Follow up on ipe deck staining

[PressurePros 248]

Most of you woodies probably remember the thread and pictures about the ipe deck builder that tried to prep a deck prior to us coming in to stain it. The cost of our prep was built into the project and the story as to why they ended up doing it without my knowlege is not important. I forgot to post the results. The stain job came out okay and all ended well.. other than the contractor paying me for a sanding and repair job of course. Deck was cleaned with Restore-A-Deck to remove any dirt ground into the ipe deck.

Here's the before and after.

[MMI Enterprises 289]

Looking good mang!..what it stained with?

[PressurePros 248]

One coat of WoodZotic, applied by mop and hand rubbed.

[john@AEC 37]

Top job Ken, and again shows how important preparation is.

[plainpainter 217]

Looks awesome! So how long does woodzotic last on that wood before needing a follow up coat?

[Beth n Rod 1,279]

Thanks for sharing Ken. :)

Beth

[PressurePros 248]

Looks awesome! So how long does woodzotic last on that wood before needing a follow up coat?

Dan, this is a high sun recieving ipe deck. Maintenance has been arranged annually. Using a product like Cabot's Australian Timber Oil on it, we'd probably be there twice per year.

[john@AEC 37]

Cabot's Australian Timber Oil

To ask what may appear a dumb question, but "what is Australian Timber Oil?" It's not something we get over here? We don't get an "American Timber Oil" either.

Does it have something uniquely Australian in it? (Emu & Goanna oil have been used for treating muscle soreness - back in the old days, but it would leak through the glass bottle and make a mess in the cupboard, so it went out of fashion.

May be it's "export quality" - too good for us locals.

[PressurePros 248]

hahahaa, John, thats ironic its not even available down there. I imagine, and this is pure speculation, that there was something uniquely Australian about it when it was first made. Probably like you mentioned, a unique oil.

[James 624]

Dan, all the decks I did last year look pretty bad at 8 months and some at 6 months. Maint. will be a huge issue after a couple of redo's. One good thing is it comes off like butter. Is that good or bad? It started to break down an absorb water at 4 months. Will there be a new formula this spring? So far I have been very disappointed with the results but I'm using it with regret's.

[PressurePros 248]

Jim, to clarify, your experiments were done with a different product and that product was mixed with Ready Seal, right? Please think carefully about your answer. I have never sold you a single gallon of product. I cannot have you disparaging or insinuating otherwise. There are plenty of other threads where you can make your feelings about the other product manufacturer known. I ask you as a fellow professional to keep things on the up and up. Feel free to call me or contact me via print and I'd be happy to clarify any questions you have or share the experiences I have had.

[James 624]

No products mixed with RS . No experiments. Same product different label. These are actual results nothing cherry coated.Ken, you just insulted Aussy Timber OIL.

[James 624]

I forgot to say a bunch of your stuff was shipped to me by accident !!

[MMI Enterprises 289]

Thanx for clarifying.. I was unconfinced which product Jim was refering to. Seemed as if Woodzotic but the nature of internet and people not reading often results in miscommunication.... If I were to ask or say anything surrounding how any of these products last it would only be proper to mention that most hold to a truth that none of them last very good on a woods first staining. Most say subsequent stainings hold better for various reasons.

Jim,

I thought you said in other threads to the effect that you haven't been able to get anything to last on ipe..least as of late anyways. Is this the product you had refered to elsewhere?. Coulda sworn it was another product in WTW perhaps...

John, I think they used 'aussie' as the land down under is an exotic place to Americans for one and for two you guys do have some hard wood right?

[James 624]

Woodzotic and Woodtux are the same product.

[MMI Enterprises 289]

Woodzotic and Woodtux are the same product.

Woodtux maybe different each season right?...is woodzotic?

I like stain and seal actually...isn't woodzotic more like that?

[PressurePros 248]

Kevin, if you have questions about my products, where they are manufactured and what formulations are used, please ask me directly. Jim has issues with Russell and for some reason feels the need to vent his frustrations on the internet. I'm not going to get into a tete-a-tete discussion online with him.

[Beth n Rod 1,279]

Woodzotic and Woodtux are the same product.

Ken,

We learned this in a meeting recently, which products are what. As I understood it the wiping stain and WT are the same thing.

The issues Jim has are the same issues others have had last year which are some of the same issues everyone has with just about any oil these days, which is that the performance of oils (alkyds specifically) is not what it used to be. If you add the other brand specific issues (that were very very real) to the mix, well, it is what it is.

Beth

:cup: it's grrreat! :cup:

[PressurePros 248]

I must be in the twilight zone. Neither of you have any idea how I run my business nor with certainty whom manufactures my products, and certainly not with any certainty what my formula is. Lastly, it is irrelevant. I stand behind my products 100%. They are delivered on time, they perform exactly as I say they do. I didn't sell this product to three people on the internet. Its gone all over the country. I monitor the feedback and watch things closely. I initiate changes when they are warranted. I don't what type of business you (beth and jim) think I run but it is not the same as the other company in question.

Final time I am going to ask to discuss this with me privately. I cannot and will not discuss the inner workings of my business on an open internet forum. I think it shows very poor ettiquette to ask me to do so.

[Beth n Rod 1,279]

Ken,

My comments are directed to oils in general. See this article...

Going, going, gone? Environmental restrictions are making oil-based paints and stains scarce in some areas | Building Products | Find Articles at BNET.com

Good luck with Woodzotic. Hope it's a success for you.

Beth

[plainpainter 217]

Two different paint companies can go to the same supplier {who will also package the ingredients for the paint companies} and spec out two different products with different resins and so on.

[James 624]

Ken, you have and do go around on all the site's bashing every other product for hardwoods. It's funny to watch this little marketing engine work and just to make this product seem like Nirvana. My issue's with Russel reflects every persons issue's with the product and him. I deal with facts and real world application of a products. People in the industry seek out my opinion on this very issue and give me products for review because of my expertise and integrity.

I use this product and will probably continue to use it and give my opinion and I hope it can get better. At this time the positive is it looks great and you can put it down soon after a deck is built. Everything after that is crap shoot with Maintenance. I think I've come up with a solution but it will take a year to see if it works.

If the product doesn't go down after a deck is built and the wood turns grey there is major prepping (buffing). After the product is applied and let go for 18 months it's probably best to strip it off and re buff. Already had to do that!!So the window of re-application (maintenance) between 6 and 12 months is critical to a maintenance program.

Is this Product any better Than TWP, READY SEAL, MESSEURS, ATO and PENOFIN. No, It all comes down to knowing about hardwoods and the maintenance of the product.

Ken , because you sell a product your views and opinion are Skewed. You just don't want issue's to come because of the internet and where it might come up. I have two years now with this product on allot of

IPE with more questions than answers and no confidence in the supp- liar.

[MMI Enterprises 289]

Two different paint companies can go to the same supplier {who will also package the ingredients for the paint companies} and spec out two different products with different resins and so on.

Daniel about says it..Is about same in the wine making industry. To end user the supplier/distributor would be the one having it made...in this case Ken. We all can have our own stuff made up special or we can have manufactures relabel. We could jump in a relabel situation every day of the week if we wanted to. To say or imply a product is exact same as another is wrong and may deserve action.....

Fenner my friend you share the inner workings of yer biz all time which is pure goodness. Would not expect you to share exact proprietary recipe of that product though. No need to defend it really but for to say it not same.

[plainpainter 217]

Jim, just so we're on the same page - your critiscms of certain products. Do they stem from your use of them on hardwoods or all woods? I am very unfamiliar with hardwood decks - most of my work is ptp.

[MMI Enterprises 289]

"liar" that a pretty big word to be throwin around. I prefure proof before I believe,..pm would be best...

Way I see it liar is person saying something when they already know it a falsehood. Saying a falsehood without knowing is just lack of proper education, guessing, or possably intent to mislead via mutual ignorance.

[PressurePros 248]

Jim just leave my products out of it. Your issue is with Russell and/or ESI. Be a man and take those issues up with him directly.