Beth n Rod

Excellent Point Dave. We carry msds for all our products as well. Rod!~

I agree with Rod 100%. When I am out doing estimates, I will answer whatever questions the client may have about the process and the chemicals, how they work and why they will in fact run off as neutral when we are finished. If you had someone come onto YOUR property and you knew chemicals were involved would you not want to know more about it? BS. You know the answer is yes, you would. Beth

LaCrosse Cyclone Rainwear. We use the pants which repel water well. Still use the Yellow PVC jackets though cause they last a long time. Rod!~

Most chemicals (not all) in this industry biodegrade because they are designed to. It is easy enough to look up the chemicals specifically in a google search by chemical name and including the term biodegrade. The customer has every right to know what you are using since it is 'their' property. Out of respect for our customers and the potentials of having been through an unpleasant situation with another cleaning contractor, I will discuss whatever they need to know about the products I will use on their property. I can tell them what each chemical is and what that specific one is in the formulation to do. Rod!~

Was this meant as a segway? I don't see the relevance to any of the posts in this thread. As far as trade secrets, in this industry, they are very rare indeed. Rod!~

Aw mannnn! I hate pop quizes teach! I couldn't have answered it better myself though. What Rick2 said! ^ Rod!~

http://tlc.howstuffworks.com/home/measure-square-footage1.htm Beth

Maybe....and don't beat me up for saying this...you need to raise your prices? Beth :groovy3:

You are welcome, but keep in mind, I don't use anything over 6% bleach that I buy at HD or Lowes. 1. the mix works well enough at the concentration 2. I can't justify keeping 12% on hand in the amounts necessary to justify the savings. 3. One source I bought from supposedly had 12% bleach but believe it or not, I ended up using almost 3X as much to get the same results that I get with box store bleach. Go figure. No savings there. Rod!~

That is a good question. As many others who did not have much information to draw from when starting up, I used to downstream 25%-bleach to 75% water with some dish soap to start. But I was using cold water as well and the rinsing took forever.Hard surfaces require just as much rinsing as fingers due to the nature of bleach itself. I did some research and found that bleach as an oxidizer destroys paints and pigments resulting in them becoming chalky and faded. Before we replaced our Aluminum siding with vinyl, we had an issue under the eave (an overhang design of the house between first and second stories.). The issue was that there was rust on the siding under the eave for about a foot or so. Come to find out, it was from incomplete rinsing after being washed with bleach. The moisture from dew and humidity would reactivate this section since it was not rinsed away from regular exposure to rain. I started looking into vinyl siding mfr's recommendations for cleaning siding and came up with the solution that once injected onto the siding was approximately as strong as any mild degreaser formulation plus bleach in the ratios necessary to kill mold/mildew and algae. After some tweaking, I came up with the formulation in this thread and have had great success with it. Rod!~

Sorry for the delay, been busy getting ready for the season. 1. yes simple cherry works, used it before but I now use another detergent from ACR Products, but I add a foaming agent with the cherry scent and get the same masking of bleach. 3. 115*-130* (*=degrees, since the keyboard does not have the symbol). Rod!~

Warrenton Virginia, 20186 Residential Job Lead Brick Walkway wash and seal Contact me via PM for lead information. Beth

Charlie, They do not mention products in the classes. Beth

I have seen the effects of washers in my area who have (according to the customers) used only bleach when performing a house wash. The results have been chalky siding. My guess is due to lack of sufficient rinsing. Many will argue to the effectiveness of their process vs others and say rinsing well is enough, but I want each of you who contend this to do an experiment: Take your hand and dip it into your solution and then proceed to rinse it off. Time how long it takes to get the slipperiness to stop and you get finger tack. Now, smell your hand. Still smells like bleach doesn't it!?!? Stick your hand back into the rinse water stream and rub your fingers together, they will feel slippery again even though you just spent a few minutes rinsing them. This is to illustrate the fact that bleach in the concentrations many are using is going to require a lot more time than they have probably spent on their customers house rinsing. Three things are missing from an effective house wash solution that just uses bleach alone. 1. A Surfactant; this helps to lift the pollutants and keep them from re-adhering to the surface. Detergents have surfactants in their formulations. 2. An alkaline builder (a degreaser additive containing 1 or more of the following: tsp, butoxyethenol, sodium hydroxide); these help increase the alkalinity range meaning it will react to more surface pollutants than just bleach alone. Remember, high alkalinity is not the answer, range of alkalinity is. 3. A rinse aid; this helps to ensure cleaner rinsing and requires much less time to rinse to achieve the same neutral surface so that once you leave, there is nothing left to become active again in the next dew or rain cycle and continue to eat away at the surface of the clients home. A 4th ingredient which some have mentioned is a foaming agent. This helps to make your solution more effective cause it holds it on the surface longer and takes longer to dry on warmer days. I tote around a 5 gallon container which is completely closed except for a vent to allow air in while the solution is being drawn out. In that container is 3-1/2 gal of water to start. 1/3 gal of 6% bleach, 1 scoop of a detergent (agitate to completely dissolve powder) , 8-16 ounces of a liquid degreaser concentrate. 4-6 oz. of a foaming agent. 2-4 oz of a rinse agent. Then the container is topped off with water to the fill mark. This solution is injected with an m-5 w/o any proportioners at 115* for vinyl siding, 130* for aluminum, E.I.F.S./Dryvit/Stucco/Hardiplank or other cementatious siding materials. This mix also works fine for most stains on gutters and can be applied at the same time. Brushing is necessary to remove electrostatic bonded asphalt material streaks. (you know these, vertical streaking that laughs at your high bleach content mix) For light mildew/algae, injecting and rinsing is sufficient. For heavier growth, subsequent application(s) may be necessary with brushing to help remove carbon deposits as well. Rinse until you no longer see any bubbles generated by the cascading water and do the finger test. slippery skin=chemical still present, tacky skin=clean. Have fun! Rod!~

Build. Clean. Seal. Beth

ProVT. We can still get the problem solver primer up here. One is acrylic, one is latex. We have also used the Sherwin Williams product with success. Beth

[Rod posting] A.W.P.A. (American Wood Preservers Association) recommends that any wood that has been pressure treated or kiln dried (includes cedar and redwood) be sealed within 2 weeks of installation. The old adage of waiting for 6 months to a year was for wood to become seasoned. That was made obsolete once pressure treatment and kiln drying were instituted to help with the dimensional stability and rot, fungus and product loss as a result. We have seen many of the same issues with painted rail systems in our area that have rotted within 5 years. The problem is paint. Most are not permeable to moisture vapor, so it locks it in the wood along with any other microbes that become fungus creating the perfect environment for rot to set in. Solid stain is permeable. It allows moisture vapor to escape and avoids the problem. The rails we have seen with this problem are the pre-primed versions, usually installed on newly or recently constructed decks. Rod!~

So long as the WMC is down around 12%, you are good. You do not need to wait a year. (put that in the myth category) We like the Cabot's solid decking stain. Two most popular whites are White, and Nantucket White. Some folks like to try to match it to beige siding. I think we did one with Glacier too. * NO paint * NO caulk You'll be good to go. Beth :banana:

Kawickrice, Welcome. Please go to settings and add your signature. Beth

That job was stained, not painted. We avoid paint on decks at all costs....we have seen too many decks rotting away.... Have never caulked a deck, but have seen where others have tried, and between that and the wood putty to fill the cracks (cringe) on the floor, well, you can imagine. Thanks for the kudos on that job. :) Beth

This was a wonderful article I found online, many of us could use it right about now. ______________________________________________________________________ What is an ice dam? An ice dam is a ridge of ice that forms at the edge of a roof and prevents melting snow (water) from draining off the roof. The water that backs up behind the dam can leak into a home and cause damage to walls, ceilings, insulation, and other areas. Figure 1 shows a cross section of a home with an ice dam. Figure 1. Cross section of a one-and-a-half story house with an ice dam. What causes ice dams? There is a complex interaction among the amount of heat loss from a house, snow cover, and outside temperatures that leads to ice dam formation. For ice dams to form there must be snow on the roof, and, at the same time, higher portions of the roof's outside surface must be above 32° F while lower surfaces are below 32°F. For a portion of the roof to be below 32°F, outside temperatures must also be below 32°F. When we say temperatures above or below 32°F, we are talking about average temperature over sustained periods of time. The snow on a roof surface that is above 32°F will melt. As water flows down the roof it reaches the portion of the roof that is below 32°F and freezes. Voila!—an ice dam. The dam grows as it is fed by the melting snow above it, but it will limit itself to the portions of the roof that are on the average below 32°F. So the water above backs up behind the ice dam and remains a liquid. This water finds cracks and openings in the exterior roof covering and flows into the attic space. From the attic it could flow into exterior walls or through the ceiling insulation and stain the ceiling finish. Nonuniform roof surface temperatures lead to ice dams. What causes different roof surface temperatures? Since most ice dams form at the edge of the roof, there is obviously a heat source warming the roof elsewhere. This heat is primarily coming from the house. In rare instances solar heat gain may cause these temperature differences. Heat from the house travels to the roof surface in three ways: conduction, convection, and radiation. Conduction is heat energy traveling through a solid. A good example of this is the heating of a cast iron frying pan. The heat moves from the bottom of the pan to the handle by conduction. If you put your hand above the frying pan, heat will reach it by the other two methods. The air right above the frying pan is heated and rises. The rising air carries heat/energy to your hand. This is heat transfer by convection. In addition, heat is transferred from the hot pan to your hand by electromagnetic waves and this is called radiation. Another example of radiation is to stand outside on a bright sunny day and feel the heat from the sun. This heat is transferred from the sun to you by radiation. In a house, heat moves through the ceiling and insulation by conduction through the slanted portion of the ceiling (Figure 1). In many homes, there is little space in regions like this for insulation, so it is important to use insulations with high R-value per inch to reduce heat loss by conduction. The top surface of the insulation is warmer than the other surroundings in the attic. Therefore, the air just above the insulation is heated and rises, carrying heat by convection to the roof. The higher temperatures in the insulation's top surface compared to the roof sheathing transfers heat outward by radiation. These two modes of heat transfer can be reduced by adding insulation. This will make the top surface temperature of the insulation closer to surrounding attic temperatures directly affecting convection and radiation from this surface. There is another type of convection that transfers heat to the attic space and warms the roof. In Figure 1, the winding arrow beginning inside the house and going through the penetration in the ceiling, from the light to the attic space, illustrates heat loss by air leakage. In many homes this is the major mode of heat transfer that leads to the formation of ice dams. Exhaust systems like those in the kitchen or bathroom that terminate just above the roof may also contribute to snow melting. These exhaust systems may have to be moved or extended in areas of high snow fall. Other sources of heat in the attic space include chimneys. Frequent use of wood stoves and fireplaces allow heat to be transferred from the chimney into the attic space. Inadequately insulated or leaky duct work in the attic space will also be a source of heat. The same can be said about kneewall spaces. Photograph 1 shows a single story house with an ice dam. The points of heat loss can be clearly seen as those areas with no snow. The ceiling below this area needs to be examined for air leakage, missing or inadequate insulation, leaky or poorly insulated ductwork, and the termination of a kitchen or bathroom exhaust into the attic space. Photograph 1. A single-story house with an ice dam. The areas without snow are the points of heat loss. Photograph 2 illustrates unusually high heat loss from the roof. There is very little snow left on the roof and at its edge is both an ice dam and a "beautiful" row of icicles. Photograph 2. The unusually high heat loss on this roof has caused both an ice dam and icicles. So it is primarily heat flowing from the house that is causing the nonuniform temperatures of the roof surface leading to ice dams. Preventing ice dams In all Minnesota communities it is possible to find homes that do not have ice dams. Ice dams can be prevented by controlling the heat loss from the home. Dealing with ice dams Immediate action: Remove snow from the roof. This eliminates one of the ingredients necessary for the formation of an ice dam. A "roof rake" and push broom can be used to remove snow, but may damage the roofing materials. In an emergency situation where water is flowing into the house structure, making channels through the ice dam allows the water behind the dam to drain off the roof. Hosing with tap water on a warm day will do this job. Work upward from the lower edge of the dam. The channel will become ineffective within days and is only a temporary solution to ice dam damage. Long-term action: First, make the ceiling air tight so no warm, moist air can flow from the house into the attic space. After sealing air leakage paths between the house and attic space, consider increasing the ceiling/roof insulation to cut down on heat loss by conduction. Both of these actions will increase the snow load that your roof has to carry because it will no longer melt. Can your roof carry the additional load? If it is built to current codes, there should not be a structural problem. Roofs, like the rest of the home, should have been designed to withstand expected snow loads. In Minnesota, plans showing design details to meet expected snow loads are usually required to receive a building permit. The plans for your home may be on file at your local building inspection office. To help you understand the plans, or if you cannot find plans for your home, you may want to contact an architectural engineering firm. A professional engineer should be able to evaluate the structure of your home and answer your questions about the strength of your roof. Natural roof ventilation can help maintain uniform roof temperatures, but if the long-term actions described here are done effectively, then only small amounts of roof ventilation are needed to maintain uniform roof surface temperatures. If heat transfer has been reduced substantially, then snow will build up on the roof and cover natural roof ventilation systems, reducing attic ventilation rates. Natural attic ventilation systems are needed to dry the attic space and remove heat buildup during the summer. Mechanical attic ventilation IS NOT a recommended solution to ice dams in Minnesota. It can create other attic moisture problems and may cause undesirable negative pressure in the home. WARNING! Any person on the roof during the winter or performing work on the roof from below is risking injury and risking damage to the roof and house. It is important to contact professionals to carry out this job. Whenever a house is tightened up, ventilation systems, exhausting devices, and combustion devices must have enough air to operate safely and effectively! Weatherization contractors, who may be listed under Energy Management and Conservation Consultants or Insulation Contractors in the Yellow Pages, are professionals who can deal with the heat transfer problem that creates ice dams. A blower door test should be used by the contractor you hire to evaluate the airtightness of your ceiling. In addition, they may have an infrared camera that can be used to find places in the ceiling where there is excessive heat loss. Interior damage should not be repaired until ceilings and walls are dry. In addition, interior repair should be done together with correcting the heat loss problem that created the ice dam(s) or the damage will occur again. Preventing ice dams in new homes The proper new construction practices to prevent ice dams begin with following or exceeding the state code requirements for ceiling/roof insulation levels. The second absolutely necessary practice is to construct a continuous, 100% effective air barrier through the ceiling. There should not be any air leakage from the house into the attic space! Recessed lights, skylights, complicated roof designs, and heating ducts in the attic will all increase the risk of ice dam formation. Mold, mildew, and air quality Moisture entering the home from ice dams can lead to the growth of mold and mildew. These biologicals can cause respiratory problems. It is important that the growth of mold and mildew be prevented. This can be done by immediately drying out portions of the house that are wet or damp. See immediate action steps listed earlier to get rid of the water source. Action needs to be taken to clean the home environment and maintain its air quality. Additional sources of information that address these issues are listed below. The Minnesota Office of Energy Security - Energy Information Center has publications available online at Minnesota Energy : Home or can be contacted by phone at (651) 696-5175 or (800) 657-3710. INFO-U Consumer Line scripts are available at www.extension.umn.edu/info-u/ (search for topics such as mildew). Ice Dams

Ummmmm....never. Beth

Born to Run - Bruce Springsteen

2 months more eh? Work on the development side of you business man. Work on making spreadsheets for estimating, advertising campaigns, employee handbook, training vids if you got the footage. Its what I would be doing if I had 2 months free time to recoup. Low impact and highly productive. Rod!~

You really should pay attention to this if you use FB. Beth