Waterboy 14 Report post Posted March 7, 2004 Needing help on this one. For the last month during a few times I have started up machine I have been having problems with pump priming and building up pressure. I have got it going by using shut off valve about 10 ft away close to unit. It would prime and everything would be ok from that point on. Well Today I could not get it to prime no matter what.Turned off and on, use shut off, tried turning unloader down and back up. Nothing worked... Got a full week next week and am curious if someone could help me narrow down problem. Would I need a new Pump or is it like a valve in the unloader sticking? My Mechanical abilities are thus : If it breaks I learn about it... Unit is Honda 4.0 / 4000psi 13.0 Hp General Pump Ez4040 Pulsar Unloader 280 Thanks for any help in advance... Robert Precision Power Cleaning Inc Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
One Tough Pressure 580 Report post Posted March 7, 2004 Changing of the unloader is not reccomended. I realize that you did it in desperation for reasons other than to lower pressure, but now it will be out of adjustment, and not working properly until you have the unit running right. Are you pressure feeding this machine, or running it off of a tank? If you are using a tank, have you checked for air leaks around all fittings and hoses? Do you have a filter for incoming water and if so, have you cleaned it lately? Filters usually have an o-ring seal for the sump, if you have a filter, is the seal in place? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Waterboy 14 Report post Posted March 7, 2004 Alan - Thanks for reply. I am certain the unit is getting full water from faucet not the tank. I got it strait connected through a reel atm. Was going to put filter on incoming line but havn't had chance. I think the problem has to be with seals in the pump or unloader. Just don't know which. Was recommended that I change unloader first know that the one I have cost about 40.00 and if problem still exsist then needed to dig in with a rebuild kit. If it is the pump then would the seals be hard to replace? ie. does the kit come with instruction? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Scott Stone 604 Report post Posted March 7, 2004 There are no instructions to replace the seals. I also would not replace the unloader without testing it first. The first thing to do, since you are not getting any prime out of the pump, is to hook it up to a hose for a pressure feed. Leave the hose off or disconnected for now. Turn the hose on as full as you can get it. Leave the machine off for now. After the garden hose is turned on all of the way, is there water coming out of the outlet? If there is, you know that you are getting a feed. If there is not, clean out the inlet filter. There are multiple varieties of these filters. They can be a simple screen that is where you attach the hose to the machine, or sometimes they can be a little upstream of the hose, and actually have a filter housing that you need to remove. It will be a little round thing that is on the inlet side of the pump that a pipe is running through. The top will screw off and there is a screen filter inside. If you are getting water out of the machine, turn it on, with the hose still off. Does it look like the water is pulsating? If it is, the seals should be able to pump at least a little water. If it is not, then the seals are really shot. They are not hard to replace. If you have some common sense, and can put things together the way they came apart, you will be okay. If it appears that it is pumping water, turn off the machine, and Attach the gun. See if it is working now. If it is not, check the unloader. Hopefully you have a rubber line between the unloader, and the inlet of the pump. If you do, you can try to turn on the machine, with water to it. Hold the gun open, and pinch off the line as tightly as you can. If the pressure goes up, the unloader is probably bad. It is time to replace it. If you sensed a vibration in the gun, it could be one of the valves has gone bad, or an o-ring in the pump has gone bad. You will need to take all of the valves out and check them. After the valves are out, suck on the big end of them, and see if there is an easy draw of air. If there is, there is something wrong with the valve. Chcck that the housing on the valve is not cracked, or that the little plate in the valve is not broken. While they are out, you can also check to make sure the orings that the valves sit on are in good shape. For me, the first thing I usually check on a low/no pressure situation is the valves. They are easy to get at, and are fast to check. Then I would worry about seals. I can check the unloader with my machine on simply by seeing if water is flowing back into the tank. There are other thigns to check, but these are the biggies, Scott Stone 1 Beth n Rod reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
beyoungsr 14 Report post Posted March 8, 2004 Alan - Thanks for reply. I am certain the unit is getting full water from faucet not the tank. I got it strait connected through a reel atm. Was going to put filter on incoming line but havn't had chance. I think the problem has to be with seals in the pump or unloader. Just don't know which. Was recommended that I change unloader first know that the one I have cost about 40.00 and if problem still exsist then needed to dig in with a rebuild kit. If it is the pump then would the seals be hard to replace? ie. does the kit come with instruction? You have posted a little more info. here than on the other board you posted on. Are you sure the incoming water line is not kinked on the reel? This can easily happen when using a cheaper supply hose. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Waterboy 14 Report post Posted March 8, 2004 Scott - Wow , thanks for the detailed help. I will try everything you said and will keep you posted on what the problem turns out to be. Beyonger - Thanks for your help on Steve's board. Hope I didn't offend anyone by posting on 2 boards but I was desperate to find someone who had same problem. Your help is invaluable as well. Incoming water was off a well but in times past when the supply as been less then 5 gal The pressure would rise and fall. The faucet seem to produce what I needed and the low (no primed) pressure was consant. pushing better then the machine not being on but I could put my hand under it. I got go to do a job (if I can) and will know more tonight... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Waterboy 14 Report post Posted March 9, 2004 Ok Guys, got it fixed...:cheers: When I got to job I wanted to check and see if it was the last customer water source as I got your advice after leaving the one before. Turned faucet on before hooking up line and got a huge blast of city water. Hooked up hose and disconnected at pressure washer. Same force. Hooked up line, pulled trigger and got decent flow. Cranked up machine while holding trigger to blow out air and got nothing but about about a 5% increase. :hmmm: Gave it few minutes to prime then tried pinching rubber bypass line to unloader...Pressure went up and this was good thanks to you telling me Scott what this would mean. Advised customer I would be back in few hours. Went to local PW supply shop and got unloader. He recommended taking off easy start bypass line and just relieve pressure in future out of hose before cranking it on. He said they cause more problems and feature is not needed. Went at it like a mad man. Took off unloader and everything appeared to be ok. Took off easy start bypass line to plug it and found a broken spring inside. Put the new unloader on, hooked everything up and I got a used (but feels like brand new) machine. I got more power now then I had when it was new. I am not sure if it was a decrease over time but I got to watch out for 30/40 foot xjet over sprays where it use to be 20. Power of a size 10 was a concern for me today. Never had to worry about that before. O and wrist is feeling a bit more sore then normal. :whip: Just want to say thanks and let you know that when you reply it is not in vein and is appreciated :) Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
beyoungsr 14 Report post Posted March 9, 2004 Ok Guys, got it fixed...:cheers: When I got to job I wanted to check and see if it was the last customer water source as I got your advice after leaving the one before. Turned faucet on before hooking up line and got a huge blast of city water. Hooked up hose and disconnected at pressure washer. Same force. Hooked up line, pulled trigger and got decent flow. Cranked up machine while holding trigger to blow out air and got nothing but about about a 5% increase. :hmmm: Gave it few minutes to prime then tried pinching rubber bypass line to unloader...Pressure went up and this was good thanks to you telling me Scott what this would mean. Advised customer I would be back in few hours. Went to local PW supply shop and got unloader. He recommended taking off easy start bypass line and just relieve pressure in future out of hose before cranking it on. He said they cause more problems and feature is not needed. Went at it like a mad man. Took off unloader and everything appeared to be ok. Took off easy start bypass line to plug it and found a broken spring inside. Put the new unloader on, hooked everything up and I got a used (but feels like brand new) machine. I got more power now then I had when it was new. I am not sure if it was a decrease over time but I got to watch out for 30/40 foot xjet over sprays where it use to be 20. Power of a size 10 was a concern for me today. Never had to worry about that before. O and wrist is feeling a bit more sore then normal. :whip: Just want to say thanks and let you know that when you reply it is not in vein and is appreciated :) Happy that you got things going! I also find the easy start useless. In the future I would check flow by using a five gallon bucket and timing how long it takes to fill it. Do this 3-4 times and you should determine your expected flow for that site. Five gpm or more should keep you out of trouble. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
