IPe problem

[taizentek 14]

I recently asked what stain to use for my Ipe and massandruba deck. I decided with the help of many on this site to go with woodtux. Thanks for that advice but now I need more help.

A little history is in order so that you know what stage I'm at.

I built an Ipe and massandruba deck two summers ago. I let a not so professional finish it with messmers. He used twice as much as necessary and didn't wipe off the excess. (You get what you pay for!) Anyway, so much for my two tone deck. Everything came out super dark. Last fall I rented a drum sander and sanded the whole deck except the railing. It came out good, I evened off the boards which were pretty cupped and the color was back to the way it was originally.

Yesterday and today I used RAD on the railings and the deck with my pressure washer. I sanded the top rails of my railing first as I did not do them last fall. Most of the top rails (ipe) came out good but one of them and many of my floor boards did not come clean. They remained dark. I used the rad as directed and tried it at a stronger dose as well. I was able to sand some of the stubborn dark spots out on the steps. I also had some wolman deck stripper from last year. I gave that a shot on one board that I had already stripped with the rad. It got the ipe back to the original color. So with my bright idea I decided to use it on the entire floor. Some of the boards it worked on and some it made real dark. Also, I know trhe directions of the rad say to make sure you rinse it well. As many times as I go over the deck boards, it still suds up. Will the brightener nuetralize this or do I have to keep rinsing. (i've spent the entire day on about 300 sq ft.)

Can the dark spots be tannin that has been drawn out by the stripper?

How can I get rid of them?

I am sorry for the long post but I could use some advice. I took a few pictures but I haven't had a chance to upload them. I will try later.

Thanks for your advice.

Mike

[Celeste 341]

Just to make sure we're at the same stage, you've used a stripper but not neutralized at this point?

If that is the case, the darkness could be the chemical in the stripper and needs to be neutralized in order to brighten up. Until you do that and see the dry results, you won't be able to tell if or where you still have potential issues.

Celeste

[taizentek 14]

So I should go aheaad and use the brightener? I wasn't sure if I should go past this point. What about the sudsing? Will the stripper neutralize this?

Thanks

[Beth n Rod 1,279]

Are you a contractor or a homeowner?

Beth

[RPetry 564]

So I should go aheaad and use the brightener? I wasn't sure if I should go past this point. What about the sudsing? Will the stripper neutralize this?

Thanks

Stripper will not "neutralize" anything but a very strong acid. RAD is from what I understand, primarily sodium percarbonate based, a mild caustic. Stripper is very caustic, high on the pH scale. I am sure you may know that if you happened to get any on your skin.

I believe your "problem" is one of perception. Ipe' remains dark in color until fully dried. Judge your cleaning after the wood has dried overnight.

Rinse well one more time with hose pressure, let dry and put down your acid. Then stain away.

[taizentek 14]

Beth

I'm a fireman but I do carpentry on the side. This deck is actually at my mother's house. I usually try to stay away from any other phases of construction besides those dealing with wood. I should probably leave the deck staining to the pros too but I don't think I can find any that work for beer.

Rick

You're right, I needed to get away from the deck and let it dry. It does look better but it does have water stains on it and a few black spots. And I don't think the massandruba looks that good, but I guess I'll see after I put down the brightener.

I have some rad left over in my sprayer-Do you know if it keeps its potency? I was thinking of cleaning my siding this weekend (if I can get the deck stained before that.

Thanks again

Mike

[RPetry 564]

Mike,

I should probably leave the deck staining to the pros too but I don't think I can find any that work for beer.

Should have called. We work for beer. Lots of very good beer hand brewed by Trappist monks in isolated, feudal Belgium monasteries.

I have some rad left over in my sprayer-Do you know if it keeps its potency?

If RAD is sodium percarbonate based, which it very likely is, the answer is no. The mix will lose a good bit of cleaning power within 5 or 6 hours after mixing.

[Beth n Rod 1,279]

RAD (EFC-38) has a life of 4-6 hours once mixed. Mix what you will need as you need it. It has a life of about 6-12 months in the powder state.

Beth

[taizentek 14]

I took some picture of the deck so far. I finished with step two of the rad so I think I'm ready for stain. I can't figure out how to upload the fotos. It took me an 1 hour just to get them as an attachment for an email. Is there something I'm missing.

[RPetry 564]

Pressure Washing and Contractor Cleaning Forums - The Grime Scene - FAQ: Reading and Posting Messages

[taizentek 14]

I think I figured out a how to upload.

[RPetry 564]

Mike,

Looking good. For most stains on ipe', and certainly Wood Tux, a light sanding with a random orbital really does wonders for the look of the final finish. Just to be clear, you sand prior to staining.

[taizentek 14]

Are we talking going over the whole deck quickly before the stain is applied? When I sanded my top rails (prior to the rad) I used 40 grit and a lot of elbow grease. It seemed that almost no stock was removed.

One more question, I finished with the rad step 2 on thursday and now have had a couple of dry days, but it doesn't look like I will have a chance to start staining until thursday at the earliest. Will I have any issues with ph or anything?

Thanks

Mike

[Beth n Rod 1,279]

Are we talking going over the whole deck quickly before the stain is applied? When I sanded my top rails (prior to the rad) I used 40 grit and a lot of elbow grease. It seemed that almost no stock was removed.

One more question, I finished with the rad step 2 on thursday and now have had a couple of dry days, but it doesn't look like I will have a chance to start staining until thursday at the earliest. Will I have any issues with ph or anything?

Thanks

Mike

Yes. If you do it in just some spots you will see it. Sand or buff the whole thing lightly...LIGHTLY.....then blow off the sawdust with a leaf blower, and seal it. :)

Beth

[taizentek 14]

Alright, if the weather is good I plan on LIGHTLY sanding on friday and then staining it the same day. Can I use one of those mitts to apply the stain on the rails/spindles. I don't have access to a sprayer and I really don't want to set up for overspray protection. Any other suggestions are appreciated.

As always, thanks

Mike

[jimbo970 14]

Everywhere I looked, pros say not to sand ipe as it will close the pores. who is right - btw I have a cleaned ipe deck and am thinking of putting ATO on it - heard mixed results from others so will it be worth it to seal it with timber oil or should I just leave it alone and let it turn grey - I would prefer the rick oiled color and protection. Any advice is appreciated

[RPetry 564]

Everywhere I looked, pros say not to sand ipe as it will close the pores. who is right

Do not know where you are looking, but I would guess that most contractors here that work on ipe' lightly sand before staining. Ipe' is so dense, supposition that a 60 grit sanding will "close the pores" is a specious argument. Unless there is credible evidence to the contrary, this may be nonsense.

In practice, a light sanding will enhance the visual quality of most stains on ipe'. Especially for drying (example is linseed) oils, which is the most common type of exterior stain. I have seen no difference in stain longetivity between sanding and not, on my own ipe' deck.

- btw I have a cleaned ipe deck and am thinking of putting ATO on it - heard mixed results from others so will it be worth it to seal it with timber oil or should I just leave it alone and let it turn grey - I would prefer the rick oiled color and protection. Any advice is appreciated

Cabot's ATO use to be a good product prior to the VOC changes in early 2005. We have not used it on any hardwood jobs since that time. Ready Seal, WoodTux, or Armstrong-Clark stains would be good choices.

Letting the wood just grey out and weather for a year is fine, we recommend this for new ipe' to leach out natural extractives so that a stain will last longer than 3 to 6 months. As you stated in another thread that your ipe' is 10 yrs. old, this may not be helpful but it will also not be harmful. Good ipe' can go for decades without a stain. The wood is just that bullet proof.

[RPetry 564]

Jim,

On the off chance that you have not stained your ipe', here is a pic I took while working this morning. This ipe' deck was stripped with a weak, 3 oz./gal. NaOH mix, brightened with citric acid, and is being lightly sanded with a random orbital using 60 grit paper.

Note the white areas to the right and "top" of the sander. This is typical "firring" of the ipe' boards, even with a diluted stripper and low pressure rinse. From past experience I can guarantee that a semitransparent oil stain will look much better on ipe' when lightly sanded.

[jimbo970 14]

I stained yesterday with ATO and it looked awsome until this morning. Overnight the dew settled on the deck and you can wipe off most of the stain with a rag!!!

It wnr on light and there were no puddles or glossy area last night before I finished up. How can you avoid the dew scenario from over night drying? I started staining about 2 pm and finished at about 8pm. I am hoping once the sun gets fired up today it will dry it off good and I will wipe down with a towel. Any advice here or just let it go for the year? Can I wait a few days and lightly sand the boards that dont looks so good and re apply? or can I iuse a different oil stain to do this?

[jimbo970 14]

Well all the stain has not wiped off. The deck still has a dark color but there is certain boards which appear orangy in the sun. I lightly sanded one board and wiped it off and it looked ok - most important question is can I re apply in a few days after a light hand sanding or is that a mistake?

[RPetry 564]

Jim,

You said,

I did stain before checking back to your replies with ATO

Well that is a bit irritating. You ask questions, someone is kind enough to spend time and effort to try and help you, and do not even check for a response.

My last advice is to just leave your ipe' as is for the winter. Strip it and do the job right next summer.