Gutter Cleaning Out..?

[Guest rfitz]

Curious as to what people charge for cleaning out gutters, my prices start at $200 and go up from there, is that standard, hi, low etc.. for this type service, seems like more time is needed than first thought, tried the gutter hook, but it doesnt really get them as clean as getting up there with a ladder and putting tip in gutter horizontally and spraying with high pressure...?

[Paul B. 523]

Rob,

Prices vary as with all other work.

I talked to a couple of my customers this year about gutter cleaning and they have local handy-man that did theirs.

I was stunned at the price they are doing it for. One fellow does most of the houses in the neighborhood and charges $50 for 2000 sq ft ranch (about 150 linear ft) and $100 for a 2 story. He gets up on top of the roof (if pitch is not too steep) and works from there. He's normally finished in 1/2 to 1 hour from the time he hits the roof.

I would think $200 for starting price would be a bit high, but then again I don't know what size or types of houses you are talking of.

I've read some folks on these boards and from what I remember some start at about $90 and go up from there.

Again, it's all about location, size, along with supply and demand.

[Mike Smith 14]

Rob i charge by how long i think it will take me. I charge my hourly rate and can usually clean gutters on a rancher in 30 mins both sides and for 2 story i would charge around 125 for straight running low pitch roof. More complicated higher the price. The ranchers usually get 50 bucks but like i said 30 mins im done and that is add on to the house wash. If they just want gutters cleaned its a min of 85.00 to show up and go from there. I blow them out with 15 degree tip high pressure and flush down spouts.

[Mike Cappa 14]

I won't put my prices but I think you are high, but that depends on the supply and demand. I never leave the ground when I clean gutters, I have a modifed gutter cleaning attachment for and size wand I use. It works so good, I may start selling them.

[Guest rfitz]

That is for gutters only, if Im doing a house wash anyway, I would charge $125, but holding that ext wand and a bent flex end with a 40 degree tip is pretty difficult to manage, but actually, I dont too many calls for gutters maybe 1 or 2 a month

[MelissaMW 14]

When we are going to wash a house, the cleaning out of the gutters is included in the price.

Gutter cleaning only is a totally different price.

[Guest rfitz]

Wow Meissa the customer must freak when they see your price if you include gutter cleaning in the housewashing bid...?

[ron p 500]

want to see what we in NJ are dealing with?

www.nedstevens.com

click the $5 discount to see local priceing.

$50 to $75 per house.

ive watched these guy's and they bearly speak english and are FAST.

20 min or less.

Garden hose,ladder,2 pair glove's.

Everything in the gutter get's thrown on the lawn.

each crew can do 20 house's a day or more.

I saw truck #72. So i wonder how meney they have in service.

They are radio dispatched.

Hard to compete with this co.

Billboard's everywhere.

They also install garage door's.

[Guest rfitz]

Not a big demand here for gutter cleaning, but you have to think ahead, this guy wouldnt stay in biz long here with all the maint free gutters they are installing here, gutter helmet, gutter topper etc.. but the average cost per house is over $1,000 but never ever clean your gutters again

[MelissaMW 14]

Actually, the customer does not freak. They love it. We quote the house wash and tell them what all is included. A lot of the time we're adding things that "the other guy" has not and will not include. No, we don't lowball either. Our price is our price. When my husband bids (he's the one that usually does this, I've just now started getting into the bidding end because of him being in and out of the hospital), he bids it, and bids it at the profit margin he wants to be in.

It’s not real hard to have one of our guys get up on the roof and scoop out the debris in the gutters while the others are actually washing the house. Not that hard when on the ladder to point the wand in the right direction and get out the rest of the debris, algae, mold, etc. and definitely not that hard to turn up the pump a little to flush out the downspouts. Especially not while we are there and doing the house washing to begin with. You have to realize though, when we go wash a house, we have a four-man crew or more, depending on what needs done.

As far as the maintenance free gutters are concerned? No matter what, there is something, someway that is going to get into the gutter system. Pine needles, dirt, etc., yes, they say they guarantee them and will come clean them for free for a lifetime, but … how many of those businesses go out of business? There goes the warranty! The companies we’ve seen around here go out of business quick. Or let’s say that they do have the maintenance free gutters on, but they DO get clogged? Who do they call? They call us.

RonP,

Give them a call and see if they flush out the downspouts. This is one of the most important things. If there's a block in the downspouts, the gutters are not going to work. It's a good selling point! Just tell the customer what you do and add "This is one of the most important parts of gutter cleaning, flushing the downspouts. When we flush the downspouts we use high pressure and high volumes of water to get rid of any debris or clogs that are there."

Not to mention everything is getting thrown on the ground. Do they clean that up, or is that the responsibility of the customer? If I hired a person to clean my gutters and they just threw the debris on the ground and I came home to that? You can bet I’d not be giving a good review, or recommending them to anyone.

[Guest rfitz]

That is a big operation, to have 4 men cleaning a house, Im just guessing here, but lets say your paying each guy $10 an hour plus SS matching, wk comp, etc your closer to $13 -$15 an hour per man, thats over $50 an hour plus gas materials etc.. so say your at a house at least 1 hour, you already have $60 out, Im not sure what you charge per house, I am averaging a minimum of $350 a house and that usually takes 2+ hours and I can do 3 a day at less than 5% expenses, how can you beat that with all the guys you have, I mean you have to have 5 houses a day 7 days a week to keep these guys working, right ?I have ran the numbers here, and I dont see a big advantage of going real big or staying relatively small 2-3 employees part time at best, unless you guys just have a ton of commercial work, ? although I have been in the commercial end and got out because the profit margins stink, most companies here will wash gas stations that take 2 hours $60

you cant make money doing that...

[Mike Williamson 198]

Sure you can make money, just not a lot of it. It all comes back to the fact that the typical pressure washing business doesn't HAVE to make $150.00+ per hour to stay in business.

There is a company here that is bad for lowballing...the guy has several employees, and seems happy making $25.00/hour or so, based on the bids I have seen and the amount of time it takes to do the job. He does good work, and has been around for at least 4 years.

Keep in mind that with 4 guys, it shouldn't take more than 2 hours to do a house, likely considerably less. Say you're charging $350 like you said. Figure $120 of that in payroll expenses, another $30 in fuel and chems, and you're still making $200.00 in a two hour period. Not too bad. If you can do 4 or 5 of those per day, you're doing pretty well! Not all of us can, or need to, gross $1500/day.

Then again, maybe a lot of us aren't "real", "serious" pressurewashing businesses!

[MelissaMW 14]

Yes, our operation could be considered big to some, small to others. We make money at what we do though. We do not only wash houses, clean gutters, or decks. We do fleets, commercial property and industrial cleaning. If a customer calls and wants it done, we figure out the best way to do it and give them a price. (No matter what our price, if they like it or not, it’s our price.) So, since we do not only do residential, no, we do not have to do 5 houses a day 7 days a week, although in our busy time we do work 7 days a week. Running numbers means nothing really, you don’t know our prices, what we do, how much we do, and what we pay for expenses. :)

You may not see the advantage of going “big” and staying “small” may be what you feel comfortable with at this time. What are you going to do when you expand, or want to expand? We are just one of the companies that do commercial, industrial and residential customers. Pretty much, if it can be cleaned, we’ll be able to do it. We didn’t start out with all these employees we grew into it.

You seem to be a one-man operation, and you say you charge at least $200.00 per house per gutter cleaning. How many houses can you do a day, and what do you do in your gutter cleaning?

:)

[Guest rfitz]

To Be Honest, here at least, I dont get that many calls for gutter cleaning out,

mainly calls for houses, decks, patios, driveways, I can always upsell the ext gutter cleaning, but not too many people care about the inside of their gutters, I guess it is the mentality if you cant see it, it's not dirty, and yes as far as washing I am a 1 man show, for now, but have 2 rigs and 2 vehicles

ready to go for next year, could hardly keep up this year, but when I do decks, I have between 3-5 guys that stain for me on the weekends for example, we did one this past saturday, the job was $1575, two tone deck,

I had just under 3 hours washing, britening etc.. in it and saturday my guys stained and painted it, I had $150 in material and $160 in labor so that is

$310 not bad for 3-4 hours work, I pay them cash, $7.00 an hour next year I plan on doubling that, instead of 3-5 guys on the weekends, I will have 3 guys 7 days a week staining, and yes I will be doing all the washing, prepping etc.. these guys are fast and good workers, they dont stop, eat, talk etc,, they just work until I tell them to stop... they are from mexico and the best workers I have ever seen, I will have 2 operating a rig all by themself next year, I will pay them a $15000 a year salary, each, they will work 8-9 months 7 days a week and have off 3-4 months but still collecting a check, I think that is a good deal for them, and so do they...

[Mike Cappa 14]

are they legal citizens??

[Guest rfitz]

Im sure they are, they cant speak english...???

[MelissaMW 14]

As far as the Mexican workers are concerned, did you go through an agency?

I know a greenhouse/landscaping business that does this. He houses them, pays them bonuses, and they stay for the season, go back to Mexico during the cold months and come back when the season starts again. It works well for him. He said he went through an agency in Texas for this. I guess the government also comes in to inspect the housing he is providing.

[Paul B. 523]

Rob,

Most likely your workers are illegal immigrants.

It is your job as an employer to know and verify that they have social security and green cards. IT IS THE LAW.

You also should be collecting and or paying into Social Security, Unemployment, FICA, Medicare, State and Local Taxes (where they apply). As a business with employees, you should also be paying into workers comp.

You are one of the many businesses that are conducting illegal practices and hurting our economy by paying cash "under the table" and not paying and collecting taxes. What you are doing is illegal and unethical.

You are setting a bad example to all others businesses when you brag about paying $7 per hour to illegal workers and than bragging about billing $150 per hour to your customers.

How can you call Pressure Pro legitimate, when you are conducting illegal and unethical business practices?

What was the size of the deck that took 3 hours to clean and 22 man hours to paint and seal. $160 labor divided by $7 per hour is 23 man hours. It takes 7 people to finish that in 3 hours and 6 to finish in 4 hours.

I won't even get into the quality of the deck care work your customer received this Saturday knowing what the weather was like and knowing that you didn't prime under that paint job.

ROB,

You also need to check into your laws as it concerns paying salaries to laborers. That is also not legal.

To claim legitimacy and to gain any credibility, you will have to change your business practices.

[Guest rfitz]

I offered to pay them paychecks and they said no, they would rather have cash, so I told them next year, when they will be full time, we will have to do this on the up and up, since the deck was two tone, that takes alot longer and is a pain in the u know what, and that is all they did was paint the railing, I stained it, and yes this was the highest quality you will get in st. louis,

I wont do anything else, that is why I charge appropiately, and keep in mind in any biz all you are doing is reselling labor, so is $1500 worth the customers 4 -7 weekends it would have taken him and come out looking pretty poor. I think he got a good deal, I know I would pay someone $1500 to save me 4+ weekends of my time, not too mention he has to rent a PW, maybe a sander,

risk his families welfare by getting hurt doing this work and missing out on thousands of dollars of pay he missed by not being at work.. and probably have to pay a company like mine to come in restrip and redo this, I think he got an awesome deal

[Paul B. 523]

Rob,

You missed all of the points and swept them under the table.

You can pay your employees cash, but you need to withhold and pay into all the above mentioned taxes. Then give them a check stub with the cash.

You also avoided my question about the size of the deck and not using primer under the paint job you did this past Saturday.

I think many will take exception to your statemen:

"yes this was the highest quality you will get in st. louis".

[Guest rfitz]

Paul, here was the deal with that deck, it was 2nd story, 22X40 stairs post tthe whole 9 yards, the deck was approx 8-10 years old and already been done as a 2 tone, and customers wanted the deck all back to stain, no paint,

the railing was flaking chipping etc.. I told them since it was acrylic, it could not be stripped, therefore I offered to wash, strip and briten the deck, restain the floor etc.. and just go back over the railing with white acrylic paint, after washing off all the flaking paint, and then sanding down the rough areas,

they agreed and I did the job as stated before, Now since I have seen alot of other companies work here in st, louis and what my customers tell me, I know I am in the top 5 as far as the quality I put into the deck if the cust. is willing to pay for it... and I get a good amount of referral work as well from neighbors, after they see my work, and how I stand behind it free for 1 year

if anything fails or looks bad I will fix it free... that is in my contract, and as far as I know, there isnt 1 contractor in st. louis that will do that....

[Paul B. 523]

Rob,

Since this was your 1st year in business for yourself and first year doing decks, how many decks did you work on and what percentage of the overall customer base do you think you serviced?

How many total man hours did it take you to complete that project (including washing, brightening, sanding, painting and staining)? Was it 28 man hours?

How much do you think you charged per square foot?

Did you prime the areas where the paint was chipped off?

Anyone can guarantee their work for 1 year, that is not a grat feat.

[ron p 500]

they do clean the downspout's. This ned steven's is no fly by night co.

i'll bet in NJ alone they clean gutter's of 300 house's a day!

As far as mexican help, well their is a huge crackdown going on right now and with all the ID stuff you need to re-new your driver's lic., most wont be driveing very long.

I suggest changeing your buissness name to PRO-WASH/LANDSCAPEING.

Most of the trucking co. here are changeing their name's to include landscapeing. This way they can keep their help.

[Guest rfitz]

Paul, probably guessing approx. 50-60 decks, up until late summer early fall,

I did 80-90% myself, then realized my time is better off bidding, selling, prepping, etc than staining, you could almost train a monkey to stain with a brush,., and these guys want the extra cash, on weekends so what the heck,

anyway I charge $1.50 a sq ft on every deck it is easier for me to charge the exact same, it is easier to track, so say a deck is 12 ft wide plus 3 foot handrails on each side plus header, I call that 20 ft by the same method in length, I dont subtract the opening for stairs etc.. then I measure the stairs,

say they are 4 ft wide and have 3 ft railings plus header under I call that staircase 12 ft wide by whatever the length is, when I am done calculating that I add 20% to my total sq ft and charge $1.50 and I get over 50% of the bids I go on for decks, and 90-95% of the bids I get for all other washing,

I give the cust the price right then and there, no waiting, no mailing etc.. and I will not go on a bid unless I meet with the cust. this dramatically changes my close ratio, in the beginning I wasnt and was only getting 25-30% and that was a big mistake, now back to that deck I did I had personnaly 8 hours in that deck, and $160 in labor for help, i dont figure man hours I just figure %, if you can get by under 30% for labor and materials you are doing good, but that number gets skewed when you are also doing the work, I now have Quick Pro for my mac and can track labor, materials etc.. alot better

[Paul B. 523]

If you are wanting to take these workers full time and legitimate, chances are that will not happen since they are illegal and do not have social security, green card, etc., etc., so they will not be willing to do it. They'll be gone with the wind to the next job that will pay them cash.

You and your business alone are the ones at risk every day that you have illegal workers and pay cash, without paying taxes.

If one of your workers gets hurt on the job, you and your business will be at risk. You're business is not even a LLC or Limited Liability business to protect your personal assets.

You could lose your business as well as have a large judgement against you personally. Of course, LLC will not help you if you are conducucting illegal business activities or knowingly put folks at risk.

As for the deck project: You can't figure labor of some without figuring labor of all others (like your own labor). You are just decieving yourself in the long run. If you spent $160 on labor at $7 per hour then that is 23 hours, plus your 8 hrs., which totals 31 hrs. $1550 divided by 31 hours is $50 per hour. If you think you made good money, then you did and do you still think you can and have to charge $150 per hour? That would take your sq ft cost to $4.50.

[Guest rfitz]

On the hours spent i forgot to add in there was $425 for the house and gutter wash I did on that same job, and the guys I am using are legal, they have work visa's for here for 9 months, they landscape during the week and work for me on weekends weather permitting, and at this time My CPA says you cant really count your own time yet, your time is FREE unless you are backed up and not getting work done..?