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Posts posted by Beth n Rod
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Cannot open the file type.
Do you have it in a jpeg ?
Rod -
We found out today that a good friend lost his battle with cancer.
Rick Petry of Windsor Wood Care died of lung and liver cancer this past weekend prior to Christmas.
He was a member here on TGS and was a contributor to it's knowledge base.
We will miss him.
Rod & Beth -
I find that customers like you described are often ones that have been either taken by another contractor or were given
unreasonable expectations.
I have won these types over by setting the expectations and when possible over delivering.
Then there are ones that just can't be pleased no matter what and they expect miracles. These often have conditions that can't
be reversed and likely induced by either the homeowner/diyer or a hack.
Some people are so difficult that I will intentionally bid it high to deter their acceptance but in the case they become desparate
set a very low expectation.
In the case of excessive questions, I find it that they are insecure and often a bit squirrelley to begin with. I try to be patient but
sometimes find I have to control the narrative and leave them with either yes or no responses because they don't understand
aspects about the project/scope/technology/chemistry etc. This helps them to find a path to a decision but I often have to leave
a comfort line at the end, something to the effect of....if you have any further questions you can call me at...
Guarantees. What is to guarantee in our line of work? That the dirt will come off? That the results will last 'X' years?
I offer none where this is concerned even if I am the first one on the job because there are things I have no control over.
I don't make the sealers, chemicals, stains etc. that are being applied. I didn't get the substrate dirty and have no idea of
what it has been subject to and no way to tell until AFTER the work begins to reveal what was hidden or obstructed/disguised.
What are your thoughts on Guarantees?
Rod
john@AEC, gman201 and mike movila reacted to this -
Bidding for the price is a good start. The issues with actually doing them are the tenants.
Especially on the porches where they will tend to store a bunch of stuff and throw a tizzy if
you get them wet or whatever.
Notifications are recommended.
Price wise, Where is the water being drawn?
Is it the tenants water or from a water source belonging to the building owners control?
Since you are likely only cleaning the siding and not so much the brick, price it per section of siding.
Usually around 100-150 each.
The brick is what takes the most time to wash and generates a lot of grit debris which adds time to rinse off
everything in proximity.
If you have to wash that, double the price for each section.
Rodmike movila reacted to this -
Since there is no need for a lot of water so a small consumption machine should work for the purpose.
Most small units are 2gpm or less and are either electric or motor.
As long as the tank is high enough to provide for a decent gravity feed with a regular garden hose, there should
be no problem. Doing a test with the tank on the flow will determine the gpm requirement of the machine that is
compatible. Just fill a bucket and time it for specific amounts...1 gal, 2 gal etc.
When the gpm (gallons per minute) capability is determined, then he can buy a unit to work in that range.
Rod -
Rick2 has some good points to consider.
Protecting the customers property and preventing negative affects to the surrounding plants and amenities is important for your
reputation as a quality cleaner.
We use an M-5 to apply a degreaser and bleach mix. 3:1 (no proportioner).
Start out with 3-1/2 gallons of water in a 5 gal cubetainer then add about 6 oz of degreaser
and depending upon the severity of the mold and algae 1/3rd to a gallon of bleach and top off the
container with water.
The degreaser helps to address other common spills and lotions often on the pool aprons.
Rod -
Knee pads! Over the years I have blown out both Bursa's in my knees and can't kneel for long without pain.
Even have to wear them on ladders because working on them I lean on the ladder rails for stability.
About to turn 57 and still going strong otherwise.
When is too old?
Ask my body when it says so, otherwise....I delegate the hard work to my paid employees and take the special projects
on for myself. Gotta keep the enjoyable part right?
Rodmike movila reacted to this -
Yes. No higher than 80 grit for outdoor surfaces. Better penetration.
60 is typical in our practice due to the buffing brushes we have in that grit.
This process also helps to lessen some of the un-eveness of coverage by furniture and other seldom moved items.
Staining (adding a pigmented sealer) is a preferrence. Also helps to stave of UV greying and degradation depending
on the opacity of the stain being applied. Toners-little opacity, semi-transparent stains-more opacity. Semi-solid greater
opacity and solids are totally opaque.
Clear sealers are in the vein of toners which have little to no opacity for UV protection regardless of what they state on
the label.
RodDon reacted to this -
Once you throw in something sizable, it discounts the whole perception of value.
Then your price comes into question.
Something to consider...
Rod -
General practice after applying any product that is on the alkaline side is to apply a neutralizer.
While percarbonates become inert after they exhaust themselves, the pH is still alkaline. Stains/sealers
are designed to go onto wood that is in its neutral state which is acidic in nature.
Wash, rinse, neutralize, rinse.
RodDon reacted to this -
Yes. Clean it first, wait till dry then apply. First coat on new wood is going to look much lighter than on older wood because the fibers are still
very tight and don't absorb as well as when loosened up by aging and lignin/extractives depreciation.
When you are to perform subsequent maintenance applications, clean with oxyclean if is it just mold. If algae develops, skip the oxyclean
and use bleach and water instead. (oxyclean and bleach don't get along in a mixture) Brush and then rinse thoroughly or use a power washer
to speed up the process but remember you aren't trying to remove the color. Some may anyway as there are no significant binders to hold it on
the surface and UV degradation will make it easy to remove.
Once clean, neutralize and rinse thoroughly and allow to dry. Re-apply A/C and if mildew is a problem in your environment, you can also use a small
amount of Japan Drier in Only What you think you can apply. Not the whole container. This will help the product set up faster and give less time for
nature to deposit things that promote mildew regrowth.
Yes, still use a mildewcide in only the new container you have. Not the used/partial one you may left over from prior applications.
Any remaining product (hopefully very little) should be disposed of once a drier has been added. The product loses its properties in the can
and when you go to use it later, it will not work as designed. This is why I state to only add it to what you think you will apply. If you need a little more
you can still add it to that amount required. Keep what comes in the can in the state it was once opened (except the mildewcide if you add it. That does not
hurt the formula).
RodDon reacted to this -
Since you are using Pt Pine, you can seal it within 2 weeks of installation according to the American Wood Preservers Association, the organization that
sets the guidelines for pressure treatment in wood.
If you are going to wait that long, your exterior environment will be a dictating factor on what you will need to do.
Oxy clean is easy enough for just gray wood and some mildew growth. Neutralizing with an acid is recommended.
I am not sure what stores you have in your neck of the woods but look for a product that has either Oxalic or Citric acid
and is designated for use on decks.
If you are looking for more specifics, try https://www.opwdecks.com/
If your deck environment has high moisture conditions from a pool, hot tub or pond/water feature or sits really close to the
ground and has little to no air passage beneath (less than 2' results in pockets of dead air and high moisture retention)
then you may have to look into an additional mildewcide to help stave off mold growth during the drying period which with
A/C can be anywhere from 2-5 days depending upon how much sun and shade you have. More sun, less dry time.
RodDon reacted to this -
2k range
Rod -
Any project is dependent upon the costs associated with completing it that you company needs to stay in business.
One has to figure out all the costs your business incurs and apply them to the daily operational costs at a price that
will support it.
I would have 2 guys on that crew and it would take about 3 hours to wash so you have to figure the costs based upon at least
that factor then include your insurances (aggregated from a yearly cost to a daily and then hourly figure), the fuel, the chems,
the travel time and a margin of profit which helps the business reinvest in itself and pay benefits.
Rod -
You're Welcome.
Rod -
If they didn't kill off any existing mold, the likelihood of mold returning is certain. The extent of which is only determinable by a couple of factors.
1. Wood too wet when stained.
2. Deck too low to the ground and high moisture from the evaporating soil beneath keeping mold alive also leading to return.
3. Over hanging plants/trees, excessive shade and or hot tub/pool/pond in proximity adding moisture/humidity for the mold
to feed on.
Strip the deck. Apply bleach and water at 50/50 (bleach/water) to the bare wood and let dwell. Reapply where dark
or otherwise not the true color of wood is present. Rinse thoroughly and then neutralize.
Any stain that is oil based at that point should have an additional mildewcide added to help stave off any growth onset
during the cure time and a drier (Japan Drier) to help speed up the cure and minimize the ability for the environment to
deposit and stick in the stain.
Hope this helps.
Rodmike movila reacted to this -
The Orange looking product may be Sikkens Dek. It was all the rage back then and if that is the gazebo ceiling you pictured, then I'd leave it as an accent.
The rest of it has to be stripped unless you offer to prime and solid stain it.
Don't bother wasting your money on strippers at H.D.
Go here:https://www.opwdecks.com/and get a contractor grade product. You will need also this:633-ADD which is an additive that helps to strip acrylics and solid stains.
You can get it from here-http://www.acrproductsinc.com/Tell them I sent you.
Meanwhile, inform the customer that this is not just a sanding job as you previously thought. That is part of it but not till you get the bulk of the stain off.
There will still be some stain in the cracks. No machine or chemical is able to remove. Keeping that in mind is why I suggested priming and solid stain to hide it.
The deck boards don't appear bad enough to warrant replacement so the options are limited based upon what the customer can pay and what he is willing to
accept as the end result aesthetic.
Stripping the ceiling will be the ultimate p.i.t.a. because gravity is pulling your stripper down and in order to get the product to loosen (there are likely 2 coats)
you will have to use a stiff bristle brush to agitate it while the product is working. Get the difficulty yet?
Just clean it as the manufacturer prescribes with bleach and tsp in water and then rinse. From that level on down, make a distinct separation from it for the
other color. If you do strip the entire deck and leave the ceiling alone you can expect a decent result but inform the customer of the potential you can't get rid of the
stain in the cracks without replacing the boards. That poses another problem. With any 'see-through' stain, you will have a noticeable difference in the aged wood and
new. There is no way to match them in most cases because in order to do so, you have to not only change the color on those new boards, you have to increase the
pigment amount to compensate as well. Unless you are practiced at this, I wouldn't do it because it is more trial and error and you end up with a bunch of color pigments
you may never use the rest of and it goes to waste.
Food for thought.
Rod -
Cellular structure and pores of the wood are two completely different scales.
Soft woods don't have pores. They consist of elongated fibers. Hard woods do have pores but I doubt these are
the ones you are referring to in your post.
The cells of the wood are closed and cannot be imbued with anything without compromising the integrity of the cell.
Scientifically speaking, everything we do to wood happens at the surface and barely penetrates through to the substrate or
underlying layers. Considering that this product is designed for cedar (according to the website), I don't see much use in
pressure treated lumber which already has the protection installed.
Cedar is best protected from damage by simply sealing the end grain with an appropriate sealer upon installation. Baring that, there is
no practicality for this product to be installed unless it can be done before construction.
Stains last longer on vertical surfaces due to lack of environmental degradation and UV exposure is indirect in most cases where
this longevity is observed.
My question with the claims to increasing/impeding wood dynamic expansion etc is due to the inability to access all sides of the deck
boards/ends etc. Without installing it before the installation, I don't see the claim as reasonably accurate.
Furthermore, using a silicone derivative to seal wood prevents any stain from being able to adhere seeing as they are notorious for
setting up a repellent feature that stains are not manufactured to adhere.
Keeping that in mind, its use on a commercial scale is unsuitable as homeowners are always looking to add their own flair to the deck
in a color scheme(s) that compliments the landscaping and house. Having a bare deck greying from UV degradation and being unable
to apply a stain that will have any reasonable duration becomes a deterrent.
Applying this product before any stain would also Void any manufacturer warranty because it would impeded penetration considering the
bulk of stains produced today are now hybrids and water based to begin with.
Forgive the argument, but when it comes to wood, I am a champion of informing people and not just letting simple claims create a money
waste situation for the customer or the applicator.
In your post, I don't feel you have addressed these concerns properly and according to the website, did not find any evidence of compatibility
with any brand on the market. That in and of itself is a problem because it sets up a liability for the applicator and unreasonable expectations
for the homeowner since there are NO examples or proven trials, no accolades attesting the claims and no photos showing any duration that
can provide any confidence in the products capabilities or applicable uses.
As far as termites on cedar...yes, immature growth is susceptible but if a treatment is required, many stains on the market already incorporate
a preservative. If not, there are alternatives that do not impede the application of a stain or sealer otherwise.
Btw, the video and its presentation are outdated. CCA wood hasn't been produced since the ban went into effect 12/31/2003 most decks are
now comprised of treatments that have little detriment to human exposure.
Again, in the website, there are no photos or testimonials validating the claims.
Rod
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Depends in part on the type of product you are looking to apply.
We use Titan sprayers but the important part is actually the spray tip.
It determines the pattern, the vaporization and the amount of product it applies.
For viscous stains that are thin, smaller tip orifice sizes are applicable.
For heavier bodied stains like semi-solid to solid stains, a larger orifice would be the choice.
After that, it becomes a matter of practice and awareness of the environment you are applying in that
will ultimately determine the ones you use most.
Rod -
Thanks. It has been a wild ride to this point and we are a wreck each game.
Me gots no finger nails left!!!
Rodmike movila reacted to this -
Knocking on 57 here and I guess you just have to listen to your bones.
I'll be going for a while but I am learning to let the hired hands do the most arduous tasks and
select those that are specialized and less of a deficit to my body for myself.
Rodmike movila reacted to this -
Yes, There is a section of the forum specifically dedicated for this purpose for our members.
It's in the Bargain Basement Section you can effectively post your equipment for sale.
Rod -
The one thing I look for in a purchase is the company and how well they stand behind their product.
Given the commonality of the components, the technology standardized, there is not much to decide where the unit is concerned.
How is their customer service and durability of the product they sell?
Do they handle any issues associated with the unit well?
Other than that, you have only the model to choose to suit your needs.
Rod -
What is the question you have about them? I am assuming you have an equipment problem.
Don't own or have any experience with a Bulldog Pro but perhaps can help with the component(s) which are largely the same as most others
Rod
Eliminating "Racing Stripes"
in DIY'ers - Ask The Pro's
Posted · Report reply
We typically apply chems to assist in the cleaning. When we get the remnants of like what you are seeing, simply reapply a 50/50 bleach and water
(or stronger as you deem necessary) to finish cleaning.
If the driveway is as bad as you see, hot water can help as a future consideration. I know your machine is a cold water unit
but just to put it out there that colder temps make for less effective cleaners as well.
Food for thought.
Rod