What is the difference between an entrepreneur and a leader?

[Beth n Rod 1,279]

As business owners, you could say we are all entrepreneurs. As business owners, you could also say we are leaders. How are the two different?

Beth

[RyanH 14]

Boy, this sounds like a question on a Business Management 101 exam!!

I've always thought of entrepreneurs as individuals (or even partner groups) starting a company from a dream or idea and "making it happen." I generally think of entrepreneurs as being kind of the small fish in a big pond and that if something happens and that business should go under, there will be an insignificant ripple in the pool that flattens out before it ever reaches shore. A business leader will take that entrepreneurship and turn it into a practice that has a relatively high social impact. It will have an impact on how a particular market or industry operates, it will affect many lives (good, bad, or indifferent), and it will grow the business beyond the point of having to stay focused on one central role. If a business leader goes under, Tokyo gets wiped out. Also, having your name dropped by other industry players at gatherings and conventions is an indication that you have attained business leader status.

Fancy this in a Venn diagram: All business owners who are business leaders are entrepreneurs; Not all business owners who are entrepreneurs are business leaders.

[PressurePros 249]

Interesting, Ryan. I started intially thinking, well not every business leader is an innovator so the axiom must be flawed because a true entrepreneur needs to be an innovator, a creator if you will. Then I realized, you don't rise to become a business leader, regardless of the industry, without being a pioneer. The very fact that a business owner has set himself apart from his peers means he has done something noteworthy (ie different)

So, I agree with you 100% the terms entrepreneur and leader can be synonymous or exclusive depending upon the individual and his achievements.

[Cleveland Mobile 14]

Very interesting points....If I may add to that, leadership is also knowledge gained. Knowing where your limitations are and how to eliminate them....being able to work out problems..... Also sharing knowledge.....which makes us all leaders since everyone is so quick to share a method, price, or technique that may have taken quite a while to work out. Everyone on this board I feel is more than a business associate. Your candid views and quick responses to help have shown me that you are also friends willing to take the time to be concerned. Does my surrounding community consider me a leader? Don't know and don't care.........if you judge a person by his friends then I would say I am very fortunate to be a part of an industry with so many great people.

Andy

[ROBERT MCLAUTHLIN 14]

a true entrepreneur is a person who comes up with a " turn a key operation " and a leader / manager , manages the system that the entrepreneur came up with.

[John T 744]

Robert,

So from what your saying then a Sole Proprietorship is both a leader and an entrepreneur because he started the "Turn Key"Business and he also manages it. On top of that he does all the work also....So that makes him superman :)

I'm just having fun but I agree with your view.

[Beth n Rod 1,279]

What traits does a entrepreneur posses and what traits does a leader posses?

[PressurePros 249]

Maybe it would help to define leader. Some are taking it as "leaders of their industry" others are more in line with the term "manager". I mean, McDonald's has crew leaders and it doesn't require a degree with nuclear physics or all that much ingenuity to become one.

I think by default an entrepreneur has to be a leader.

[Beth n Rod 1,279]

I'm not talking about industry leaders. I'm talking about all of us as business owners. Does this help?

I think the two are very different...but must work in concert with one another. I believe the characteristics of each is unique.

For example, an entrepreneur has vision and works to create the business and finance it. A leader is most often associated with leading people at various levels of an organization, and can be taught in many cases (but not always, there is some aptitude required) the skills it takes to lead. Entrepreneurs have a more natural talent I think.

Keep it going. This is fun stuff that makes you think and helps you grow. :)

Beth

[Everett Abrams 501]

I believe that leaders have characterisrtics in their personality and their being that set them apart from others. To be a true leader one needs to command respect. This respect is not something one can go out and get. This respect is bestowed on one by others who look to them as leaders. In others words, one can have all the qualities and characteristics to be a leader but can not be considered one until others see and believe in them.

An entrepeneur MUST be a leader to be successful. This is one reason many businesses fail and many people don't get it. They have aspirations and dreams of owning their own business or being successful. Nothing wrong with that at all, the problem is if they lack the leadership quality it is only a matter of time until it catches up with them. These people are better to hold onto those dreams of success but look into another avenue to attain their true aspirations.

Just my two cents.

[Beth n Rod 1,279]

en·tre·pre·neur

n. A person who organizes, operates, and assumes the risk for a business venture.

French, from Old French, from entreprendre, to undertake. See enterprise. entre·pre·neuri·al adj.

entre·pre·neuri·al·ism or entre·pre·neurism n.

entre·pre·neurship n.==================================================

entrepreneur

A risk-taker who has the skills and initiative to establish a business.=========================================================entrepreneur

n : someone who organizes a business venture and assumes the risk for it syn: enterpriser

==========================================================

lead·er

n.

1. One that leads or guides.
   
2. One who is in charge or in command of others.


1. One who heads a political party or organization.
   
2. One who has influence or power, especially of a political nature.
   

[*]Music.

1. A conductor, especially of orchestra, band, or choral group.
   
2. The principal performer in an orchestral section or a group.
   

[*]The foremost animal, such as a horse or dog, in a harnessed team.

[*]A loss leader.

[*]Chiefly British. The main editorial in a newspaper.

[*]leaders Printing. Dots or dashes in a row leading the eye across a page, as in an index entry.

[*]A pipe for conducting liquid.

[*]A short length of gut, wire, or similar material by which a hook is attached to a fishing line.

[*]A blank strip at the end or beginning of a film or tape used in threading or winding.

[*]Botany. The growing apex or main shoot of a shrub or tree.

[*]An economic indicator.

======================================================

leader

n 1: a person who rules or guides or inspires others ant: follower 2: a featured article of merchandise sold at a loss in order to draw customers syn: drawing card, loss leader

=========================================================

The two seem to not be the same at all, however both are critically important for a business owner it seems. Initially (during planning and implementation) I would say one emerges as an entrepreneur when they first start out. Then as they grow they developenad learn to lead, or begin to lead naturally if it is a talent. To grow it seems to me they need to step into the leadership roll in order to manage anything.

Beth

[Beth n Rod 1,279]

I believe that leaders have characterisrtics in their personality and their being that set them apart from others. To be a true leader one needs to command respect. This respect is not something one can go out and get. This respect is bestowed on one by others who look to them as leaders. In others words, one can have all the qualities and characteristics to be a leader but can not be considered one until others see and believe in them.

I would interpret this as an Autocratic type leadership which I have found in my experience was the most undesirable type in business today. Leaders must demonstrate the ability bring people together voluntarily in a concerted effort to attain a goal. Overall, the leader I feel must be an effective communicator and show respect and recognition for the efforts of those this person would lead. This develops respect, commitment, loyalty and longevity within the business.

An entrepeneur MUST be a leader to be successful. This is one reason many businesses fail and many people don't get it. They have aspirations and dreams of owning their own business or being successful. Nothing wrong with that at all, the problem is if they lack the leadership quality it is only a matter of time until it catches up with them. These people are better to hold onto those dreams of success but look into another avenue to attain their true aspirations.

Although this may be applicable in some cases, it must be understood that no one starts out as a leader but as someone who wants to be one. Leadership is a learned characteristic like anything else. Even natural born leaders must hone their skills in order to be effective. The last sentence to me, doesnt seem to be a supportive one. I dont think it allows for the person to grow into leadership. Books on the subject are a good start for those who may be at this stage. There are different types of leadership styles such as Autocratic, Democratic and Laissez-faire to name a few and it is important to develop the style that works for the individual and allows them to achieve the results they are looking for.

Just my .02

Rod~

[Henry B. 4]

I personally feel a leader is someone that has proven themselves by first doing, then showing. I think Everett is right, your either a leader or your not. These tendencies aren't something you can become, you either are or your aren't. You can read all the books and take all the classes you want but if your not at heart a true leader, it will only help a little. I think there is a difference between being the leader of the pack and a leader worthy enough for people to follow on their own.

Anyone can be brow beaten or torn down to the level where they finally submit to anothers will or authority, but it's another matter all together for someone to see you as a leader just by the way you carry yourself and treat those around you. Some guys just get power hungry and tend to boss others around instead of working with them and showing people how you do things. Some leaders never let anyone question them or offer suggestions just because they are the boss.

A true leader can see leadership abilities in others and learn to trust them after proper training to get the job done right the first time. Others will micro-manage every tiny aspect of the job even after the person has shown to be trustworthy and capable on their own.

I think it's important to know when to manage someone and when to let them work things out on their own, I call it respecting the people that work for you.

If you find yourself going through employees fairly quickly because they are quitting, then your most likely not a very good leader.

Great leaders will inspire people to do their best with everything they do by setting the example and encouraging others to do their best.

Lousy leaders are always showing how much better they can do things than everyone else with out helping them to improve.

[John T 744]

I agree......and disagree with some of the above...so that makes me confused :)

Seriously I do believe some people are natural born leaders and they are lucky..but the greatest leaders are the ones that lead by example and that my friends is a LEARNED trait....so yes I agree that you can be born with leadership qualities and for those type of people they are very fortunate but out of some of them you get the Charles Mansons and the Hitlers of the world. The ones that lead by example such as PAT TILLMAN the football player who died in Iraq,Hellen Keller who had to learn just about everything and many many others are and should be considered great leaders themselves.

SO once again I vote for both sides of this debate......Does that make me a follower :) Think again..............

[RyanH 14]

My vote for greatest leader: Audie Murphy.

Greatest entrepreneur: Truett Cathy

[Beth n Rod 1,279]

You can read all the books and take all the classes you want but if your not at heart a true leader, it will only help a little.

You have got to be kidding.

Education makes little difference? Try telling that to all the fine business leaders that graduate from such fine institutions as Harvard. I suppose their academic achievements will only help them a little as they lead multi billion dollar companies.

Bill Gates never graduated, but he did attend. In fact, let's take it a step further, the very leaders of our COUNTRY have attended fine ivy league institutions and have spent numerous years in government before running for president. This in and of itself says they were learning, as well as learning how to lead. This is where mentoring comes in.

Additionally, there are different leadership styles, and different LEVELS of leadership. For example an organization's hierarchy may be such that you have functional leaders (entry level managers), mid-management, and upper management. The roles of each of these leaders is quite different. The lower the level managers spend the majority of their time managing people, and the farther up the ladder you go, managers should be spending more time planning for the future than managing people. The tasks associated with leadership are contingent upon the situation, and station, of the leader and the role they play.

Also, if we are all entrepreneurs and leaders as we are business owners here, and you are saying that education makes little difference, are those your true feelings? I ask because as of late you have been an advocate of education and certification. However, the stand you just took is in direct contradiction to it.

Education is critically important. It's not a matter of being important in one circumstance or another, it doesn't apply sometimes and not other times, it is always important, and it always helps.

Having said that, I will say one more thing, you get out of an education only as much as you put into it. Continuing education and a commitment to excellence makes a difference.

Ok...well...next :)

:soapbox:

Beth

[RyanH 14]

Leadership is an inherent quality that is made better by education. If one lacks the natural leadership ability, however, fine education just amounts to a high student loan bill. Check out this letter of apology written by an ivy-league graduate. The insipid and vile statement by her makes me want to beat my head against the wall at the ignorance portrayed by such spineless individuals. These overboard apologies issued by everyone who has ever stepped on someone's toe and offended them...arghhh! Anyway, the point is that she doesn't strike me as a very effective leader when she is able to be beaten down and admonished by people with unfounded hurt feelings.

http://www.nat-portman.net/article/10

[Henry B. 4]

Also, if we are all entrepreneurs and leaders as we are business owners here, and you are saying that education makes little difference, are those your true feelings? I ask because as of late you have been an advocate of education and certification. However, the stand you just took is in direct contradiction to it.

Education is critically important. It's not a matter of being important in one circumstance or another, it doesn't apply sometimes and not other times, it is always important, and it always helps.

Having said that, I will say one more thing, you get out of an education only as much as you put into it. Continuing education and a commitment to excellence makes a difference.

Ok...well...next

I think your trying to group two different things together here.

Being a leader is more about managing people and having the skills and charisma to do so. Certification is about learning how to do a specific thing like power washing.

For example,

You could read all the books you want about construction, but does that make you qualified and knowledgable enough to build a house with none of the hands on skills?

I never said education was a bad thing at all, what I said was you can't book train yourself into being a leader. (in my opinion)

Bill Gates for example may have been a true born leader with vision and using his talent as a leader, guided others to help him create his vision.

Even someone that doesn't go to school or know how to do something at all can still lead others that know how to.

[PressurePros 249]

Education at a fine institution can further along an already born business leader. I don't consider myself any more or less adept than the next guy. I attended Wharton with all my undergrad work done at Penn also. I can honestly say though, I learned formulas, predictors and the nuts and bolts of economic philosophy but it was only in real world application with an outstanding mentor/employer that I was able to really get a grasp on what it takes to be a business leader. To touch on the subject of genetics and instinct.. I can only speak for myself but I have always lived and breathed capitalism. I have always "run" a personal business venture from the time I was a kid. Starting with a lemonade stand, graduating to a web design company in my teens, to owning a sound company in my early twenties I have always had to be the boss. I have worked for Forbes 500 corporations and did not thrive in that enviroment. In fact, there were many with no leadership ability whatsoever that were far more noticed in work performance. I believe an entrepreneur is born, not made. Education whether it be from a higher learning institution or from life experience just makes the natural leader/entrepreneur stronger.

[Beth n Rod 1,279]

Exactly. One may well be born with personal traits that will make him or her a leader, but leadership may always be strengthened by education. There is far more to leadership than simply managing people. Also I do feel there is a connection between entrepreneurs and leaders, although they are not identical.

The leadership style one uses may be based upon one's character or personality, or upon the group that is being led. I will also say that just as we are all motivated by different things (and there is more than one motivator, but that's another thread altogether) we also respond to different leadership styles. A good leader will adapt his or her style effectively for the benefit of the individuals being led.

I love topics like this. Good exercise for the brain.

Beth :groovy3:

[Beth n Rod 1,279]

I would like to add the distinction of an entrepreneuer to the discussion.

Entrepreneuer's find a need and fill it. They are the creativeness and the drive behind business today. Their imagination and insight have created huge corporations and multi-million dollar business ventures. They are the initiators.

Leaders however are not always entrepreneuers. In this case in particular, they are the ones who are given charge to take over and fulfill the objectives of the entrepreneuer who has other areas of responsibility to manage. While I do not intend to lessen either one here, the point is that each has its place in business today and less often are the two one and the same.

Rod~

[Beth n Rod 1,279]

Bill Gates for example may have been a true born leader with vision and using his talent as a leader, guided others to help him create his vision.

Bill Gates has publically stated that the time he spent at Harvard was helpful to him.

Even someone that doesn't go to school or know how to do something at all can still lead others that know how to.

So, you are saying the blind can lead the sighted, speaking metaphorically... I disagree here. If someone who doesn't know how to lead tries to lead others who do have a clear understanding of how to do something, the leader will not be effective if the message contradicts the expereince of those who have the "know how".

Beth :groovy2:

[Henry B. 4]

So, you are saying the blind can lead the sighted, speaking metaphorically... I disagree here. If someone who doesn't know how to lead tries to lead others who do have a clear understanding of how to do something, the leader will not be effective if the message contradicts the expereince of those who have the "know how".

Beth :groovy2:

No, actually this is not what I said, this is what you took my comment to mean.

I said that a leader could start and run an organization without knowing everything that's involved with running a company or how to do all of the companies actual function or service.

I do believe that a skilled leader can manage people to do a job even if the leader himself doesn't understand or know how to do it all themselves.

They leaders hire the right people with the right talents, give them the proper materials and workplace and let them do what they know best.

You just have to get the right people and lead them. You mentioned the past presidents, did any of them ever have the office of presidency before? No, they did not. You can argue that their schooling helped them lead the country. I can also argue that it was their natural skill as a leader and their experiances in life that helped them.

In the military, we had leaders/officers that ran entire operations that had no training or clue on what was really going on and it's still a popular practice.

We all have our opinions and our own experiance to prove our points.

[One Tough Pressure 580]

Even someone that doesn't go to school or know how to do something at all can still lead others that know how to.

That's not leading, that's managing.

[Henry B. 4]

That's true Alan, but when your talking about a company either one should work.

When we tell clients were leading the industry or leaders in the industry that also takes on a different meaning. To lead or be a leader, someone has to be willing to follow you... That can be another company your helping out, teaching or other things...