I need a gun

[CCPC 26]

I need to buy a hand gun, but have little knowledge or experience with guns. I know some of you have guns, and some of you are police officers any advice on pro's and con's of different hand guns would be great.

[PressurePros 249]

We do have a gun in our home.

Beth

LOL, you better let Rod know. I don't think he is aware of that. You must have meant a pressure washing gun <smile>

[Beth n Rod 1,279]

He is... He just ignores it.

Beth :)

[CCPC 26]

Wow! This sure opened up a can of worms. There's been some great things to consider here, and I appreciate everyones input.

Somthing to consider inlight of the Katrina disaster being brought up, this is exactly the kind of event that has encouraged me to look into this, and I can think of many other catastrophic events that could be much worse.

The thing that really got me looking into this is the VERY REAL threat of an epidemic such as the bird flu. It's hard to imagin what can come form such a thing, if in fact it escalated to a point of no stopping it. This is a very real threat, and I don't think we are getting the full story on how real this threat really is. Along with the gun thing, I have also already made other preperations including setting aside a supply of food that can feed my family and I for 3 to 4 months, a water reserve, and I plan to put together a few other things that I feel would be very important if, God forbid, something of this nature did arise. Some of you may think this is a little extreme, but to me spending a little time, and money now on somthing that can mean the difference of life in death down the road is a small price to pay.

In the event of lets say a bird flu mutation and epidemic, what do you think your chances are of getting to the groccery store and buying enough packaged and canned food, water, batteries, and other supplies that would be paramount in such a situation. Most will be left high and dry, left to roam (amongst others possibly infected) in search of the necessities that they need. That's where the gun comes into play. Desperate people do desperate things, in such an event, I'm not necessarily as worried about the bad people, but more so, the desperate, UNPREPARED, good people trying to take whats mine.

If somthing such as bird flu became the real deal, I plan to stay home with my family for whatever length of time necessary to ensure our saftey, and I also plan to have everything i need already in place.

You'll must be thinking what a nut case. No, I'm just smart.

[steve r 14]

Wow! This sure opened up a can of worms. There's been some great things to consider here, and I appreciate everyones input.

Somthing to consider inlight of the Katrina disaster being brought up, this is exactly the kind of event that has encouraged me to look into this, and I can think of many other catastrophic events that could be much worse.

The thing that really got me looking into this is the VERY REAL threat of an epidemic such as the bird flu. It's hard to imagin what can come form such a thing, if in fact it escalated to a point of no stopping it. This is a very real threat, and I don't think we are getting the full story on how real this threat really is. Along with the gun thing, I have also already made other preperations including setting aside a supply of food that can feed my family and I for 3 to 4 months, a water reserve, and I plan to put together a few other things that I feel would be very important if, God forbid, something of this nature did arise. Some of you may think this is a little extreme, but to me spending a little time, and money now on somthing that can mean the difference of life in death down the road is a small price to pay.

In the event of lets say a bird flu mutation and epidemic, what do you think your chances are of getting to the groccery store and buying enough packaged and canned food, water, batteries, and other supplies that would be paramount in such a situation. Most will be left high and dry, left to roam (amongst others possibly infected) in search of the necessities that they need. That's where the gun comes into play. Desperate people do desperate things, in such an event, I'm not necessarily as worried about the bad people, but more so, the desperate, UNPREPARED, good people trying to take whats mine.

If somthing such as bird flu became the real deal, I plan to stay home with my family for whatever length of time necessary to ensure our saftey, and I also plan to have everything i need already in place.

You'll must be thinking what a nut case. No, I'm just smart.

Ha lance my wine cellar is full of good stuff .just habit of having things on hand

[Larry B 55]

Ryan you have made some excellent and well thought out points and you are also the epitomy of the "right person" too carry.

Concealed carry wherever you are is not a bad thing. Many times things just happen. Myself and three friends were fishing on a river. We were approached by three obnoxious guys. They blocked our escape route, aside from jumping in the river, they continued to make threats, harrass and taunt us. Finally one of our group told them to get out of the way and let us leave. The next thing we know is they all have knifes out and are trying to stab one guy. In the confusion one of our group was able to get away. He knew just what to do. I DID NOT have my concealed permit at that time and had chosen to leave the only gun in the car, a nearly fatal mistake for one of us. We ran toward the car with the thugs on our foot steps. I met my friend, grabbed the gun and wheeled around This stopped them in their tracks. NO shots were fired and they chose to quietly walk the other direction.

Law enforcement would have been useless in this case unless he happened to be very close by. If there had been an officer near the thugs might have never acted that way to begin with.

We did not provoke this, we were not in a bad area. There was no other way to handle it. I fully believe somebody would have been severely hurt in this case.

[Jon 533]

Jon Fife,

No you're not the only SIG guy here, I have wanted one for a long time and might consider that as a replacement for some of the guns I sold.

Would not want another 45 or 44 but not because I have them but because I would want a lighter gun to carry and for the home.

SPECIALIZED, guess some cities prioritize stolen guns at the top of the list. I have never had one stolen so cannot speak from personal experience, just what I have been foolish enough to read and believe in the papers knowing half or more of it is not true.

Beth why not get Rod to a gun safety class even if he would rather not have one around the house? And don't let him tell me just because he towers over others and is solid muscle he can do without learning!

[PowerWashofVa 14]

I have a fully carry permit good for the entire Unitedd States. I have carried a weapon for 33 years. A person needs to be trained with the weapon he or she will be carrying. They need to check with their local law enforcement on the specific regulations.

If you carry a wepaon check into liability insurance. If you use it and are 100% right it doesn't stop a civil suit against you.

If you are a little hot headed do not own a weapon!! I seen alot in my past life & some good people have got caught up in the moment.

Secure all weapons from your children and never leave it on your night stand when you go to sleep. I have seen a spouse shoot their partner by accident. One would get to get a glass of water the other in a deep sleep is not fully awake and shoots.

I know what I sound like but it is very dangerous and you can't take back a bullet once it leaves the barrel.

[Jon 533]

Phil says

I have a fully carry permit good for the entire United States. I have carried a weapon for 33 years.

Only way I believe that is possible is if your a Federal agent and I could be wrong but once you leave you are required to turn that in. [Phil your age would put you at a retired agents age range]

I know of no state or city or county that offers a full carry permit for all states.

I know most, not all but most states will accept anothers permit but from what I understand your suppose to let the local police know you have one.

Mind explaining your fully carry permit good for the entire United States to all of us?

[Mike Williamson 198]

Consider if you would:

Ever had road rage and yelled at someone you thought for whatever reason was a bad driver? Ever been yelled or honked at furiously by someone when you were driving and couldn't understand why? What was your response??? "Whats that *******'* problem?"

Karma has a strange way of invoking itself upon those who would submit themselves to it. It's real!

Rod!~

A gun is a gun, neither good nor evil. Owning it won't bring me bad luck or bad karma or whatever you want to call it.

Maybe the person who yelled at me was just being as much a jerk as I was being earlier? I tend to go with that explanation than with believing some force made someone yell at me because I yelled at someone else....

I own several guns, nothing fancy...a couple shotguns (12g and 20g) a matched pair of .38 and .22 revolvers, and a S&W SP101 .357 They all have their purposes, though thank God I've never needed any of them except the 20g snake gun.

I have considered recently going with a Glock .40 and a CC permit, simply because I now have a very small, defenseless person who I sometimes carry around with me. That, and I'm looking at the possibility of more commercial night work, and it's be nice to have some sort of defence other than 3000psi.

[Mike Williamson 198]

I have a fully carry permit good for the entire Unitedd States. I have carried a weapon for 33 years. A person needs to be trained with the weapon he or she will be carrying. They need to check with their local law enforcement on the specific regulations.

If you carry a wepaon check into liability insurance. If you use it and are 100% right it doesn't stop a civil suit against you.

If you are a little hot headed do not own a weapon!! I seen alot in my past life & some good people have got caught up in the moment.

Secure all weapons from your children and never leave it on your night stand when you go to sleep. I have seen a spouse shoot their partner by accident. One would get to get a glass of water the other in a deep sleep is not fully awake and shoots.

I know what I sound like but it is very dangerous and you can't take back a bullet once it leaves the barrel.

Yes, I too would be interested in hearing how this works (not denying you have one, just curious what type it is). The way I understand it is that some states have reciprocity laws with other states, and some don't. I may have a CC permit in FL, but that doesn't mean I can carry in CA, but I may be able to carry in GA or AL.

[PowerWashofVa 14]

A year or so ago they passed legislation allowing any honorably retired law enforcement officer officer to carry a weapon in all the states.

You have to qualify with your weapon yearly ie: with you agency.

Know that doesn't mean you can carry on planes, there are some restrictions.

Years ago some states were reciprocial but not all. NYC has or had the Sullivan Law which did not allow other outside agencies to carry their weapon. The Federal Law over ruled NYC's law.

Short story... I was a cop in NY in 1973 and stopped a NJ State Trooper he was off duty and had his service revolver on. I could have locked him up. Of course I didn't especially when he said laughing, he needed the gun in Manhattan more then he did on the Jersey Turnpike.

Currently I am in Florida and have the paperwork at home. This all came about after 911.

[seymore 90]

A year or so ago they passed legislation allowing any honorably retired law enforcement officer officer to carry a weapon in all the states.

Nobody better mess with Phil in any state!! :lgbow: :lgbow:

You down in Fla.Phil to get away from the cold and snow?

[Mike Williamson 198]

Currently I am in Florida and have the paperwork at home. This all came about after 911.

Sounds like a good law. I never understood not allowing cops from other areas to carry weapons...I was nearly arrested in NJ for having a .22 rifle in the car (hey, I was a dumb 18yo kid who'd never been to NJ, and I wanted SOME sort of protection in the hotel room!) The officer in whose car I sat for an hour on my first wedding anniversary just off the NJ turnpike told me that he wasn't even allowed to carry his weapon in NY (this was in 1989). He was amazed when I told him how easy it was to buy a gun in FL (at that time there was no background check, and I don't believe there was a waiting period).

They ran the serial # on the rifle, and let me go (keeping the rifle, of course). They told me I could pick the rifle up at the station on the way back home (we were headed to NH)

How did he find out I had a rifle in the car? I, being a stupid 18yo kid, figured that since I had no gun rack in the car, I'd keep the rifle in the rear window, so no one could claim I was trying to conceal a weapon. I figured hey, if you can carry a rifle on a gun rack in the rear window of a pickup, it'd be ok to keep it in the rear window of the car...

He said that if I'd been pulled over by the NJ state patrol on the turnpike, I'd have been on my face on the pavement in handcuffs, and WOULD have spent the weekend in jail.

I haven't been back to NJ since... :)

[PowerWashofVa 14]

Here is the info on carring a weapon by active & retired police officers

H.R.218: The Law Enforcement Officers Safety Act of 2004

(Enrolled as Agreed to or Passed by Both House and Senate)

One Hundred Eighth Congress of the United States of America

AT THE SECOND SESSION

Begun and held at the City of Washington on Tuesday, the twentieth day of January, two thousand and four

An Act

To amend title 18, United States Code, to exempt qualified current and former law enforcement officers from State laws prohibiting the carrying of concealed handguns.

Be it enacted by the Senate and House of Representatives of the United States of America in Congress assembled,

SECTION 1. SHORT TITLE.

This Act may be cited as the `Law Enforcement Officers Safety Act of 2004'.

SEC. 2. EXEMPTION OF QUALIFIED LAW ENFORCEMENT OFFICERS FROM STATE LAWS PROHIBITING THE CARRYING OF CONCEALED FIREARMS.

(a) In General- Chapter 44 of title 18, United States Code, is amended by inserting after section 926A the following:

`Sec. 926B. Carrying of concealed firearms by qualified law enforcement officers

`(a) Notwithstanding any other provision of the law of any State or any political subdivision thereof, an individual who is a qualified law enforcement officer and who is carrying the identification required by subsection (d) may carry a concealed firearm that has been shipped or transported in interstate or foreign commerce, subject to subsection (b).

`(b) This section shall not be construed to supersede or limit the laws of any State that--

`(1) permit private persons or entities to prohibit or restrict the possession of concealed firearms on their property; or

`(2) prohibit or restrict the possession of firearms on any State or local government property, installation, building, base, or park.

`© As used in this section, the term `qualified law enforcement officer' means an employee of a governmental agency who--

`(1) is authorized by law to engage in or supervise the prevention, detection, investigation, or prosecution of, or the incarceration of any person for, any violation of law, and has statutory powers of arrest;

`(2) is authorized by the agency to carry a firearm;

`(3) is not the subject of any disciplinary action by the agency;

`(4) meets standards, if any, established by the agency which require the employee to regularly qualify in the use of a firearm;

`(5) is not under the influence of alcohol or another intoxicating or hallucinatory drug or substance; and

`(6) is not prohibited by Federal law from receiving a firearm.

`(d) The identification required by this subsection is the photographic identification issued by the governmental agency for which the individual is employed as a law enforcement officer.

`(e) As used in this section, the term `firearm' does not include--

`(1) any machinegun (as defined in section 5845 of the National Firearms Act);

`(2) any firearm silencer (as defined in section 921 of this title); and

`(3) any destructive device (as defined in section 921 of this title).'.

(b) Clerical Amendment- The table of sections for such chapter is amended by inserting after the item relating to section 926A the following:

`926B. Carrying of concealed firearms by qualified law enforcement officers.'.

SEC. 3. EXEMPTION OF QUALIFIED RETIRED LAW ENFORCEMENT OFFICERS FROM STATE LAWS PROHIBITING THE CARRYING OF CONCEALED FIREARMS.

(a) In General- Chapter 44 of title 18, United States Code, is further amended by inserting after section 926B the following:

`Sec. 926C. Carrying of concealed firearms by qualified retired law enforcement officers

`(a) Notwithstanding any other provision of the law of any State or any political subdivision thereof, an individual who is a qualified retired law enforcement officer and who is carrying the identification required by subsection (d) may carry a concealed firearm that has been shipped or transported in interstate or foreign commerce, subject to subsection (b).

`(b) This section shall not be construed to supersede or limit the laws of any State that--

`(1) permit private persons or entities to prohibit or restrict the possession of concealed firearms on their property; or

`(2) prohibit or restrict the possession of firearms on any State or local government property, installation, building, base, or park.

`© As used in this section, the term `qualified retired law enforcement officer' means an individual who--

`(1) retired in good standing from service with a public agency as a law enforcement officer, other than for reasons of mental instability;

`(2) before such retirement, was authorized by law to engage in or supervise the prevention, detection, investigation, or prosecution of, or the incarceration of any person for, any violation of law, and had statutory powers of arrest;

`(3)(A) before such retirement, was regularly employed as a law enforcement officer for an aggregate of 15 years or more; or

`(B) retired from service with such agency, after completing any applicable probationary period of such service, due to a service-connected disability, as determined by such agency;

`(4) has a nonforfeitable right to benefits under the retirement plan of the agency;

`(5) during the most recent 12-month period, has met, at the expense of the individual, the State's standards for training and qualification for active law enforcement officers to carry firearms;

`(6) is not under the influence of alcohol or another intoxicating or hallucinatory drug or substance; and

`(7) is not prohibited by Federal law from receiving a firearm.

`(d) The identification required by this subsection is--

`(1) a photographic identification issued by the agency from which the individual retired from service as a law enforcement officer that indicates that the individual has, not less recently than one year before the date the individual is carrying the concealed firearm, been tested or otherwise found by the agency to meet the standards established by the agency for training and qualification for active law enforcement officers to carry a firearm of the same type as the concealed firearm; or

`(2)(A) a photographic identification issued by the agency from which the individual retired from service as a law enforcement officer; and

`(B) a certification issued by the State in which the individual resides that indicates that the individual has, not less recently than one year before the date the individual is carrying the concealed firearm, been tested or otherwise found by the State to meet the standards established by the State for training and qualification for active law enforcement officers to carry a firearm of the same type as the concealed firearm.

`(e) As used in this section, the term `firearm' does not include--

`(1) any machinegun (as defined in section 5845 of the National Firearms Act);

`(2) any firearm silencer (as defined in section 921 of this title); and

`(3) a destructive device (as defined in section 921 of this title).'.

(b) Clerical Amendment- The table of sections for such chapter is further amended by inserting after the item relating to section 926B the following:

`926C. Carrying of concealed firearms by qualified retired law enforcement officers.'.

Speaker of the House of Representatives.

Vice President of the United States and President of the Senate.

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[PressurePros 249]

I don't blame you, Mike..NJ Troopers don't mess around. One weekend I had just finished installing Garret T5 turbochargers on my Supra and was itching to run it. So after two or three beers decided the casino was the place to be (I'm 22 at the time) So we pile into my 2+2 and get on the A/C Expressway. I'm doing about 130 and I look over at my one friend who has this big perma-grin spread across his grill. Music is blasting, I have invincibility flowing through my veins when I see in the very far distance what looks like top lights. I slow to 60 and wait.. about three minutes later he is up my rear flashing me.. What's left of my buzz faded when I see this 6'5" trooper bend sideways to get his shoulders out of his car. By the time I looked up from my mirror he already had me halfway out of the drivers seat. That asphalt did not feel good. At least he could have opened my door first.

[RyanH 14]

The Federal Law over ruled NYC's law.

This really scared me when I read this. No Federal law should ever overrule state law. Fortunately, when I read down to Sec 3, part B subsections 1 and 2, it looks like they do state that federal law will not supersede state law.

Once our federal system can nullify state rules, our system will be in complete devastation. It already is in some regards.

[PLD 14]

A year or so ago they passed legislation allowing any honorably retired law enforcement officer officer to carry a weapon in all the states.

Smart.

Know that doesn't mean you can carry on planes, there are some restrictions.

Stupid.

Years ago some states were reciprocial but not all. NYC has or had the Sullivan Law which did not allow other outside agencies to carry their weapon. The Federal Law over ruled NYC's law.

As much as the feds would like everyone (including themselves) to believe, a federal law can only further restrict state/local regs. The only time the feds can loosen such regs is when the law in question is rules unconstitutional. i.e. No federal law can make murder legal in Georgia.

That said, they can pass a totally unenforcable reg and politic strongly to get the states to voluntary comply.

I was a cop in NY in 1973

Thank you for your service.

[PLD 14]

Once our federal system can nullify state rules, our system will be in complete devastation. It already is in some regards.

De Jure nullification - Unconstitutional.

De Facto nullification - Happens REGULARLY. Tax heavily and deny to spend those seized dollars in states that do not comply. Every wondered why every state passed a 21 drinking age and 55 speed limit so quickly and nearly all at once? Highway dollars.

And that my friends is the sad fact behind why tax reform like the fair tax will NEVER be enacted. TOO much power in social manipulation through tax code.

[Jon 533]

Phil thanks for all that info about retired cops being allowed to carry.

Would this apply to those that left the force for reasons other then good cause?

Fair Tax, equal tax based on total income regardless is the only way it should be sort of.

Retired people might be allowed some sort of tax break, based on total worth.

Tax politicians triple to get back a tiny bit of the stolen money they take from us yearly!

New Mexico I am finding out has not law making any gun other then a true machine gun illegal. Want to own a true AK 47, you can buy them here, want large size clips, legal here too!

Man what fun at the open gun range this is going to be. The indoor ranges restrict certain caliber guns and for good reason.

Ok now Phil who do you know that can say all us good outstanding pressure washing and (retired ones) are good citizens and all being good former peace officers (ok a lie) and we should be given one of those national CCP?

Hey guys let's all chip in and buy good buddy Phil a few rounds for his help here:)

[Mike Williamson 198]

Hey guys let's all chip in and buy good buddy Phil a few rounds for his help here:)

What caliber?

[Jon 533]

Um, Phil could you please answer that question.:lgsideway

[PowerWashofVa 14]

Jon,

It is my understanding that a retired PO must be in good standing. Someone that would still be allowed to be rehired or work in another law enforcement position.

Now don't ask about different type of weapons... I never was a gun buff and only used the weapons supplied by my agency. I don't carry a weapon most of the time, only when I think it is going to be necessary. I never carry a weapon while I'm working. (it would rust) lol :)

When I retired I was in charge of Organized Crimes Division and I'm glad I decided to leave & start a PW business. It is nice to see the results of your hard work when you finish the job.

Take Care