Started a new company 6 months ago now I have some ?s for the real professionals!

[Crownroyal 14]

Hi all I've sent this to Don but I thought it would be good to post too, the more heads thinking the better.

I would like to do all three, roof washing, house washing, decks, and sealing decks. I would like to know what I should be using right now because I feel I'm not using the right equipment or cleaner.

Roofs- Im using Shingle Care premium cleaner and a 2000 psi 1.8 gpm power washer with the delicate nozzle, and 100ft of hose with thier water. Takes a long time 3 hours or more on 2000sqft. I put the cleaner on with a pump sprayer and let it sit then rinse. After it dries I apply shingle coat it has anti mold/algae in it, and helps to hold shingle gritt to the shingle.

Houses- Im using the same 2000psi washer but with the general use nozzle and the applying the cleaner with a pump spray.

Decks- Im using the same 2000psi power washer but delicate nozzle. I use pump sprayer and apply a little more solution to help remove grime. takes a while also.

Also I was wondering do you use any type of roof safty equipment, climbing gear, shoes ect?

I see the roof climbing gear on the internet but the triangle support confuses me on how to use them. I really dont want to screw that thing down on the roof top. Where should I look for buying roof climbing gear?

How about a system to use on the ground does anyone use one?

Also I think my price is not where it should be.

Prices go as followed

Roofs

1000-2000sqft =180

2000-3000sqft =230

3000-4000sqft =280

Houses

1000-2000sqft =150

2000-3000sqft =190

3000-4000sqft =230

Decks

Price is .5--.6 cents a sqft

Sealing is $20.00 hour

Also I would love to know what the best set up would be to do this work and where to get it.

As you can see I really want to do the best job but I think I need help in order to do that. I want to set a trailer or truck up to be able to do this type of work.

So If anyone can help with any of the questions I would appreciate it. I really want to buy the right equipment.

Wow I know that was alot but I want to make sure I dont ruin the power washing profession.

The reason for the post is because there is so many different variables I wasn't sure what was best for me. Plus the wife thinks I'm addicted to power washing forums!

Thanks again

Dan Mathis

Dagan Enterprises

757-246-1102

[RyanH 14]

Dan,

Try a few searches for "roof cleaning" and you'll get some pretty good threads on techniques, chemicals, and safety gear. Alot of what you do depends upon the types of roofs you do. For roofs, you look pretty good on price if they are walkable...I'd add atleast a $100 premium for roofs where extra safety and climbing gear is required.

From what others have said about decks, you look to be WAY underpriced on your deck prices, even if you are taking the easiest road and only spraying with bleach or other mildewcide and leaving it to dwell. Try the search feature for "deck cleaning" and you should find plenty.

As for your timing and pricing....there's nothing inherently wrong with using the washer you are using, but realize that it is going to take you an extremely long time to complete a job like that. Even with my 4gpm it took me about 8 hours to do a complete 3000 sq. two floor house (plus gutters, windows, trim, etc.). It's not my business to tell you what you should be charging because there are 101 opinions for every 100 people on this forum on that issue, but I think you would do better to figure out how long it takes you to complete a job and charge according to the size (indirectly charging by your time). It looks much better to a customer to charge by the area instead of how long it takes you to do it....if you've ever worked alongside a sloth or a workhorse, you know that time is subjective to do the same job. If you are efficient you are going to be severely undercharging...if you are sluggish you are going to have a low perception of your efforts. Just a thought. And most every homeowner will balk if you tell them you charge $80 or $100 per hour, but if that's what it works out to and your charge was based upon the job size, they won't say much (go figure).

[R L S 14]

The more gpm the faster you work. I use a hotwater 4.5gpm machine and have a cold water for a backup.Do you have an extension wand for houses or just the wand that came with the washer. Applying your chems via down stream injector or x-jet will greatly enhance your speed.

As Ryan said you are way way low on decks. I charge 5 to 10 cents to wash concrete. Washing decks and concrete are nothing alike. As far as hourly charge I do most of my work by the sqft. If I told a homeowner that I would wash thier house for $75 an hour I'd get laughed at, if I told them I would wash their house for $250 flat fee they would be much more open to the idea. Alot of pricing is due to percieved value I have washed homes in one subdivsion for $250 and in other subdivisons I could get $400 for the same house, differant area and percieved value is greater. Image is a real good selling point also, look and act like a professional with professional equipment and you can charge professional prices. That is as long as you can deliver professional

results.

Just my two cents hope some it makes sense.

Richard

[Crownroyal 14]

Thanks guys, what about the chemicals for house washing or deck cleaning?

Whats the best type of deck sealers I should be offering?

Does anyone have climbing gear?

What about the extention with the wheels and nozzles on it?

Anyone ever uses it? I feel like a 5 year old asking why, why, why. lol

[PressurePros 249]

Hey Dan, welcome to the forum. I'm not the type of person that puts fine sugary coatings on things so people can digest better. I'm also not a bad guy in person so I don't want you to think I am picking on you in any way. You have come here for feedback and I will give you some. I commend you for wanting to better your business and coming here to put yourself out in the open.

I am surprised you haven't lost interest in the whole endeavor by now as you can't be making any profit. Do you carry insurance, use chemicals and pay Uncle Sam? Again, not picking on you, but you need to understand my passion is to build this industry and change it's public image. I'm going to assume that you had that machine lying around the house and wanted to see if you liked the profession. Well, it seems you got hooked just like we all did so now it's time to get serious and become a true contractor.

If you are as dedicated as you say you are, and you are familiar with the forums then obtaining information about trailers, axles, rigs, chemicals, proper insurance and pricing should be easy for you using the search engine located on this and other similar boards. READ READ and READ more. Everyone here, including myself when able, would be happy to answer any specific questions you cannot locate.

[Mike 64]

Whether or not intentionally, you have put yourself into the dreaded lowballer category.

Ken,

I have to respectfully disagree with you on that part of your response. If the guy has insurance and a proper license (if required by his state) and he can afford to make a living on the prices he has then why would you put him in the same catagory as someone who has no insurance or license and takes shortcuts (also known to some as a lowballer)

Dan,

Welcome to the Grime Scene. Beth has created an awesome FAQ area for common questions on starting and running a PW business. This BBS is full of useful information that can be obtained by using the search function or by searching the sub forums manually. Enjoy, ask questions and have a good time. Good Luck!

Link to FAQ area: http://www.thegrimescene.com/forums/faq.php?

Link to Search Funtion: http://www.thegrimescene.com/forums/search.php?

[Celeste 341]

Dan,

Welcome to the board! Like the others have said, there is a wealth of information on here. Don't hesistate to ask questions - the only dumb question is the one unasked! We do encourage the use of the search features as many of your questions will be answered there. I would say that most of us have been where you are today, some much longer ago than others :)

I do have some concern about you cutting yourself very short on your deck pricing. Newport News is not a "low end" community and you should be able to charge over $1.50/sq ft for a strip/stain. They're getting a little more than that in the Maryland area, we're getting in that neighborhood down here in NC. We're also not a horrible drive from you if you ever wanted to come tag along with us :)

Celeste

[Don Phelps 85]

Dan,

Since everyone has what works for them, you're going to get several varied and conflicting opinions. With that being said, here's mine.

Most, if not all the products on the roof cleaning market are sodium hydroxide based if not sodium hypochlorite (bleach/chlorine). I prefer chlorine. After all, what's growing on the roof? A form of algae and chlorine kills algae. Sodium hydroxide will kill it also but being a form of degreaser and the fact that most shingles are made with petroleum, it only seems practical to use the chlorine.

When cleaning roofs, we use a 12 volt ShurFlo pump to apply the chem at about 45-60 psi. Once the roof is clean, we rinse with a garden hose, so as not to dry the shingles out from the chlorine (salt).

As previously stated, the sodium hydroxide will work but not ideal in my opinion. It will usually require more pressure when rinsing and often takes longer to clean.

The less pressure on a roof, the better!

We use a xjet/pwer when washing houses.

I'll leave with my remarks from above, as we don't offer any deck cleaning/restoration services with our company and there are many other qualified individuals to offer advice in that area.

As I stated in the private message, feel free to give me a call if you want.

[PressurePros 249]

You're right, Mike. I didn't mean to really imply that was his intention but the word has a taboo to it. If the guy is here asking questions then he obviously wants to right himself and become a real contractor. I took that sentence out of my post. Thanks for pointing that out.

[Crownroyal 14]

Thanks very much for the info.

I don’t mind being the low price right now. As I see it I will be taking the jobs most of the Professionals will not want to do. But to build this half of my company I must start somewhere and as this part of my company grows I will increase the prices. As any new company you have to find the market and I think I have started off in the right direction. This is why I have posted asking a few?’s. I know your company is only as good as your employees and as good as you can lead and teach. I only employ 2 people for this half of my company. Dagan Enterprises is registered with SCC, IRS, City of Poquoson, Central Contractors Registration, Defense Logistics Agency, FedTeds, Fedbizzopps, and Department of Professional occupational regulation and hope to add a few others that will further add the needed help and open market I will be looking for. Dagan Enterprises is a small business contractor for the government and involved in three contracts at the moment. Pouring concrete sinkers for the USCG in 5 states, chemical pipe cleaning of the USCG cutter fleet, and doing PM's on digital imagers on the VA medical hospitals In the South East. I worked for a Company call United Technologies in Va. When the owner sold a year ago I decided to sell my stock that I held in the family Bakery (Brenner’s bakery) and started a company to do mostly Preventive maintenance for the Government.

But now Dagan is split in two, we do Preventive Maintenance for Residential and Commercial also. We install LeafFilter gutter protection, gutters, windows, and will be doing the removal of roof algae, house washing and deck washing.

I believe that these things are a job done based on a Preventive measure.

I find myself a positive movement in the market and will do no harm. I want to offer this service and know I am doing the best I can at it.

I started this company when I was 25 and I have not stopped once to think I can’t do anything. My Teacher or mentor who helped me start this company has 3 doctrines and I tend to soak as much info from him as I can, plus he flies me back and forth from site visit to site visit. (He calls it feeding the horses) I think He’s just bored and rich.

So Thank you all for any help or questions answered.

I’ve been all over this forum and I couldn’t get good answers to my questions.

But now since I have gave my facts I see a different trend of answers.

Thank you all

Dan

[Crownroyal 14]

Did anyone catch that

I was wondering it myself.

Chemistry of Sodium Hypochlorite

Reacting chlorine and sodium hydroxide will produce Sodium Hypochlorite

Cl2 +2NaOH = NaOCL + NaCl + H2O

Chlorine + Sodium Hydroxide + Sodium Hypochlorite +

Sodium Chloride + Water

[Beth n Rod 1,279]

Dan,

Pop up for a visit and spend a couple days with Rod. Labor for learning - it's worth it. We are in Germantown, MD, and Newport News is not that far.

Beth

[Mike 64]

You're right, Mike. I didn't mean to really imply that was his intention but the word has a taboo to it. If the guy is here asking questions then he obviously wants to right himself and become a real contractor. I took that sentence out of my post. Thanks for pointing that out.

Ken, no big deal. :D His prices did look a little low and I see where you were coming from. What one guy charges does in a way effect what the rest of us can charge for our services. I know you have a passion for raising the standards for the industry and I respect you for that. Keep doin what your doin!

:cheers:

[PressurePros 249]

I'm going to be the bad seed here...I'm sorry, I find inconsistencies that I cannot keep to myself. With such a successful, well funded company as the one you described here are the issues I have concern over:

If your name is well established as a contractor, why would you need to come in at pricing that isn't even in the ball park then claim you are going to raise later? You should know from being in business that you cannot dramatically raise prices without reaching a point of diminishing return and destroying your customer base, not to mention your reputation. Which leads me to question number two..Where did you come up with your pricing tier? I don't know any contractors, large or small, that do any type of work for $20 an hour..especially ones that are used to handling government contracts. If you are addicted to the forums as your wife has mentioned, surely you would have read posts on the right rig and how to price your work, right?

You describe what sounds like a very succesful mid size company. I know your expenses are considerably higher than mine. If you have found a way to carry liability, workman's comp, support mutliple employee payroll, taxes, chemicals and machinery expense and still make a profit at $20 per hour, I would like to hear more about your business plan because mine sucks.

[Crownroyal 14]

I'm sorry if you find an inconsistency that is not my problem. My company is run by numbers I charge the government 50.00 for a 1000 pound sinker, guess how much a couple of yards of 3000 psi concrete are. Well more that 50.00 bucks But when your pouring about 1500 of them then you get a nice break, not to mention the real cost of the sinker would be the eye or anchor that is attached to it. The shipping is even included. So get this, to go to Tenn. make the forms, call a concrete company to pour, set the eyes and ship them to their destination and come home cost $50.00. Don’t get it. Then I'm sorry you wont ever.

Well Ken I guess I have to fill you in on how to make your employees subcontractors

Now ohhh here we go If you get the jobs say marketing and you sign on two guys and make them their own boss’s I guess you wont have to pay there expenses, hum. How about make your company a LLC and stop drawing a check (paying taxes twice) have the LLC pay your home expenses.

So I tell the boy's when there not running the bids I will have work for them with the second half of the company Leaffilter, gutters, power washing, replacement windows, ect. So my cost is minimal but they take more profit. I didn’t say what Dagan netted went into my pocket. This is sales, I make pennies on the dollar with power washing, the guys make the $18.00 an hour and I get $2.00 now remember that is to stain a deck that doesn’t include the materials or any other type of work. I also install windows and leaffilter and gutters that make more profit for the company and more for the sub/emp. Power washing is not my bread and butter. As for you it must be. I don’t see how you can think that a newbie too the forum is just some smuck. I find responses with attitude uneducated remarks. But I do appreciate your 2 cents. Now to get back to the reason I posted. I just wanted a little direction and to know if I was close. Not to hear what you would call soft criticism. That really discourages others.

Me giving my guys something to do when there rotating months on and off Is a benefit for keeping some of the guys happy and wanting to stay because in my world you come second and the employees come first. Remember your employees run your company, and its up to you to oversee and make sure they are happy.

Other wise you wont get anywhere. A happy employee will make you money.

And again those that helped answer or give good advice I would commend you and thank you. An yes Kenn if you were trying to help from your bottom of your heart I forgive you for questioning and your uncouth attitude. You don’t know me or know how I run my company so you can’t question anything. Quote “I know your expenses are considerably higher than mine. If you have found a way to carry liability, workman's comp, support

(spelling)->mutliple employee payroll, taxes, chemicals and machinery expense and still make a profit at $20 per hour” ß--this is what I was talking about I asked if my prices where right not to hear any of this.

I’m very sorry if I offend anyone but this burns my britches.

Dan

[PressurePros 249]

With all due respect, Crown, I got the answers I was looking for. Thank you and the very best of luck in the business.

[Celeste 341]

Dan,

Without coming off as rude, you stated that pressure washing is not your bread and butter. It is ours. Guys like you that come in and charge $20.00 hour because it's not your main income are the ones that kill us. If you are licensed, fully insured, educated enough, etc... to let your customer believe that you're a professional, then you should keep your prices within the industry range - out of respect for the industry. Turning this around, how would you like it if someone new came in and underbid your concrete thingies by more than 50%, because they could do that and it wasn't their main source of support?

If I have misinterpreted something, I apologize.

Celeste

[Crownroyal 14]

Carolina Pro I hope you understand That is why I posted. I dont want to over bid or underbid. I wanted to get the right equipment and do the job right. Period

This is why I was wondering if I was to high or to low and if I was in the ball park.

So which way should the prices have changed

Prices go as followed

Roofs

1000-2000sqft =180

2000-3000sqft =230

3000-4000sqft =280

Houses

1000-2000sqft =150

2000-3000sqft =190

3000-4000sqft =230

Decks is .5--.6 cents a sqft

Sealing is $20.00 hour

Decks was added because many of the hotels and homes were asking about them.

Plus in value pak there is a company advertising deck cleaning 15*12 for 39.00, one story powerwash 89.00, two story powerwash 109 and roof wash 199. (George Ronan powerwash) was the company name.

We were just doing homes and roofs till about last month.

I just guess I was thinking maybe folks were going to tell me to raise the roof wash or lower the house wash or raise what you charge to clean a deck to .10 cent. you know what I mean.

I am very sorry for all the huff.

I was looking for info and so far all I understand is that the prices for sealing should be sqft not hourly rate and it is low and cleaning decks is low. What would be the average price?

Thanks again

Dan

[tropical wave 22]

your deck prices are waaaaay off .05-.06 sq....thats cheaper than most charge to clean concrete.....wood decks take more time, chems, 2 step process etc etc............ search under the wood restoration section, there are a lot of posts where folks talk about how much they charge..... different prices for different areas, chems, neighborhoods etc....

[squirtgun 122]

Dan,

The sq ft prices you are quoting for decks is as everyone else has said are "LOW". The average is between $.75 and $2.00 sq ft.The $.75-$.1.00 being for a basic wash only.$1.01 to $2.00 is for a complete restoration(strip,brighten/neutralize and stain)(I think the average is around $1.45) and some companies get more depending on which stains they use.As stated above geographic location will help determine where in the price range you will need to be.

You housewash pricing seems fair for a simple 1 story house.The roof cleaning prics seem to be inline with what I know some other charge to do them.

[Celeste 341]

Crown,

It takes a variety of equipment to do a full service PW job properly....there are many opinions on whether one needs a hot or cold water unit. We actually have one hot and two cold.....hot water makes cleaning concrete much more efficient but is asolutely not needed if you are going to concentrate in wood restoration. GPM is more important than PSI. As Don said, you are going to get twice as many opinions as you ask questions which is why I encouraged using the search feature to compile some of the more common ones. Pricing varies widely...there are guys on the west coast getting $4+/sq foot for decks - we could never get that here. If you're going to do a lot of concrete, you should look into a surface cleaner that is compatible with your machine. Our personal opinion is an X-jet/M-5 is an absolute must. There's a thread (somewhere - Mike you know where EVERYTHING is) that is lists of what folks have that they feel is necessary.

We have never concentrated on what "the other val pack guy" was advertising. Many of them are "bulk" businesses and don't do the quality job that we feel we offer our clients. We have "felt" out the folks we deal with and priced accordingly. We have been the highest and lowest...but most always right in the infield.

Wish you the best of luck in your venture - our offer still stands to do a ride along with us as we have a pretty wide variety of work that we do.

Celeste

[CCPC 26]

Your roof and house wash prices are right in line with what I charge for the sqft, but your wood prices are way off. As others have stated, your best friend in this business, especially just starting out, is going to be this bbs and others like it. You could fill a pressurewashing dictionary with the info available on the internet, so take full advantage. The methods you described are way to ineffecient. Do some research on equipment that will help speed up your cleaning time.

[Beth n Rod 1,279]

Your house prices and deck prices are both off.

Give us a call if you want to drive up and learn.

Beth

[Crownroyal 14]

Thanks guys I will change a few prices and look again for the new equipment that I will be acquiring. I have two Dodge dualies with Cummins enclosed walk in beds.

I will measure and try to make a system fit. Now off the Alkota.com, Tough, and Simpson. Thanks for the info.

Dan

[tidyjet 14]

Thanks guys I will change a few prices and look again for the new equipment that I will be acquiring. I have two Dodge dualies with Cummins enclosed walk in beds.

I will measure and try to make a system fit. Now off the Alkota.com, Tough, and Simpson. Thanks for the info.

Dan

Dan,

Look into the Hydrotek units if your outfitting (what I think your indicating) a PU bed. I think the Hydroteks are the best built and most compact units available.

The SS30005SH skid (3000/4.8) measures 23"w x 40"H x 47" L and leaves room in my 8' bed 1-ton for 225G of water, 80G of chems, tools, wands, 2- reels and a surface cleaner.