Got that carrot dangled right before me today!

[plainpainter 217]

To the tune of $40. This is an older guy talking about how he has this little bit of gutter to have cleaned, some guy has been doing it in his neigborhood - blah blah blah. And then he tells me how much he has been having it done for.

Of course my 'minimum' has come down atrociously lately - and I gave him the $85 minimum and how a professional company can't come for less no matter how small the job, and that I have insurance. And he is like yeah, yeah, I totally agree and understand.

Then he tells me....but still I am going to look around or perhaps even do it myself, since I have some ladders.

Another day of life in the 'valley' of northeastern mass. And this is a big bucks neighborhood to boot. Man, up is down, left is right, and suddenly $40 jobs are profitable and pay for all your direct and indirect expenses plus profit to boot!!! At best this is an ok upsell item for a landscaping crew that is there already.

[Doug T 19]

Dan,

My usual gutter price for homes is $125-$175. But I was on a job Thursday and some elderly lady called and wanted to know if I could clean her gutter. Single story, only above the the back porch. So I hit it on the way home, $40.00 cash, and she wants me to do a house wash in the spring. If it comes true good and if not so what, it took me 15 minutes.

So depending on location, that's how I would handle. Be nice to the elderly, they have lots of friends.

Karma, Dan, Karma

Edited November 22, 2009 by Doug T

[RPetry 564]

... Be nice to the elderly, they have lots of friends.

Karma, Dan, Karma

So true. My wife and I are within sniffin' range, less than a decade, of SS, and one's perspective on life and money/savings certainly change. Less speculation and more preservation/value is a normal mindset. Use it to your advantage.

[plainpainter 217]

I don't know - an elderly person waving $40 in my face - is kind of like going to the apple orchard after Veryfine Apple Juice has come and gone. Not many apples left to pick.

[RPetry 564]

Dan,

In the right market and demographics, the > 55 yr. old age bracket of homeowners is prime for residential work.

[plainpainter 217]

Dan,

In the right market and demographics, the > 55 yr. old age bracket of homeowners is prime for residential work.

Last winter, Rick, had an elderly couple putting their home on the market after first buying it back in '82. And they wanted 4 rooms painted, which included removing wallpaper for like 1-1/2 rooms before mudding and repriming.

their budget for the total job was $500 - you tell me, am I in the right demographic for > 55 yr. old?

[Thad 135]

Last winter, Rick, had an elderly couple putting their home on the market after first buying it back in '82. And they wanted 4 rooms painted, which included removing wallpaper for like 1-1/2 rooms before mudding and repriming.

their budget for the total job was $500 - you tell me, am I in the right demographic for > 55 yr. old?

Dan, it really seems to suck where you live.

:(

I wouldn't bother with a service business if that's all that was out there. If that was all I was getting a shot at then I would tweak my marketing and sales.

[plainpainter 217]

Thad, don't get me wrong - some services I provide I am making good money, and I have a bunch of good customers.

This guy is a remnant of the old school New Englander - I posted this thread more for giggles than anything. I think it's all about the business angle and what service you provide. Painters are starving to death right now, yet landscapers and irrigation guys are making record profits this year!

I do however think it's a lack or respect to call a professional and hope they'll do a $40 service - to me he is more about price/cheap than forging a strong business relationship. My last deck job of the season was a senior citizen living in a very modest home - and she was in my top 3 best customers of the year.

Thad I agree about tweaking marketing - wish I had asked where they found me - I think he said his wife gave him my number, so he wouldn't have known anyways. My knowledge for marketing has skyrocketed this year - and with knowledge comes ease of mind of what my probability of success is. Before I was in the dark and that always freaked me out.

[Thad 135]

For also knowledge itself is power.

[offduty 25]

I've made a lot of money from $40 calls. Just tell him you will get it duirng the week when you are in tht neighborhood. Leave the truck running, throw up a ladder, put the money in your pocket and leave 5 minutes later. Line up a dozen or so and you got work for one guy for a half day or so.

[Thad 135]

I've made a lot of money from $40 calls. Just tell him you will get it duirng the week when you are in tht neighborhood. Leave the truck running, throw up a ladder, put the money in your pocket and leave 5 minutes later. Line up a dozen or so and you got work for one guy for a half day or so.

No offense intended, William, but Dan has done a lot of research about this stuff and I'm pretty sure he knows that there is no way that could be profitable.

[plainpainter 217]

No offense intended, William, but Dan has done a lot of research about this stuff and I'm pretty sure he knows that there is no way that could be profitable.

Thad - pretty sure this was a tad sarcastic - that said, William has a ton of volume and I don't. The more volume you have, the greater the probability of being in the area and being able to do these 5 minute jobs and taking the money. For me - I have no reason to go in that certain direction for months on end perhaps. I travelled to one end of my service area, actually outside of it - perhaps an hour and 15 minute drive by highway. And I was fortunate to have had the ability to line up 2 customers that same day and came home with $900 - didn't have to enact minimums or anything. It was the ability of having a 'cluster' of clients in the same area that made it possible and profitable.

When you're small - you miss many of these oppurtunities. I give William Kudos for engineering everything he does.

[RPetry 564]

Last winter, Rick, had an elderly couple putting their home on the market after first buying it back in '82. And they wanted 4 rooms painted, which included removing wallpaper for like 1-1/2 rooms before mudding and repriming.

their budget for the total job was $500 - you tell me, am I in the right demographic for > 55 yr. old?

Daniel,

I have no idea of your local market and demographics, I do not live or work there. But from reading your posts over the years, you leave the impression that you believe many potential customers are cheap, ignorant, with difficult dispositions.

I can tell you that the median age of our deck customers is probably in the low to mid 50's. 9 out of 10 are wonderful people and a pleasure to do business with, some become actual friends. With few exceptions, they understand that first class service demands a realistic price.

[plainpainter 217]

That's a good age group, Rick. I'd say Mid 40's to late 50's is the best age group.

I was talking about a couple in their 70's. This is a good area, just not a good time to be in my area. It seems no matter how much folks make, their budget expands/exceeds to more than what they make. Then you have a slumping real estate market - and the once rich, are now the landed 'gentry'.

[PressurePros 249]

Dan lives in a real ghetto.

• There are 11,305 households

• 27.5% from 25 to 44, 26.8% from 45 to 64, and 12.3% who were 65 years of age or older. The median age was 40 years.

• the median income for a household in the town was $102,762, and the median income for a family was $131,469.

I'm fairly certain this is the road that leads the "badlands" of Andover

[plainpainter 217]

That's Sutton pond behind the 'New' North Andover center - those buildings in the distance are the old 'Machine Shop' buildings that made the textile looms for the Sutton and Stevens Mills along the Cochichewick River {which this pond is part of}. Those granite fencing poles are new.

Ken - the area is beautiful - the homes are humungous - and yet we're all out of work. The owner of White Street paints, who has 7 different locations under his belt just recently laid off a bunch of guys. All the guys have reduced their pricing at a minimum of 30% The 'going' rate for painting is between $27-$33 per hour. I even talk to guys in Southeastern Ma, who tell me stuff like 'shheesh, you guys have it real bad in the merrimack valley' Several of my past clients now use some retired marine and his wife in an unmarked pickup truck with out of state plates and no commercial. My best client golf course just went bankrupt - actually no, the judge wouldn't give him bankruptcy protection, so he is being sued like gang busters.

Ken - just because an area is beautiful, don't mean folks are spending. There is a New England culture here that you just don't understand - they take pride in being miserly.

Heck my friend who is a designer/decorator, she did a bunch of interior work for one of those huge McMansions in the next town over from this picture you posted. She wanted her daughters room repainted and they are putting the home on the market - she told me it was an easy $1,000 job - it had loads of chair rails and funky wainscoting. But she really wanted the work so she bid it low at $830 including materials. The woman erupted and told my friend she didn't understand why it was more than $500 - and that her husband would kill her for spending more. Mind you we're talking a 1.5 million dollar house here. She's the one whose website I pointed out to you that you thought was really nice. She hasn't made a dime off that website in the year that it's been up.

[James 625]

Dan lives out side Boston ! One of the Top cities to live outside of for Residential services in America !!

[plainpainter 217]

Dan lives out side Boston ! One of the Top cities to live outside of for Residential services in America !!

Whatever Jim. Here check out this home.

Karen Neve

I bid on this house last fall, the winning estimate was $5,500 to repaint the exterior of this home. And it was dirty with loads of peeling on the trim. This use to be an easy 15k repaint. I think I remember about 6,600 SF of exterior area overall?

That's 83 cents a SF to pressure wash a home, scrape the loose paint on the trim and prime, caulk as needed and then paint - materials included. When was the last time Jim you did a deck restoration for 83 cents a SF??? And seeing we are dealing with vertical heights in upwards of 35 feet - I'd venture that's it's a whole lot more difficult - not to mention you have to apply everything by hand - if you spray, no way you can paint the trim in one coat and get coverage over the overspray.

Oh yeah, nearly forgot this was painted late '08 - painters have gotten even hungrier since. I know one crew that will paint this home for $3,400 all day long. That's 52 cents per square foot, Jim - think about it.

And in the great scheme of things - this house isn't a whole lot of prep work. But just to give you an idea - if you applied your deck rates to this house it would be priced at $13,200 - for one coat application, yet the 'going' rate is $5,500-$6000. And the lady of the house thought out loud in my proximity how that was a lot of money! Excuse me? This is the norm right now.

This paint job was done in fall of '08 - pricing is even more competitive. I know one paint company that will paint this home for $3,400 all day long

Edited November 23, 2009 by plainpainter
Forgot something.

[FLORIN 21]

Whatever Jim. Here check out this home.

Karen Neve

I bid on this house last fall, the winning estimate was $5,500 to repaint the exterior of this home. And it was dirty with loads of peeling on the trim. This use to be an easy 15k repaint. I think I remember about 6,600 SF of exterior area overall?

That's 83 cents a SF to pressure wash a home, scrape the loose paint on the trim and prime, caulk as needed and then paint - materials included. When was the last time Jim you did a deck restoration for 83 cents a SF??? And seeing we are dealing with vertical heights in upwards of 35 feet - I'd venture that's it's a whole lot more difficult - not to mention you have to apply everything by hand - if you spray, no way you can paint the trim in one coat and get coverage over the overspray.

Oh yeah, nearly forgot this was painted late '08 - painters have gotten even hungrier since. I know one crew that will paint this home for $3,400 all day long. That's 52 cents per square foot, Jim - think about it.

And in the great scheme of things - this house isn't a whole lot of prep work. But just to give you an idea - if you applied your deck rates to this house it would be priced at $13,200 - for one coat application, yet the 'going' rate is $5,500-$6000. And the lady of the house thought out loud in my proximity how that was a lot of money! Excuse me? This is the norm right now.

This paint job was done in fall of '08 - pricing is even more competitive. I know one paint company that will paint this home for $3,400 all day long

I'll do it for $3,399.

[James 625]

Dan, I think you have to rid your self of that Name " just plain painting" ? For a first impression I think mediocre , middle of the road and uninspired . And thats just from the name !LOL

Name Changes for DAN - " Son's of Liberty" restoration- a good New England name.

"Danny Boy's " Power washing- Lots of Irish around Boston

[PressurePros 249]

Dan, I think you have to rid your self of that Name " just plain painting" ? For a first impression I think mediocre , middle of the road and uninspired . And thats just from the name !LOL

Name Changes for DAN - " Son's of Liberty" restoration- a good New England name.

"Danny Boy's " Power washing- Lots of Irish around Boston

Danny Go Bragh

"keepin' your eyes a' smilin'

Not sure what we can do with your last name. I call your basic stripper mix "Tambasco Sauce"

[James 625]

"Tambasco Hot Wash"

[plainpainter 217]

Danny Go Bragh

"keepin' your eyes a' smilin'

Not sure what we can do with your last name. I call your basic stripper mix "Tambasco Sauce"

LOL - it's nice to know all those years ago of being teased on the playground that now the 'Tambasco' Sauce has finally come to fruition.

Effective Dec. 1 my newspaper ad is cancelled. So will begin the process of reworking my website this winter and other marketing. I hate all the doom and gloom out there.

[Scott Stone 604]

So, stop it already. You have to be one of the most negative contractors that I have ever seen on these boards. One would think that you were constantly beat with a stick to keep your attitude up. Don't you realize that people can see and feel a downer attitude, and will feed off it? The problem is, that you are going into jobs expecting them to hammer you on price. That way, you are never disappointed. Either, you need to adjust your pricing to current market conditions, to maintain a workload, or you need to learn how to sell what you have in a way that makes people want to buy your services at a premium. There is no in between. As for the name, I agree, it sounds cheap. Maybe that is a large part of the problem.