Environmental BMPs

[PWNA HQ 14]

The Need for a National Organization

From the late 80’s and into the early 90’s, contractors in different areas of the country began hearing from enforcement official that they were in violation of the Clean Water Act. This was a major concern as it appeared that the mobile power washing industry may be on a collision course with environmental regulators that would set out to put our industry out of business. It was at this time that Robert Hinderliter began reaching out to the EPA, state and local environmental officials to learn more regarding the future implementation of these laws and what could be done. He was told that to be heard and have influence with governmental agencies there would need to be representation from an industry trade association. Governmental agencies would respond to Trade Associations but not to individual companies.

The PWNA was Born

In 1992, PWNA was formed and the first trade show was held to discuss the future of the industry and what solutions contractors could implement to survive the future of environmental regulation and enforcement. It has and will continue to be PWNA’s position that law makers and enforcement officials implement practices that will benefit both the environment and the contractors in the mobile power washing industry. By creating regulation that will reasonably allow mobile power washing contractors to comply with the regulations; enforcement officials have found that there will be a high level of voluntary compliance if the regulations are reasonable, rational, and logical. This in turn will reduce the cost of enforcement, greatly increase industry compliance and most importantly reduce the amount of pollutants that would otherwise end up in our lakes, rivers, streams and oceans. In other words, the mobile power washing industry can actually be used to help clean the environment.

A Clear Voice for the Industry

Since that first meeting the PWNA has had representation that helped create a model ordinance for the City of Fort Worth that is referenced on the EPA website. Many other cities have used the model ordinance and consulted with the PWNA to aid in the development of their cities ordinance. As an aid for regulators and mobile power washing contactors alike a draft Environmental BMP was voted on by the PWNA Board of Directors and is now being released to PWNA members for public comment. The minutes of this Board call, as with every Board call is or will be viewable on the PWNA website. The following is the time line for final approval of the BMPs:

· The draft BMPs are being emailed to all current PWNA members for review and comment. The BMPs will also be put on the PWNA website.

· Member comments will be posted on the PWNA website. All comments must be submitted by April 15th.

· Those comments will be reviewed by the Environmental Committee. The committee will decide which changes, corrections, additions and deletions will be made to the BMPs.

· By May 1st, the Environmental Committee will submit an updated draft of the BMPs to the Board of Directors for a vote to either accept, reject, or modify the BMPs.

· The membership will be informed on the status of the BMPs after the vote.

· PWNA representatives will attend the next Houston meeting.

· The Environmental Committee will next begin working on municipal guidelines. Any member interested in being on the committee should contact Jackie.

Please submit all questions and comments to Jackie at PWNA headquarters. Email to info@pwna.org or call toll free 1-800-393-7962. Thank you.

Sincerely,

The Board of Directors

[Lightning Gene 66]

So does this mean you just represent PWNA members or ALL Contractors ?

[Beth n Rod 1,279]

One would HOPE all contractors. We are members, but this is NOT a members only issue....

Beth

[C&S Property Services 24]

Jackie,

Could you tell everyone who is on the Environmental committee and possibly give their background? This may ease some people's minds. Especially since it is such a big issue and involving ALL contractors.

[Ron Musgraves 240]

Yes Rob thats a great idea

Jackie,

Could you tell everyone who is on the Environmental committee and possibly give their background? This may ease some people's minds. Especially since it is such a big issue and involving ALL contractors.

[Guy B 70]

The PWNA has chosen to adopt the Ft Worth TX BMP's as their model. I urge anyone interested to check this out!!!

This is my reply to the announcement at ***

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Mr. Hilborn, I will restrain my commits until some Questions are answered. What is the PWNA going to do with this BMP? Are you going to "Shop This Around To States or Cities For Implementation"? Because from what I see All Contractors will have to be permitted & registered.... PAY to be permitted & registered Every Year..... Most Cities & States Do Not Require This!

If you're Permitted & Registered and Violate the BMP, They Can Cut Off Your Water And Sewer. If You Violate The BMP And don't Pay The Fine...They Will Put A Lien On Your Property.

It Seems This BMP Creates A New Revenue Stream For State And Local Governments At The Expense Of Not Only Your Members But, ALL Contractors, And More Government Oversight And Regulations To An Industry That Doesn't Want Or Need Them!!!

I Am Not A "Cosmetic Pressure Washer" I Am A "Health And Safety Pressure Washer" Our Services Protect The Health & Safety Of Our Customers And Their Families.

Mike, you're a good guy in my book, I'm sure you feel that this is a good thing for the PWNA, and it may be, But this BMP Is Not In The Best Interest Of Contractors. I Humbly Ask You to Stop this Now.

Edited April 1, 2011 by Guy B

[C&S Property Services 24]

Guy,

Relax a little buddy. Using the Ft Worth BMP's as a model isnt necessarily bad. And before you bite my head off let me ask you this. WHat does Houston have as a BMP? Wouldnt the FW one work better than what Houston has? I am not one to say that its the best and only one we should have. But if you are the Houston contractor right now I would think the FW BMP looks golden right about now right?

I suggest everyone review it and look it from a business model. It can be and may need to be tweaked.

[Celeste 341]

It might look "golden" but it's still not good.

Rob, we aren't doing anything WRONG.....Pressure Washing companies are NOT the problem. We're the SOLUTION!

[Beth n Rod 1,279]

I see no reason why we can't do BETTER.

...ahem....CONTINUOUS IMPROVEMENT.....

Beth :cup:

[PWNA HQ 14]

Jackie,

Could you tell everyone who is on the Environmental committee and possibly give their background? This may ease some people's minds. Especially since it is such a big issue and involving ALL contractors.

Yes Rob! The PWNA Board of Directors include Eric Clark, Steve James, Doug Barrett, Charlie Arnold, Dan Galvin, Daryl Mirza, Paul Horsley, John Nearon, and Mike Hilborn. You can find biographies for each board member on our website at The PWNA - About The PWNA. Robert Hinderliter is our Environmental Chairman and his biography can be found there as well. PWNA member Scott Stone is a part of our Environmental Committee as well.

[C&S Property Services 24]

Celeste,

I hope you didnt take what I was saying the wrong way. Just putting my .02 cents in. I was just trying to tell Guy to not get all worked up over this. I think on one level this subject is getting bigger than it deserves and on another level if we got the right people in place (including attorneys) we would have changes made to help the contractor on a more reasonable level. Has anyone ever heard of the Fair Business Act? The state n which you live and even on a federal level can be sued by businesses. Do you think that would get some attention? Heck yeah it would. Not saying its the solution but it would perk up some ears.

I do think there are alot of improvements for alot of areas regarding the CWA and recovery. One has no relation to the contractor. I had called about obtaining a NPDES permit to properly discharge the wastewater from a HUGE job we were doing. The person answering the phone knew nothing about how I could obtain one and then forwarded my call on to someone else. That person in turn tells me the State (we were working in) DOES NOT issue NPDES permits to power washing companies.

[C&S Property Services 24]

Jackie,

So Robert and Scott make up the whole committee? Sorry, without reading all the bylaws I want to make sure I understand correctly. Or does the whole BOD stand as committee members too?

[Guy B 70]

Sorry Guys, when I saw this I guess my "Southern Blood" boiled a bit, you know how we are.

This PWNA BMP is going to be submitted to the EPA Apr 15. Remember a little while back 2 "Young Ladies" wanted to gather "Comments" for Contractors about Pressure Washers & the CWA because the EPA was asking? And the "Storm" they went through???? This BMP is what the PWNA will be sending in to the EPA.

I am not "Anti-PWNA" but this is bigger than the PWNA, this will affect ALL Contractors, not just PWNA Members. This BMP does not speak for me and neither does the PWNA.

We should be working together...Everyone working together, to come up with a "Common Sense BMP". This would be a Super chance to raise the level of awareness about who we are and what we do. The Public at large still think we're a bunch a "Yea-Hoo's" squirting water.

If the PWNA comes up with a "Common Sense" BMP or Plan, I will be more than happy to get behind it. Until then, in the words of "Buddy Holly" I will "Rave On".

[Celeste 341]

I think this may call for some "emergency" conference calls, or mass Skype, or a meeting of some sort. If Guy is correct, we have less than TWO weeks to submit changes to our "representatives" (not sure how this works with non-members who will also be badly affected by them)

I learned a while back during the drought that a lovely way to stop wheels from turning out of control is by papering them to death. They will have to take notice.

As one of the two "young ladies"......I still want to compile this same information and DO something with it that will help contractors.....not egos and bean-counters.

[Ron Musgraves 240]

So what we are saying is two people Scott & Robert worked on these closely together?

Why do we keep making these types of blunders. No committee of two people could ever decide this for any org no matter how Small the PWNA is. If this org wants to ever be recognized today they need to have management in place thats going to be responsible.

Yes I'm allowed to hurt little volunteers feelings, I want all that crap to stop also. This is business, no one here is attacking anyone personally. I hold all the BOD members and the general membership responsible. I hold myself responsible for not being involved more.

Yes the reason I was comfortable not being involved was because I had faith in Mike.

If Mike wants to restore faith in me and the industry stop playing the volunteer card. no one harder than me puts efforts into this industry, members are allowed to voice there opinions and we will not accept these BMP written by one person. Scott Stone did not participate much, I'm not here to argue. You claim Mike he didn't show up , he's says he was never notified. Your BOD didn't even know who he was. So I will side with Scott, the moral of the story is you better build better Systems when running this org if you ever want it to be what it could be.

Personally with how this is going I see the same mistakes being made even when you where advised not to make them.

Your BOD is Un-aware of this miss management, your not accepting that this could have been done better.

Jackie, hope the new babies doing great.

Jackie, your being baited. We know the entire BOD no one has the credentials to write advise or articulate what a BMP's is or what it really means. Robert doesn't know it all, no one person can.

The point people are trying to make is that with all the money we didn't maybe consult a real engineering firm to Bless these. Real associations hire independent people outside the trade to look at what's been presented and advice us the people who execute them the pro and cons.

Robert can be upset with me about this but he doesn't know the latest and greatest. We need to work with educators and others cities that have had success. Ft.worth worked years ago and Robert saved the day. Today its a program thats went from 1million to over 50million in less than 5 years. Now the PWNA wants to present this????

Eric washes trucks, Steve James Decks, Doug Barrett Windows, Charlie Homes, Dan Galvin Homes, Paul Rail cars, John ???, Mike Hilborn Homes,

Daryl we all know the biggest risk daryl has is getting a paper cut with all the $$$$$. (KEC)

Explain what guy deals with this except Scott Stone and he was out of loop. None of the people on the entire BOD really are dealing with the CWA, its off property discharge. Paul might and Eric might depending on there process. Fleets are a completely different animal.

Please re-group and get a responsible BMP.

Trade association fight for the interest of members, members should not be fighting a trade association.

I will not fight the PWNA, as I have said earlier, I have no time really to worry about what this association keeps doing year after year. Through examples in how we have helped the industry the PWNA can learn and assist the coalition.

If the PWNA wants to be involved in the moving forward movement jump on. The coalition will have Legal people & professor that speak at meeting and education for contractors to protect there business.

The coalition will not discriminate ageist anyone wanting its help. We will build bridges with State and local authorities for reasonable laws and regulations and choose battles when alternatives have failed.

This is for contractor in the entire cleaning industry, we all are affected by this. Frankly fighting with the PWNA is a waist if resource.

National Cleaning Expo is a current member several of these groups in the industry and will also put fourth its Show front to keep providing great water Storm management advancements.

We will have something at coming shows that will help educate and assist contractors in there environment.

First thing is that no association can adopted a standard regulation. OPPPSSS why do you think the feds allowed each region, cities counties and states to decide there own? Because all demographics and environments are different. They will be different and well as the differences in what your cleaning.

This is what's its all about- Education

Yes Rob! The PWNA Board of Directors include Eric Clark, Steve James, Doug Barrett, Charlie Arnold, Dan Galvin, Daryl Mirza, Paul Horsley, John Nearon, and Mike Hilborn. You can find biographies for each board member on our website at The PWNA - About The PWNA. Robert Hinderliter is our Environmental Chairman and his biography can be found there as well. PWNA member Scott Stone is a part of our Environmental Committee as well.

[C&S Property Services 24]

Ron,

Please do NOT insinuate that I was baiting Jackie. I was simply asking who was on the committee. If someone or anyone wants to speak about my business or the industry I work and it will effect my business in one way or another I want to know who it is. Thats why I was asking Jackie. I didnt know who was speaking for the PWNA, NOTHING MORE. I am tired of seeing one guy try to stand up to the EPA, MHIC, AARP or whatever and THINK FOR ONE MINUTE that will make a difference. It wont happen. WE need a group of intelligent SOB's that are not afraid to step forth.

As for all the other stuff. I have been on the phone for hours yesterday and today talking with intelligent people about what my thoughts were.

[Ron Musgraves 240]

No intent , my point was that no one person at the PWNA or even this Coilition are qualified to write a BMp without the local educators and help from some Scientist to determine the problems at hand in there area.

BMP are about size and demographics of a city. If this didnt matter we all could accept the same one. Yes some are very similar!!

Ron,

Please do NOT insinuate that I was baiting Jackie. I was simply asking who was on the committee. If someone or anyone wants to speak about my business or the industry I work and it will effect my business in one way or another I want to know who it is. Thats why I was asking Jackie. I didnt know who was speaking for the PWNA, NOTHING MORE. I am tired of seeing one guy try to stand up to the EPA, MHIC, AARP or whatever and THINK FOR ONE MINUTE that will make a difference. It wont happen. WE need a group of intelligent SOB's that are not afraid to step forth.

As for all the other stuff. I have been on the phone for hours yesterday and today talking with intelligent people about what my thoughts were.

[C&S Property Services 24]

I can totally agree with what you just said Ron. This is way bigger than one person. Scott Stone and I tried to get something going for the ***** a while back and it was fun and very knowledgable not to talk just talk to someone who knows their stuff but someone who has different run off problems than we do. For instance I never really knew about the dry wells you all have in AZ. So how would I be able to write, speak or educate about them?

I think we need contractors from every area to speak up. If this saga continues then it will effect all contractors. No doubt there.

[Ron Musgraves 240]

Actually Maryland is 94 % complient. The most in the USA

I can totally agree with what you just said Ron. This is way bigger than one person. Scott Stone and I tried to get something going for the ***** a while back and it was fun and very knowledgable not to talk just talk to someone who knows their stuff but someone who has different run off problems than we do. For instance I never really knew about the dry wells you all have in AZ. So how would I be able to write, speak or educate about them?

I think we need contractors from every area to speak up. If this saga continues then it will effect all contractors. No doubt there.

Edited April 3, 2011 by Ron Musgraves

[RGilliam 46]

No intent , my point was that no one person at the PWNA or even this Coilition are qualified to write a BMp without the local educators and help from some Scientist to determine the problems at hand in there area.

BMP are about size and demographics of a city. If this didnt matter we all could accept the same one. Yes some are very similar!!

I agree! :applause: :applause: :applause:

[Jim Gamble 20]

For instance I never really knew about the dry wells you all have in AZ. So how would I be able to write, speak or educate about them?

I think we need contractors from every area to speak up. If this saga continues then it will effect all contractors. No doubt there.

Drys wells are being pulled all over the State of California because... THEY DON"T WORK. The tanks are usually made of thin galvanized steel that needs to be supported by its surroundings. Sanford and UC Berkley did a study that they leak their containments into the soil over time, eventually reaching the underground water ways and polluting the soil.

It is only a matter of time before you will see all states pulling their units up.

[tonyshelton 112]

Drys wells are being pulled all over the State of California because... THEY DON"T WORK. The tanks are usually made of thin galvanized steel that needs to be supported by its surroundings. Sanford and UC Berkley did a study that they leak their containments into the soil over time, eventually reaching the underground water ways and polluting the soil.

It is only a matter of time before you will see all states pulling their units up.

Jim, an internet search failed to provide any text or abstract from any dry well studies conducted at Sanford or UC Berkeley. There was one from Michigan that stated they were looking for a single particular contaminant but were unable to determine whether it came from the numerous city ran dry wells or from two local chemical plants.

Please provide the reference if you are going to cite it authoritatively.

[Ron Musgraves 240]

So you saying that educators and law makers would rather that gas station just dump the waste from mother nature straight into our drinking water and storm system without being cleaned.

Jim again I would love to see this info, since Maryland is the most responsible and complient state in the Union. LOL

I really wish you would stop spreading false information Jim, its doing damage to the people lives. Some folks here look to you for guidence. This time you have lost me JIm, watch the video I posted Jim and you will understand that captures oil before it enters the storm or groundwater. If this did not exist the oil would have been flushed out into the storm system hurting the children Jim. Jim please lets stop hurting the Children, your suggestion that this video is hurting people is false.

Everyone determine for themselves, if this gas station had not build this system the oil could have escaped. TRUE OR FALSE

Drys wells are being pulled all over the State of California because... THEY DON"T WORK. The tanks are usually made of thin galvanized steel that needs to be supported by its surroundings. Sanford and UC Berkley did a study that they leak their containments into the soil over time, eventually reaching the underground water ways and polluting the soil.

At the End of the Sand Trap is a Dry well Retention.

It is only a matter of time before you will see all states pulling their units up.

Edited April 5, 2011 by Ron Musgraves

[Ron Musgraves 240]

Here we go, Off Topic. My Apology Beth

[tonyshelton 112]

I guess any BMP by any org or city is fine with Jim as long as it eliminates some of his competition. He doesn't even want to compete with dry wells.

Oh the humanity! What about the children! :)

All joking aside we need to look for common sense solutions. A dry well is a good, common sense solution for many applications. Dry wells are not left there to fill with contaminants. They are maintained by companies that remove the contaminated material and replace it on a regular basis. This is good for us because it eliminates our worry about runoff and allows the minuscule amounts of contamination brought up by our cleaning to be disposed of right alongside the contaminants that mother nature has already washed off. It looks like a win-win situation to me.

Still waiting for that study from Berkeley Jim.