Why am I using WTW?

[plainpainter 217]

So the plan was after stripping, brightening, and sanding down my deckboards with 40 grit. I would coat them with ESI's Timber oil, and

then wait a couple of weeks for it to soak in before topcoating with

Woodtux. Ok I have done everything up to and including applying

the timber oil to my PT deckboards - and it looks absolutley beautiful!!!!

Now I am beginning to think - why use woodtux? Why not stay in the world

of paraffinic oil stains? It's so easy - I can coat them again in 2 weeks, splash some in late fall - wash 'em next year, splash a coat. why bother with a curing type stain. Because after that, I will have to worry about product buildup, stripping after a time, etc. And as thin as timber oil is, it imparts so much color to the wood. Any product I have used in the past that was that thin - needed multiple coats before you started to see the color. There is soooo much pigment. I love love love - timber oil, so please remind me why I should go back to my original plan of topcoating with WTW in 2 weeks?

[PressurePros 248]

For your deck, there is no reason. Customer decks.. from my cost analysis coming more often than once every two years is not cost effective and/or profitable.

[plainpainter 217]

Ken, could elaborate a little - I am really interested in your thoughts - is it because if you have to come back all the time - customers will get fed up?

I don't think timber oil is the right stain for newer wood or really dense stuff - but would you go with this on your own decks - or do you still prefer a polymerized linseed oil curing stain system?

[Beth n Rod 1,279]

There has not been a product buildup with WT in our services. The only thing that comes close to what you may regard as build up is the amount of product that stays in the wood. That is the cured part, the excess above the surface comes off in the wash. Each application is more rich than the last but not to the point of a similar product by sikkens where the product builds on the surface to form the protective layers.

I can see your point though. But if you are going to that extreme, you might as well join the RS crowd. lol I do not have any interest in trying the timber oil as it has no market here. People want a lasting product with only the need to maintain it every couple of years and that is the minimum most are willing to accept.

But what is it you like so much?: The ease of application? The frequency of service? Or the ease of maintenance...or any combination of the aforementioned?

You have always sounded like a very intelligent tradesman and I enjoy your posts. I have to ask you this...

What do your customers want? What is the minimum they are willing to accept? What separates you from your competition?

We all look for something that makes our lives easier but I have learned that it is not always better just because it is easy.

We have based our methods of application on the premise that they conform to these 3 conditions:

1. They do not compromise the appearance.

2. They do not create a hazardous environment.

3. They do not lend to premature product failure.

Conforming to these conditions required that the product be predictable in results based upon acceptable application methods without the need to alter the formulation. Many products available specify on the label "Do not thin this product". The majority of them require back-brushing after any type of application method in order to attend to any drips, runs, laps that can be encountered in the process.

My point is simply this: If the labeling requires something in specific from the applicator, are you looking for a product that performs with the minimal amount of effort on the applicators part or are you looking to eliminate any specific steps?

I look at the steps you mentioned and can see you would achieve an outstanding result with it. I am impressed that you can offer such a detailed service because our clientele will not justify the price in lieu of the other contractors who offer more affordable solutions with store bought products.

That is the reason why I asked the questions. You have an above average service as it is by applying in a two-step system.

Rod!~

[PressurePros 248]

Dan, it would take a long, detailed, drawn out post explaining diminishing return, customer acquisition cost, maintenance profit margins, finite timelines of work completion. I just know it doesn't work for my model.

[James 624]

Dan you need to talk to people who have sucsessful maint biznesses. Ken is still a novice with this part of the field and has a one sided opinion. I on the other hand have decks that have been redone 10 times. I make more on maint and use less product and oil is better for the wood. It's a no brainer!

If you have 300s deck to manage that turn into house washes and other cleaning's. Then this decreases advertising and increases referals. I have used the least amount of oil this year and have completed more jobs.

Dan, go with your gut it's correct!!

[Beth n Rod 1,279]

Jim, We do that too...with Wood Tux.

Beth

[plainpainter 217]

Rod - let me think about your post a bit more, then I will post a response.

Ken - as a guy that's only done maybe 15 decks max in my life - I haven't even enough data to keep an actuary busy for 15 seconds before deciding there is too little data. So I don't know what my model is yet

Jim - let me tell you, never ever ever worked with a parafinnic type oil stain - it's always been polymerized type tung and linseed oil finishes. But I am really tempted to join the dark side - there is something to this product. Again I haven't worked with wtw long enough to know about product buildup - nor do I know that fine line where you tell the customer it's ok to recoat - or if you wait any longer it will need stripping. So far my experience, if a stain will last one year - it won't last two - so it needs to be recoated while it still looks great - cause you know next season it won't look good - but that's hard explaining to a customer - not to wait for evidence of failure. Not to mention every curing stain I have worked with - even if it saturates into the wood - after a couple of applications forms a varnish like coating - my assumption is that wtw would do this as well - but Rod says otherwise - again have no direct experience. I'm starting to think maybe light washes and further applications of oil without worrying about a finish going to long before it needs stripping - I just might stick with the timber oil

[PressurePros 248]

Jim,

PLEASE get over yourself. You can stan a deck. Wonderful. Ummm, news flash? It isn't rocket science. Do you know numbers? Do you know business? You're a technician, bud. That's wonderful if it works for you. Most businesspeople don't aspire to be a technician. Your health is shot. You complain about the weather crippling your earning ability yet still you cling to the idea that you are some kind of guru. You must have some kind of intense jealousy streak that prompts you to make childish posts like the one above. I have no idea of your motivation. Stick to your arena of throwing bleach and Ready Seal on a deck. If it makes you a couple dollars every year we are all happy for you. I am hardly a novice in anything business. I have owned businesses since I was a teenager. Let it go, man. Once again.. deck restoration is not rocket science. You can do this for the next twenty years and you still won't get it. Your ego is gonna put you in an early grave.

Dan, this has nothing to do with how many decks you have done, whether you prefer to do maintenance or add new customers or whatever. It is about understanding margins, dollars and business. Once again for Jim.. I maintain every deck and every customer I have earned from day one. I cannot infuse knowlege into anyone that does not understand their numbers. If you want a detailed analysis I can do that for you, Dan. I would need your numbers, your costs and all related expenses and I will put together a forecast model for you. The cost will be about $500 as it will take considerable time to do a proper analysis. Jim, I can do the same for you. Consider it, you may then realize that your thinking has kept you as the novice with respect to earnings. Perhaps then you can break free of the bondage of self and start making money.

[Tmrrptr 164]

and here is a great thread that just doesn't need to be out in public.

r

[Beth n Rod 1,279]

And...it's not. And this is why we asked the question.

Here's another question for all of you. Does this thread belong in the forum for product reviews, Q&A and issues? Let me know. It's title...says yes to me.

Beth