Alaskan Yellow Cedar sealer/stain

[plainpainter 217]

Just want to chime in with Rick differentiating between drying oils and resins. Drying oils are the Resins! Most companies

use an alkyd modified drying oil such as Linseed Alkyds - and some companies use a combination of alkyds along with natural

drying oils unmodified in the same base. But Linseed oils, tung oils, linseed alkyds, tung alkyds, alkyds, sunflower oil, sunflower alkyds, Soybean oil, Soya Alkyd

These are all 'resins' that are referred to in these products. When we talk about resin-pigment-carrier - we are talking about a 'siccative' like drying oil

such as linseed, perhaps modified with an alkyd, along with the pigments, and then a petroleum distillate such as mineral spirits, gum spirits, etc.

If ReadySeal has a 'resin' - then it has either a 'drying' oil, an alkyd modified drying oil, or just an alkyd - in which case it is no longer just a pure parafinnic oil product

but one that resembles Armstrong Clark's stains.

[Beth n Rod 1,279]

Just want to chime in with Rick differentiating between drying oils and resins. Drying oils are the Resins! Most companies

use an alkyd modified drying oil such as Linseed Alkyds - and some companies use a combination of alkyds along with natural

drying oils unmodified in the same base. But Linseed oils, tung oils, linseed alkyds, tung alkyds, alkyds, sunflower oil, sunflower alkyds, Soybean oil, Soya Alkyd

These are all 'resins' that are referred to in these products. When we talk about resin-pigment-carrier - we are talking about a 'siccative' like drying oil

such as linseed, perhaps modified with an alkyd, along with the pigments, and then a petroleum distillate such as mineral spirits, gum spirits, etc.

If ReadySeal has a 'resin' - then it has either a 'drying' oil, an alkyd modified drying oil, or just an alkyd - in which case it is no longer just a pure parafinnic oil product

but one that resembles Armstrong Clark's stains.

WELL PUT! Thank you!

Beth

[James 624]

I think Rick means the pigment ? The pigment doesn't dive deep into the wood either. The wood acts as a filter and collects the color at the surface.

[Beth n Rod 1,279]

Pigment doesn't cure either....from what I understand.

Beth

[Beth n Rod 1,279]

Jim,

It is not a personal problem he had. We had Ready Seal sample wood - you know the kind that come on the little chain to show you colors? They sat in the office, and over time still faded.

MANY years ago we tried RS and used it, first following the label (that didn't work, you don't get the coverage it says or did not back in that period of time) and then adding more product above the specifications. We moved away from it for very simple reasons:

• lacked longevity
  
• consumers preferred other choices when given options
  

Pretty simple. You need to make the client happy and to the wood justice. For this, in an oil, we like Armstrong Clark.

Beth

[James 624]

This was a good thread and the home owner was getting great advice from someone who has a history with the type of wood until certain people entered the thread and turned it stupid. I miss used the word cured but people understand what I meant !

If you have a Oil that is 50% parrifin and 25% linseed. The wood is Alaskan Cedar that has been sanded with and down with 150 grit. This wood gets no penetration of an oil due to the type of wood it is unless it been in the weather for a few years and people tell them something is a good choice based of what ?How does the oil get distributed and the linseed cure on top with a 2 to 1 ratio ? I know the answer because I use AC on difficult wood but you have to do things to to make it work.

[Beth n Rod 1,279]

150 is too high a grit to use for an exterior wood surface.

Beth

[billdvorak 14]

Thanks for everybody's comments. To explain my choice of 150 grit. I did RS test patches with light brown, medium brown, dark brown, 60 grit, 80 grit, 120 grit, 150 grit. Since I am the homeowner and this became my pet project-----I need something that works consistently for me. I was almost happy with the RS DB 150 combination when Peirce at Ready Seal advised against using RS.

So back to the drawing boards or web boards in this case. I found the threads about Armstrong-Clark and tried some samples RusticBrown. Once again 150 grit gives me the results I wanted around the parlor stove. It is a light brown with a distressed look by making the dings and stuff darker. I wanted a thin coat anyway because I am afraid I might change my mind.

Either way the old coating on the covered part of the deck is still there after 10 years. The old coating on the steps and around the edges of the deck didn't last one year. I want to do something else for the steps. The AC rustic brown is very dark on the steps and a safety issue at night. I am thinking of Cabots ATO Natural for the steps.

I will post more pictures soon. I fell in love with the Alaska Cedar after sanding the old semi-solid orange finish and discovering how beautiful it is.

[Beth n Rod 1,279]

As long as you like it, that's what matters.

Beth

[billdvorak 14]

This is a weathered area where the old coating pealed off. I used a cleaner and brightener, sanded 150 grit. Came out much darker but I think it will be fine. The weathered areas will be darker than the protected, covered areas but it looks good IMHO. Not completely cured yet.

[bigchaz 157]

Bill is the color your main criteria for justifying your application method? I think you would be better off sticking with the 60 grit and adjusting the rustic brown so that it matches the look you are going for. If its too dark you can cut it with some natural tone armstrong clark.

I have to imagine you will get better results using a custom color that is actually able to penetrate the wood (ie not on 150 grit). Adjusting sandpaper grit to achieve a certain color tone sounds like a risky recipe for achieving a good looking final finish...and especially so if you are truly working board by board.

[Beth n Rod 1,279]

I guess cures is the wrong word but it never stay's oily. Curing is for drying oils. I really don't understand Rod's point about his samples and his inability to have success with RS? Seems like a personal problem to me. I really don't understand Rod's point about Alaskan Cedar shrinking either ? It's one of the more stable woods along with Port orford cedar no shrinking at all ! And, If any thing the most consistent oil performer has been RS on the BB's.

Ok Jim,

You turned this personal and that is not the way this should go for a DIY'er asking questions about a product. It is about the product. It AIN"T goof-proof!

Now...How many trips to you make? Rick makes 2. One first application, then a second the next day.

Where on the label does it recommend that?

If it takes that, it should be indicated on the label directions for the user which btw is targeted at the homeowner.

This type of information is useful for the homeowner to make an intelligent and informed decision.

A/C recommends one application to saturation. I get anywhere from 100sqft-150sqft/gal and the result is consistent.

You and Rick have your methods of working with Ready Seal and that is great, but the homeowner who started this thread does not have either of your experiences or knowledge. You are defending something without substantiating it with methods or technology to back it up so this person can understand and achieve the same results you guys get.

Help the man, and not make this about you and trying to make me look bad. It didn't work.

I talked with Peirce Fitchett and tried to get some information as to why it didn't work as expected and yes he offered to go out on a deck or two to help me with it, but that is contrary to the whole pitch now isn't it?

If I can't get the results by reading the label and following the directions, there is a problem with the product or the directions. Yes, coverage rates may vary but 50 sqft/gal -vs- 150 sqft/gal is a significant margin of error which can lead to a DIY'er not ordering enough product and becoming frustrated with a product that promises to be goof-proof.

...and yes, with a 48 hour dry time, it was still oily by the time I got back so don't tell this person it never stays oily. This is misleading. And if the temperatures are not conducive to the product 'curing', setting up, drying or whatever, it may take longer. The man lives in alaska. Their temps and humidity are quite different than in connecticut or new jersey.

Help the man out will ya?

Rod!~

[James 624]

No Rod, you made it go that way.

[Beth n Rod 1,279]

Can't the two of you just agree to disagree? This is not the "bleach" thread....

Beth

[TNRoofCleaner 16]

Rod the man lives in Oregon. Not as cold but wetter. Except maybe for southeast Alaska

Edited June 2, 2010 by TNRoofCleaner

[RPetry 564]

Can't the two of you just agree to disagree? This is not the "bleach" thread....

Beth

The "Great Bleach Debate" thread of years gone by is the best thread ever on TGS.

[Beth n Rod 1,279]

And from it...eventually a photo of you that was a classic!

Beth

[Beth n Rod 1,279]

Rod the man lives in Oregon. Not as cold but wetter. Except maybe for southeast Alaska

Point. I missed that one :P

Rod!~

[RPetry 564]

Beth,

Yeah that was a fun thread. Dead of winter, we all had time on our hands, went on like 17 pages. Baiting, cat-calling, good info, and generally a great time for all.

For old time's sake, my major contribution ...

[Beth n Rod 1,279]

No Rod, you made it go that way.

Jim,

If you can't have a debate without turning this into something negative like calling it stupid and saying it's a personal problem, stay out of it until you can.

I re-read every post and cannot find any single way that I made any personal reference to you. Its about READY SEAL... not you.

Rod!~

[billdvorak 14]

Charlie-I am mostly going for the color I want. If I understand correctly the worst that can happen is the need for clean and reapplication in a short time. I can live with that. Am I missing something?

[plainpainter 217]

Now...How many trips to you make? Rick makes 2. One first application, then a second the next day.

Where on the label does it recommend that?

Rod!~

Rick makes two separate trips to apply stain to a customers deck?!$@#????? That right there is enough of a decision maker to never ever use that

stain. Holy Mother of God. Aren't we in the deck 'staining' business and not the deck-saturate-with-oil-until-every-cell-is-oilified business?

[TNRoofCleaner 16]

You are fine Bill. Everyone has their right way of doing things and the thread is just evolving into one of those type battles. If you are happy and willing to maintain then all is well.

Congrats on that beautiful wood.

[bigchaz 157]

Charlie-I am mostly going for the color I want. If I understand correctly the worst that can happen is the need for clean and reapplication in a short time. I can live with that. Am I missing something?

I guess if you are cool about redoing it, that part is no problem. I am a little worried about how slippery it may be when wet, you may just want to watch out for that with such a smooth surface and oil stain.

[Beth n Rod 1,279]

Charlie-I am mostly going for the color I want. If I understand correctly the worst that can happen is the need for clean and reapplication in a short time. I can live with that. Am I missing something?

My apologies for our passion showing through here.

There are a couple of different trains of thought where certain types of sealers are concerned and your thread has good points of debate albeit may have you somewhat concerned.

Btw, Rick, Jim and I are friends never-the-less, we just don't always agree on certain things.

Again, my apologies.

Rod!~