Logs in [68.85.19.199] 08/31/05 20:00:43 PressureProsInc: hell all 08/31/05 20:00:47 PressureProsInc: hello 08/31/05 20:00:49 BethnRod: Hi Ken 08/31/05 20:00:53 Russell_C: Welcome to Wed Night Wood Chat 08/31/05 20:00:54 PressureProsInc: how are ya beth? 08/31/05 20:01:02 BethnRod: Good, you? 08/31/05 20:01:03 PressureProsInc: thanks Russ 08/31/05 20:01:09 PressureProsInc: not too bad at all 08/31/05 20:01:35 Russell_C: So far I know everyone here with the exception of Flimmy 08/31/05 20:01:50 PressureProsInc: how are you doing Flimmy? 08/31/05 20:02:02 Russell_C: Filly, my name is Russell Cissell. How are you this evening? 08/31/05 20:02:46 PressureProsInc: I can't believe the devastation down in the gulf.. I feel so bad for those people 08/31/05 20:03:02 Russell_C: Ken, it's horrible 08/31/05 20:03:20 BethnRod: Flimmy = Scott 08/31/05 20:03:27 flimmy11: I'm here 08/31/05 20:03:46 BethnRod: :) 08/31/05 20:03:57 PressureProsInc: We live in a great country. Anywhere else in the world and people would continue to suffer for months... hopefully relief wil come soon 08/31/05 20:04:35 Russell_C: I would like to give it a few more mins. here before we get started 08/31/05 20:05:00 PressureProsInc: good, I'm gonna take the chance for potty break..brb 08/31/05 20:05:04 Russell_C: While we wait for others to join does anyone have any general questions? 08/31/05 20:05:07 JimCrossleyy Logs in [66.32.248.190] 08/31/05 20:05:15 Russell_C: Welcome Jim 08/31/05 20:05:35 flimmy11 Disconnects 08/31/05 20:06:21 JimCrossleyy: Hi Russell, long time no chat. 08/31/05 20:06:34 Russell_C: Jim, how have you been? 08/31/05 20:07:10 PressureProsInc: Hi Jim 08/31/05 20:07:12 PressureProsInc: <-- Ken 08/31/05 20:08:01 JimCrossleyy: Keeping busy. I know what the agenda is tonight but when you get a chance, I have a mahogany question. Hi Ken. 08/31/05 20:08:10 flimmy11 Logs in [68.162.184.65] 08/31/05 20:08:31 Russell_C: Scott, have you got any questions about estimating? 08/31/05 20:09:58 Rod: Jim goes for the hard woods! 08/31/05 20:10:23 Rod: Exotic species? 08/31/05 20:10:29 flimmy11: Yes , how do you come up with an est. on how much stripper you will need. 08/31/05 20:11:05 Russell_C: Ok the first thing you need to do is calculate the square footage 08/31/05 20:11:17 flimmy11: I know it takes some exper. and alot depends on what your stripping 08/31/05 20:11:34 Russell_C: Right, for now we will keet it very simple. 08/31/05 20:11:44 Russell_C: Do you know how to determine area? 08/31/05 20:11:47 flimmy11: I did that pretty good on the last deck I did 08/31/05 20:12:15 flimmy11: I think Ido :D 08/31/05 20:12:16 JimCrossleyy: Russell it is about estimating. House with hardwood windows. some arched 25 ft. high. Lots of trim and removing varnish. $5M home, any words of wisdom on estimating. This requires scaffolding and the like. 08/31/05 20:13:22 flimmy11: I did the sq ft on the floors , that was easy , for the rails I did the length x 4 08/31/05 20:13:50 Russell_C: Jim-that is a great question! I would appreciat if you would save it until the end of the discussion. For now we are going to cover simple estimating. I will be happy to talk with you about that at the end of chat. 08/31/05 20:13:50 Low-PSI Logs in [24.254.240.235] 08/31/05 20:14:03 Rod: Jim, are you stripping chemically or sanding? 08/31/05 20:14:08 Low-PSI: Good evening all! 08/31/05 20:14:19 Rod: Hello 08/31/05 20:14:21 PressureProsInc: Hey Low, how are you? 08/31/05 20:14:31 Russell_C: To keep it simple if you measure the legnth of a deck and then multiply that by the width of the deck you will have it's surface area 08/31/05 20:14:32 Low-PSI: Much better, now 08/31/05 20:15:00 PressureProsInc: all setlled in for the night.. I apologize I have forgotten your first name since we last spoke, Low 08/31/05 20:15:30 PressureProsInc: Unless of course I am thinking of someone else 08/31/05 20:15:31 BethnRod: Low PSi - is this John Orr? 08/31/05 20:15:32 Low-PSI: I was not able to use my name (John Orr) when registering 08/31/05 20:15:42 Russell_C: We are discussing how measure area to determine square footage. 08/31/05 20:15:42 PressureProsInc: Okay I thought that was you, John 08/31/05 20:15:51 BethnRod: Hows that gravity situati9on going? 08/31/05 20:15:55 Rod: Hey John 08/31/05 20:15:55 Low-PSI: lol 08/31/05 20:16:05 Russell_C: There will be time for general discussion at the end of the this evenings chat. 08/31/05 20:16:12 BethnRod: sorry Russ. 08/31/05 20:16:25 Russell_C: No problem 08/31/05 20:17:02 Russell_C: To catch up, is there any one here who has questions about how to calculate square footage? 08/31/05 20:17:29 flimmy11: What about on a log house ? 08/31/05 20:17:41 Russell_C: Great question 08/31/05 20:18:00 Low-PSI: I measure the deck for the sq footage and add by the linear ft for the rails/spidles. 08/31/05 20:18:33 Russell_C: On a log house most often a contractor will measure the legnth of a wall and multiply that by the height. Then add 1/3 for the curve of the log. 08/31/05 20:19:01 Russell_C: For instance a 20 foot wall that is 8 foot high would be 160 08/31/05 20:19:27 PressureProsInc: wow a third for the curve? I didn't know that. I have yet to see a log house though 08/31/05 20:19:50 Russell_C: The 1/3 is not exact for square footage 08/31/05 20:20:08 Russell_C: it is to factor for the additional angles you have to hit 08/31/05 20:20:28 PressureProsInc: Would it be a fair way to err on the side of caution? Or could it actually cost you? 08/31/05 20:20:50 Russell_C: Rod, can you tell them the difference between cleaning flat cedar siding and a log profile? 08/31/05 20:21:25 Rod: sure, the basic difference is the angle of attack so to speak 08/31/05 20:21:34 flimmy11: I would guess you have to add for the log on the end also ? 08/31/05 20:21:41 BethnRod: yes 08/31/05 20:21:48 Rod: On a log, you have to deal with the upper angles as well as the bottom angles 08/31/05 20:22:07 Rod: Otherwise you will not get an even cleaning 08/31/05 20:22:10 JeffRobison Logs in [67.35.23.101] 08/31/05 20:22:27 PressureProsInc: I have to travel two hours to see any log homes, but I would like to be educated should the ned arise 08/31/05 20:22:30 PressureProsInc: Hi Jeff 08/31/05 20:23:08 Rod: On cedar siding, the main thing to concentrate on is the left to right angles of cleaning when you are working on rough cut cedar clap boards. 08/31/05 20:23:15 JeffRobison: Hello guys and girls. I am fairly new to doing any woodwork, so I am pretty much all ears. 08/31/05 20:23:28 Rod: Does that help? 08/31/05 20:23:36 Russell_C: As Rod said it is the additional time required by the angles that warrents the 1/3 addition 08/31/05 20:23:38 flimmy11: so could you measure the length and heigth of the end log and multiply by 2 ? 08/31/05 20:23:41 Russell_C: Excellent Rod! 08/31/05 20:24:11 Russell_C: Scott, you will pick those up when you measure that next side 08/31/05 20:24:32 PressureProsInc: I have a question re: cedar shake roofs 08/31/05 20:24:44 Russell_C: If they stick out 2 feet, add two feet to the legnth, the height will remain the same. 08/31/05 20:24:52 flimmy11: Ok I see now 08/31/05 20:25:00 Russell_C: Ken, go ahead 08/31/05 20:25:36 PressureProsInc: well obviously prices per aquare on wood resto vary but compare a per square foot rate for a deck versus a roof 08/31/05 20:26:00 Russell_C: Correct 08/31/05 20:26:08 Russell_C: everything is relative 08/31/05 20:26:19 PressureProsInc: percentage? 08/31/05 20:26:35 Russell_C: but no matter what, determinimg your total square footage is important 08/31/05 20:26:50 Russell_C: that is the only way to estimate your material cost 08/31/05 20:27:05 Russell_C: it is also the best way to estimat your labor time 08/31/05 20:27:27 Russell_C: only by knowing those two things can you make an educated bid 08/31/05 20:28:16 Russell_C: Some types of wood restoration pay a higher price per square foot 08/31/05 20:28:31 flimmy11: like ? 08/31/05 20:28:45 Russell_C: Some types of wood restoration you can complete faster 08/31/05 20:28:55 Russell_C: Scott, good question! 08/31/05 20:29:12 Russell_C: I think cedar homes pay best in St Louis 08/31/05 20:29:19 Russell_C: Rod, what do you think? 08/31/05 20:29:38 JeffRobison Logs in [68.223.50.141] 08/31/05 20:30:07 PressureProsInc: I agree knowing the square footage is paramount, but using a base of $1 per sf of wood at deck level could I expect to get two, three, four times that rate for a steeply pitched shake roof? 08/31/05 20:30:29 JeffRobison > Russell_C: Hello 08/31/05 20:30:48 Rod: Vertical wood restoration is considerably higher /sqft... 08/31/05 20:30:52 JeffRobison > Russell_C: Are you the maker of the Wood Tux Wet? 08/31/05 20:31:28 Rod: while deck restoration is becoming more competitive and in some cases not even worth bidding. 08/31/05 20:31:52 Russell_C: Ken, there is a lot to consider when bidding a roof 08/31/05 20:31:58 Russell_C: Will you use lifts? 08/31/05 20:32:08 Russell_C: Will you "walk" the roof 08/31/05 20:32:19 PressureProsInc: not in this scenario.. repelling 08/31/05 20:32:27 Rod: we find that the older more neglected wood restoration projects are not worth bidding because most h.o. wont pay the price to do it right. 08/31/05 20:32:36 PressureProsInc: agred Rod 08/31/05 20:32:57 Russell_C: The key to a roof estimate is in knowing not only the square footage, but also how you will attack it and most importantly, how long it will take. 08/31/05 20:33:12 Rod: Comparably, cedar homes are going for less around here than log homes. 08/31/05 20:33:25 Russell_C: If you will have to rent a lift, that is an additional job cost 08/31/05 20:33:42 Russell_C: I bid cedar for less than logs 08/31/05 20:33:56 PressureProsInc: This house is humongous, Russ. I honestly have no idea how long it wil take. I'd like to land the job but I don't want to give a ridiculous bid either 08/31/05 20:33:59 Russell_C: Foot fot Foot I try to add 1/3 for logs 08/31/05 20:34:36 Russell_C: Well Ken, gather as much information as you can 08/31/05 20:34:48 Russell_C: I am always happy to help you 08/31/05 20:35:08 Russell_C: A big job is no different than a small job 08/31/05 20:35:24 JeffRobison: Russell: Are you the maker of wood tux wet? 08/31/05 20:35:26 Rod: Project time is a difficult one to compute. 08/31/05 20:35:29 Russell_C: a big job is just a bunch of small jobs in one location 08/31/05 20:36:08 scottk Logs in [68.217.218.189] 08/31/05 20:36:09 flimmy11: how muhch faster can you do a house with a lift compared to a ladder ? Is it worth getting a lift ( less than $700 for a week) 08/31/05 20:36:10 Rod: thats a way to look at it 08/31/05 20:36:11 Russell_C: Jeff, I work for ESI yes, but I would be taking too much credit if I said I was the "maker". It's a team effort. 08/31/05 20:36:19 scottk: hey all 08/31/05 20:36:27 BethnRod: He's modest. 08/31/05 20:36:32 PressureProsInc: Hey Scott 08/31/05 20:36:35 Rod: lift is safer than a ladder and can be moved while you are in the bucket. 08/31/05 20:36:36 Russell_C: Flimmy that all depends on the size of the job 08/31/05 20:36:45 PressureProsInc: esi's products are awesome 08/31/05 20:37:00 flimmy11: 3000 sq ft log house 08/31/05 20:37:06 BethnRod: Ken - I agree! 08/31/05 20:37:13 flimmy11: 6000 sq ft of logs 08/31/05 20:37:15 JeffRobison: Would this be a good product for a beginner to start with? I have avoided decks becuase of the multiple trips to finish a job 08/31/05 20:37:23 Rod: 3000sqft, how many men on the job? 08/31/05 20:37:44 Rod: Jeff, yes. 08/31/05 20:37:46 BethnRod: We teethed on esi's products. Now we use them daily. 08/31/05 20:37:58 scottk: Jeff you should be able to handle wood from one weekend to the next weather permitting 08/31/05 20:38:04 Russell_C: If you are looking at a $7,000.00 home restoration and you can save two days with a lift then yes, get a lift. 08/31/05 20:38:07 PressureProsInc: Russ will give you more input, Jeff, but I find esi's products very easy to use. Also, Jeff, beth or me or anyone on TGS that is familiar would be happy to help you 08/31/05 20:38:10 flimmy11: 2 maybe 3 08/31/05 20:38:42 Rod: 2-3 guns on the job? 08/31/05 20:38:51 flimmy11: 2 08/31/05 20:39:19 Rod: then you could be looking at 1 1/2 days to wash and 2-2 1/2 days to seal. 08/31/05 20:39:24 Russell_C: How much of the job would you use the lift on? 08/31/05 20:39:31 JeffRobison: I read TGS religiously and try to gather as much information as I can, but need some "hands on experience" I have messed around with my deck, but afraid to do someone else's right now. 08/31/05 20:39:33 flimmy11: 1 gun on the lift 1 on the ground doing low stuff. Yard is all level 08/31/05 20:39:35 BethnRod: Is this the one you posted pics of with the test spot in the Gallery? 08/31/05 20:39:42 Rod: The 2nd story levels and up 08/31/05 20:40:04 flimmy11: yes 08/31/05 20:40:08 BethnRod: Jeff - you can come get hands on with us if you like. We are in Maryland 08/31/05 20:40:08 Rod: Is there a well close by,,, 08/31/05 20:40:28 flimmy11: city water:D 08/31/05 20:40:39 scottk: We have never used the esi products,but with the rpc stuff we had great results by just following the directions 08/31/05 20:40:54 JeffRobison: Hopefully tagging along with Cujo one of these days. Also SunBrite is 5 miles from my house. I have had no time to take a class yet 08/31/05 20:41:05 Rod: ok, the only other issue could be ruts from the wheels, you may want to price having them filled in if this is the case. 08/31/05 20:41:09 scottk: I think Russell give the same kind of customer support for teh esi products 08/31/05 20:41:16 PressureProsInc: flimmy(scott), where is Scottdale? 08/31/05 20:41:35 BethnRod: esi's products are easy to use. 08/31/05 20:41:39 flimmy11: the guy ownes an excavation company 08/31/05 20:41:58 flimmy11: 30 min south of pittsburgh 08/31/05 20:42:07 Rod: ah ha! so he knows the potential for this? 08/31/05 20:42:43 Rod: I'll sit back and let Russ continue the chat... 08/31/05 20:42:52 BethnRod: We have traveled to p'burg for logs before. 08/31/05 20:43:00 flimmy11: yes and I told him I would be using a lift , just in case I did 08/31/05 20:43:11 Russell_C: Well, we are talking about estimating a large project. Lets continue with that 08/31/05 20:43:38 Russell_C: Scott, what else can you tell us about the job? 08/31/05 20:44:27 flimmy11: Ok , it has sw deck scapes on it , it'sa 1 yr old house 08/31/05 20:44:58 Russell_C: do you have a total square footage? 08/31/05 20:45:00 flimmy11: The builder contacted me for a bid because the home owner is holding back$$ 08/31/05 20:45:16 flimmy11: 6000 sq ft of log 08/31/05 20:45:18 Rod: Big Flag 08/31/05 20:45:25 Russell_C: Right! 08/31/05 20:45:29 flimmy11: I know 08/31/05 20:45:37 Russell_C: but that is for another discussion! 08/31/05 20:45:47 Russell_C: lets work with estimating 08/31/05 20:45:53 flimmy11: I gave them a bid requireing 1/3 up front 08/31/05 20:46:06 Russell_C: ok obviously you are going to have to strip the house 08/31/05 20:46:13 flimmy11: yes 08/31/05 20:46:41 Russell_C: Do you have a stripper of choice or shall we use HD-80 for the purpose of the estimate? 08/31/05 20:46:44 flimmy11: I tried some other stuff to srtip and it came off easy 08/31/05 20:47:20 Russell_C: It is easiest for me to speak about ESI products, but if you tell me the cost I can work with anything 08/31/05 20:48:03 flimmy11: HD-80 is good, I used F-18 MAX for a test spot but have heard the HD-80 is just as good or better 08/31/05 20:48:10 Russell_C: ok, lets assume you are using HD-80 08/31/05 20:48:20 Russell_C: The cost is 2 cents per square foot 08/31/05 20:48:33 GregRentschler Logs in [24.12.32.183] 08/31/05 20:48:36 Russell_C: so your stripper will cost $120.00 for the job 08/31/05 20:48:47 Russell_C > GregRentschler: Welcome 08/31/05 20:48:51 GregRentschler > Russell_C: howdy russ 08/31/05 20:49:01 BethnRod: Hi Greg! 08/31/05 20:49:13 Russell_C: Add 15% for overage and you've got $148.00 08/31/05 20:49:18 GregRentschler: Hey Beth! I chimed in at just the right time :) 08/31/05 20:49:40 PressureProsInc: Hi Greg 08/31/05 20:49:42 flimmy11: Ok how much of the 80 are you going to use ? 08/31/05 20:49:53 Russell_C: Neutralizer is going to be 1.5 cents per square foot for $90.00 08/31/05 20:50:16 Russell_C: 30 to 40 gallons 08/31/05 20:50:24 flimmy11: I think the 80 could be at 3 oz per gal 08/31/05 20:50:35 scottk Logs Out 08/31/05 20:50:36 Russell_C: same on the Neutralizer 08/31/05 20:50:47 Russell_C: I always estimat full stregnth 08/31/05 20:51:04 flimmy11: is that 4-8 per gal? 08/31/05 20:51:12 Russell_C: "better to over estimate than under bid" 08/31/05 20:51:51 GregRentschler: Hey Ken! Sorry -- phone rang 08/31/05 20:51:53 BethnRod: Agreed. If you estimate based on full strength and use less, you are ahead dollar wise. 08/31/05 20:51:57 Russell_C: I am figuring at 8 oz per gallon 08/31/05 20:52:11 Russell_C: (about 2/3 cup) 08/31/05 20:53:00 Russell_C: ok so add 15% to the neutralizer and we have about $105.00 08/31/05 20:53:13 Russell_C: Now, are you going to stain this job? 08/31/05 20:53:20 JeffRobison: Can I ask some elementary questions that some may answer in between this intelligent conversation? I do not want to be a pain while the pros talk 08/31/05 20:53:23 flimmy11: yes 08/31/05 20:53:23 PressureProsInc: No problem, how are you, Greg.. Russ is schoolin' us on large project estimates 08/31/05 20:53:52 flimmy11: I'm no pro :D 08/31/05 20:54:02 Russell_C: Ok, in a sec we will calculate for stain 08/31/05 20:54:18 flimmy11: great 08/31/05 20:54:24 GregRentschler: Doing well... started missing the wood care :) 08/31/05 20:54:39 PressureProsInc: Jeff, you may IM me if you wish, I will help you all that I can 08/31/05 20:54:47 PressureProsInc: Greg, it is a labor of love 08/31/05 20:54:53 Russell_C: [ can we please keep cross chat in private messages. There will be a block of time at the beginning and end of Wood Chat for general discussion ] 08/31/05 20:55:39 flimmy11: so we have $260 for chems 08/31/05 20:55:53 Russell_C: more or less! 08/31/05 20:56:02 Russell_C: ok now what stain are you going to apply? 08/31/05 20:56:45 JeffRobison Logs in [68.223.50.141] 08/31/05 20:56:49 flimmy11: Don't know yet, haven't got the job 08/31/05 20:57:15 Russell_C: Well lets assume you are bidding it and you want to use Wood-Tux Wet 08/31/05 20:57:34 JeffRobison: My computer cut off, I am back with my silly questions, if you all don't mind 08/31/05 20:57:41 Russell_C: You will need about 30 - 35 gallons 08/31/05 20:57:45 flimmy11: ok , the logs are smooth 08/31/05 20:57:48 Rod: 150sqft/gal after overspray and drift is our figure. 08/31/05 20:58:17 Rod: jeff, pm your questions if you like 08/31/05 20:58:17 Russell_C: Well Rod that will be our 35 number 08/31/05 20:58:36 Rod: then I would price it for 40. 08/31/05 20:58:48 Russell_C: that is $973.00 for the stain 08/31/05 20:58:55 Rod: Beth always makes me add a 5'er...:) 08/31/05 20:59:19 Russell_C: ok to be safe $1,112.00 for the stain 08/31/05 20:59:32 flimmy11: cool , I figured $2000 in chems and stain 08/31/05 20:59:53 Russell_C: So that is roughly $1,372.00 for materials 08/31/05 20:59:53 BethnRod: Better to add an extra 5'er, in case you spill one...or something.... 08/31/05 21:00:10 flimmy11: but I also figured fuel in that and you see how thats going up 08/31/05 21:00:13 Russell_C: ok Scott, great job 08/31/05 21:00:20 Russell_C: so far you have not under bid! 08/31/05 21:00:21 JimCrossleyy: Good for Beth, I always have to go back for an extra 5er. 08/31/05 21:00:53 Rod: lol really 08/31/05 21:01:10 Russell_C: Now that you know your material cost you can look at labor 08/31/05 21:01:15 Rod: Hey russ, what about ladder changes? 08/31/05 21:01:31 JimCrossleyy: I am listening 08/31/05 21:01:32 Russell_C: (there is a world of other materials we are leaving out but I am trying to keep it simple) 08/31/05 21:02:01 Russell_C: Rod, that is an excellent labor question 08/31/05 21:02:39 flimmy11: I know , thats why I add some exta in but not as much as we have figured in here 08/31/05 21:02:44 Russell_C: Looking at Scott's 6000 square foot log home. . .how long did you think it would take? 08/31/05 21:02:59 Russell_C: What are your set ups? 08/31/05 21:03:08 Russell_C: will you use ladders or lifts? 08/31/05 21:03:18 Russell_C: Lets start with the ground work 08/31/05 21:03:19 flimmy11: I guessed 5 days because of lack of experiance 08/31/05 21:03:41 Russell_C: Lets talk about how to estimate and bid so we don't have to guess any more! 08/31/05 21:03:45 flimmy11: lifts for all the upper stuff 08/31/05 21:04:01 Russell_C: Great, for the ground work, how many hours do you think? 08/31/05 21:04:22 flimmy11: 2 guys 1 day 08/31/05 21:04:29 flimmy11: 8-10 08/31/05 21:04:30 Russell_C: 8 hrs each? 08/31/05 21:04:44 Russell_C: ok, lets say 20 hours 08/31/05 21:04:46 flimmy11: taking our time 08/31/05 21:04:58 Russell_C: is that to strip or to strip and seal? 08/31/05 21:05:38 flimmy11: srtip 08/31/05 21:06:13 Russell_C: Rod. . .time wise. . .if you are 10 hours on a strip how long on a seal? 08/31/05 21:06:42 Rod: 1.5 times the strip time because of prep and masking. 08/31/05 21:06:59 BethnRod: yeah windows and masking and plant can slow you down. 08/31/05 21:07:06 Russell_C: So 30 hours for the seal 08/31/05 21:07:11 Russell_C: (I agree) 08/31/05 21:07:27 Russell_C: Now Scott how long on the lift work? 08/31/05 21:08:01 flimmy11: half that time 08/31/05 21:08:17 flimmy11: maybe a little longer 08/31/05 21:08:26 Russell_C: so that will be another 25 to 30 hours 08/31/05 21:08:39 Russell_C: Lest say 80 hours total 08/31/05 21:08:47 flimmy11: ok 08/31/05 21:08:50 Russell_C: Now again you want to add a buffer of 15% 08/31/05 21:09:03 flimmy11: 92 hrs 08/31/05 21:09:11 Russell_C: that will put you at 92 hours 08/31/05 21:09:21 Russell_C: Now we have two KEY numbers 08/31/05 21:09:33 Russell_C: 92 hours and $1375 in material cost 08/31/05 21:09:55 Russell_C: At this point you decide how you want to bid this job 08/31/05 21:10:11 Russell_C: Bidding is the topic for Next Weeks Wood Chat 08/31/05 21:10:34 Russell_C: I will keep the notes from this weeks discussion to carry over. 08/31/05 21:10:37 flimmy11: lol we have to wait lol 08/31/05 21:10:43 Russell_C: Not at all 08/31/05 21:10:53 Russell_C: that is just the end of the structured Wood Chat 08/31/05 21:10:57 flimmy11: I'm just jokeing 08/31/05 21:11:11 Russell_C: Now you can feel free to throw out anything you want. 08/31/05 21:11:40 Russell_C: I will keep working off Scotts example house next week though! 08/31/05 21:12:12 Russell_C: And for being a great sport about it, Scott if you want to send me your address inh and e-mail I will send you 5 free gallons of HD-80 08/31/05 21:12:28 flimmy11: on the 80 how much sq ft do you est. per gal ? 08/31/05 21:12:32 Russell_C: My e-mail is Imrcc1@aol.com 08/31/05 21:12:36 BethnRod: The transcript from this session will be posted in the library in a few days. 08/31/05 21:12:37 Russell_C: 150 08/31/05 21:13:04 Russell_C: 150/sq foot when calculating cleaner, stripper or stain 08/31/05 21:13:38 Low-PSI: Did someone mention ladders? 08/31/05 21:13:46 Low-PSI: lol 08/31/05 21:13:46 PressureProsInc: I find it to be less if you use the chemical to keep it wet. 08/31/05 21:13:51 Russell_C: If anyone would like a free sample of Wood-Tux wet, shoot me your address and I will send out a pint. It is plenty to make up about 20 sample boards! 08/31/05 21:14:12 tropicalwave Logs in [24.13.142.208] 08/31/05 21:14:15 Russell_C: Do you have a ladder question? 08/31/05 21:14:19 PressureProsInc: Russ, any word on field tint for the WT 08/31/05 21:14:28 PressureProsInc: Yo Mike 08/31/05 21:14:31 flimmy11: Thanks Russell 08/31/05 21:14:42 Russell_C: Ken, available now 08/31/05 21:14:50 flimmy11 Logs Out 08/31/05 21:14:52 Russell_C: will begin shipping next week 08/31/05 21:15:01 tropicalwave: whas up 08/31/05 21:15:01 PressureProsInc: awesome 08/31/05 21:15:08 flimmy11 Logs in [68.162.184.65] 08/31/05 21:16:06 PressureProsInc: How is the wood resto market in Chicago, Mike 08/31/05 21:17:24 tropicalwave: been ok so far.....been on and off, busy with the reg gig at the moment 08/31/05 21:17:36 PressureProsInc: I understand 08/31/05 21:18:03 tropicalwave: waiting to see if we're getting sent to LA 08/31/05 21:18:27 flimmy11: do you work off the ladder when stripping or try to do as much as you can from the ground and insp. from the ladder before staining 08/31/05 21:18:29 PressureProsInc: for real? 08/31/05 21:18:39 Low-PSI: Any idea on how long WTW will last? 08/31/05 21:18:52 Russell_C: 3 years 08/31/05 21:19:09 tropicalwave: yup...my swat team has been going all week, training and rehearsing 08/31/05 21:19:12 Russell_C: Flimmy I think we would all prefer to stay on the ground if we could! 08/31/05 21:19:26 Low-PSI: I know I would! 08/31/05 21:19:30 Low-PSI: lol 08/31/05 21:19:41 Low-PSI: sorry 08/31/05 21:19:48 GregRentschler: Good luck down there if ya go... it's a wreck! 08/31/05 21:20:05 Low-PSI: How wet can PT wood be with wtw? 08/31/05 21:20:16 flimmy11: like using an ext wand for the high stuff 08/31/05 21:20:18 tropicalwave: oh yea....watching it on fox now....its gonna get uglier too 08/31/05 21:20:43 GregRentschler: I was all geared up to vacation there next week. Bummer...... 08/31/05 21:20:55 Russell_C: No real limit as long as there is no water on the surface 08/31/05 21:21:05 tropicalwave: well, thats better than going last week 08/31/05 21:21:13 Low-PSI: You mean standing water? 08/31/05 21:21:18 Russell_C: yes 08/31/05 21:21:20 GregRentschler: :o so true! 08/31/05 21:21:44 Russell_C: Flimmy, I have seen some who use extension wands, I prefer to stay close to the work. 08/31/05 21:22:16 flimmy11: no , I have 2 and have not used them. They came with the rig I bought 08/31/05 21:22:35 Low-PSI: Russ, to explain my ladder comment, I fell off of one 2 months ago. 08/31/05 21:22:39 Russell_C: They are great for other types of work 08/31/05 21:22:50 Russell_C: Ouch 08/31/05 21:22:59 flimmy11: well I did use one , I taped a brush to it to do some gutters 08/31/05 21:23:01 Russell_C: I bet you do want to say on the ground! 08/31/05 21:23:21 tropicalwave: russell, are the colors extra money or is the price listed, what it is for the different colors 08/31/05 21:23:52 tropicalwave: im so darn tired that probably made no sense 08/31/05 21:23:53 Low-PSI: Yup, broken radius - right wrist, torn right rotator cuff and a major internal wound in my right leg. 08/31/05 21:24:05 Russell_C: well the tint kits are extra 08/31/05 21:24:29 Low-PSI: 2 operations 08/31/05 21:24:29 Russell_C: each color is $19.95 (list) 08/31/05 21:24:36 PressureProsInc: Goodnight all, thanks for the excellent info.....I'll be back next wek 08/31/05 21:24:47 Russell_C: I think the kit with both colors is $29.95 08/31/05 21:24:51 PressureProsInc Logs Out 08/31/05 21:24:52 Low-PSI: G'night 08/31/05 21:24:55 Russell_C: Good night Ken 08/31/05 21:25:05 Russell_C: The black will last you forever 08/31/05 21:25:30 Russell_C: The red will tint up to 40 gallons 08/31/05 21:25:40 Rod: Russ, are you still selling the clear? 08/31/05 21:25:45 Russell_C: just depends on the color you are going for 08/31/05 21:25:49 GregRentschler Logs Out 08/31/05 21:25:53 Russell_C: not this year 08/31/05 21:25:55 BethnRod Logs Out 08/31/05 21:26:30 tropicalwave: how much sealer does 19 bucks tint? 5 gal? 08/31/05 21:26:36 Russell_C: if you need a redwood I can special blend some at no extra charge but it will take about a week 08/31/05 21:26:51 Russell_C: up to 40 gallons for red 08/31/05 21:27:00 Russell_C: like 1200 for black 08/31/05 21:27:13 Russell_C: the black goes a long long long way 08/31/05 21:27:36 tropicalwave: my people seem to like cedar and a light brown up here 08/31/05 21:27:49 Russell_C: then you want the base color 08/31/05 21:27:57 Russell_C: warm honey gold 08/31/05 21:28:07 Rod: Warm honey gold and Western Cedar in our area... 08/31/05 21:28:09 tropicalwave: i dont even know what tints you all have 08/31/05 21:28:19 Russell_C: if you want to make it pop add a touch of red 08/31/05 21:28:29 Russell_C: Just Red and Black that is all you need 08/31/05 21:28:48 Rod: Kick it up a notch! 08/31/05 21:29:02 Russell_C: with red and black you can make from gold to cinimon to brown to rust to red cedar 08/31/05 21:29:03 flimmy11: my wife wants a very light color for our deck , what color would you sugest ? 08/31/05 21:29:15 Russell_C: Warm Honey Gold 08/31/05 21:29:24 tropicalwave: ok, so i would imagine theres some directions with this stuff..LOL 08/31/05 21:29:45 Russell_C: Sure, remove lid and add to taste! 08/31/05 21:29:58 Russell_C: be sure to mix while adding 08/31/05 21:30:07 Low-PSI: Is the Warm Honey Gold similar to Olympic Max Honey Gold? 08/31/05 21:30:14 tropicalwave: what it looks like in the pail isnt what it looks like on the wood 08/31/05 21:30:17 Low-PSI: In color, of course 08/31/05 21:30:43 Russell_C: no it is not wysiwyg 08/31/05 21:31:04 Russell_C: it will depend on the color of the wood 08/31/05 21:31:07 Rod: Time to hit the hay, g'nite all, c-ya next time... 08/31/05 21:31:13 Russell_C: this is a transparent pigment system 08/31/05 21:31:18 Low-PSI: nite 08/31/05 21:31:20 Russell_C: Night Rod 08/31/05 21:31:25 Russell_C: Thanks for joining 08/31/05 21:31:59 Russell_C: This type of stain is nothing like paint 08/31/05 21:32:19 Russell_C: it allows light to pass through and then bounce back out 08/31/05 21:32:22 flimmy11: what is he best way to apply it 08/31/05 21:32:33 Russell_C: Paint just bounces the light right back at you 08/31/05 21:32:41 Russell_C: I like to spray for speed 08/31/05 21:32:49 Russell_C: any method works well though 08/31/05 21:34:02 JeffRobison Logs Out 08/31/05 21:34:09 Low-PSI: Russ, I use Oly Max Honey Gold almost exclusively, an dhave for 3 years, I and my customers love it - but it drives me crazy trying to schedule the staining, so WTW is very appealing. Is your Warm Honey Gold similar? 08/31/05 21:34:40 Russell_C: Yes it is in that light family 08/31/05 21:34:49 Low-PSI: Hmm... 08/31/05 21:34:51 Russell_C: I am happy to send you a sample 08/31/05 21:35:02 Low-PSI: That would be great! 08/31/05 21:35:07 Russell_C: you will definately see the quality difference right in the can 08/31/05 21:35:20 Russell_C: send me an e-mail with your address 08/31/05 21:35:27 Low-PSI: I will 08/31/05 21:35:41 tropicalwave: how do I get that promotional good will? LOL 08/31/05 21:35:44 flimmy11: whats your email ? 08/31/05 21:35:50 Russell_C: imrcc1@aol.com 08/31/05 21:36:01 Russell_C: just need an e-mail with an address 08/31/05 21:36:16 Russell_C: I have free samples of Wood-Tux for everyone 08/31/05 21:36:16 Low-PSI Logs Out 08/31/05 21:36:52 tropicalwave: ok, I have your email in our business directory....looking forward to it 08/31/05 21:37:17 low-psi Logs in [24.254.240.235] 08/31/05 21:37:27 Russell_C: Well, thank you for comming tonight 08/31/05 21:37:35 low-psi: TY 08/31/05 21:37:46 JimCrossleyy: Russel, I will catch up with you either tomorrow or on Friday re: the windows. I need to rebuild a Teckpump tonight for a gig tomorrow. 08/31/05 21:37:51 JimCrossleyy: Nite all. 08/31/05 21:37:54 Russell_C: I hope to get a more structured format going here 08/31/05 21:37:59 Russell_C: Great Jim 08/31/05 21:38:02 Russell_C: give me a call 08/31/05 21:38:11 Russell_C: Night 08/31/05 21:38:32 low-psi: nite 08/31/05 21:38:34 tropicalwave Logs Out 08/31/05 21:38:35 JimCrossleyy Logs Out 08/31/05 21:38:42 Russell_C: Thank you all for taking the time to join us this evening 08/31/05 21:38:49 low-psi Logs Out 08/31/05 21:38:51 Russell_C: I think I am headding out as well 08/31/05 21:39:05 flimmy11: Russell I think it was good after it got going thanks 08/31/05 21:39:19 flimmy11: Godd night everyone 08/31/05 21:39:27 Russell_C: No problem, they will just keep getting better! 08/31/05 21:39:35 flimmy11 Logs Out 08/31/05 21:39:36 Russell_C: Come back next week! 08/31/05 21:40:48 Russell_C Logs Out 08/31/05 21:41:06 Rod Disconnects

Agreed! It conditions the homeowner to neglect their deck in the interim. Rod~

And these looters wonder why people are pissed at them. It is pretty sad that they put so much effort into stealing and ignoring the needs of those who were less fortunate. Every one lost Everything down there for the most part. Rod~

Wood Tux! has been by far the best investment we could have recommended for our customers and for our business. We have recently finished maintenance services on several decks that were treated with Wood Tux! 2 years ago. The washes went great and there was still plenty of pigment left on the horizontals. The recoats looked just as good as the first applications and there were no areas of blemishing or splotchyness usually associated with some products due to uv discoloration. Also, I noted that the amount of product used on the maintenance was about 25% less than the original coat. We have also seen a deck that we did 2 years ago with the California Redwood tone that was 90% intact even on the horizontals. Due to this, the customer has elected to go another year before having a maintenance wash and seal performed. I look forward to more of these decks and converting the majority of our customers to Wood Tux! It has been the best bang for their buck and ours in ease of maintenance. Check out our company web site photo gallery for yourself if you like. The results are reliable and the durability is built in. http://http://www.seedirtrun.com/ Rod~