Commercial Tile Cleaning

[Jesse 15]

I do a LOT of regrouting and tile repair for fast food chains along with basic repair and maintenance and have been searching for a dry vapor steam cleaner to clean interior tile and to remove gum on the sidewalks.

I would not feel comfortable letting all of that excess water sit on the floors like that. Most chains do not seal their grout or use water proof backer board or even green board on the walls. All that excess water wicks up the wall rotting out the bottom 16 inches or so of drywall behind the tile or FRP board.

At the very least some of the base cove tile or vinyl base will eventually fall off due to wall deterioration and severe mold. Most of my tile repair is because of over zealous employees using a garden hose and stiff bristle brush to clean the tile after closing.

I’m not telling you how to do your work…only reporting on what I see on a weekly basis. That is why I am on the hunt for an affordable steam cleaner like the gum buster.

I just finished up formica repairs in a large cafiteria at the Truman Bldg. and they were asking about having the grout cleaned at all of the state buildings around here (I live in the state capital) If anyone has any experience with a dry steam vapor cleaner I would sure like to hear how you like it and what it cost. This will be a great add on for my existing clientell.

Thanks allot,:)

Jesse

[Steve Kiser 14]

If u go after all that t&g I would look at a scrubber put out by Karcher, I have been field testing it for a few months now, and it is incredible, I do alot or residential cleaning, and it has cut all my job times in half a little pricey, but they have different brushes u can buy, ie. red for t&g, they have a grey one for scrubbing concrete trying that next, I will try to find a link to it. It is a little pricey though. Here ya go http://www.tornadovac.com/product_solutions/product_details.asp?PARENT_ROW_ID=4&CHILD_ROW_ID=27&PRODUCT_ROW_ID=51

[Jesse 15]

If u go after all that t&g I would look at a scrubber put out by Karcher, I have been field testing it for a few months now, and it is incredible, I do alot or residential cleaning, and it has cut all my job times in half a little pricey, but they have different brushes u can buy, ie. red for t&g, they have a grey one for scrubbing concrete trying that next, I will try to find a link to it. It is a little pricey though. Here ya go http://www.tornadovac.com/product_solutions/product_details.asp?PARENT_ROW_ID=4&CHILD_ROW_ID=27&PRODUCT_ROW_ID=51

Thanks for the link Steve. Just a couple of questions:

How much does the unit you are using sell for?

Does it use water or steam and how much?

Will it erode the grout quickly like the hand held stiff bristle brushes they are now using in the franchises?

I cant tell much from the web site and have no time to listen to a salesman.

Thanks again and have a great weekend.

Jesse

[Ron Musgraves 240]

Most commercial kitchens are being built with urethane grout.

Older units have this old style cheap sand grout and it doesn’t last in my own house under normal conditions.

We clean a dairy that replaced the urethane after 10 years and let me tell you it was tough.

Dairies use ammonia and acids to clean. Yes they mix them; I realize this make deadly gas. The stacks are a few hundred feet high. I have never been present when sterilization is being done that I’m aware of.

This was one of the original installs for this urethane grout. I have been doing commercial interiors for about 15 years.

Most major chains Outback Corp., Darden, Brinker & Yum are installing this and replacing old with the urethane by Dupont.

[Jesse 15]

Most commercial kitchens are being built with urethane grout.

Older units have this old style cheap sand grout and it doesn’t last in my own house under normal conditions.

We clean a dairy that replaced the urethane after 10 years and let me tell you it was tough.

Dairies use ammonia and acids to clean. Yes they mix them; I realize this make deadly gas. The stacks are a few hundred feet high. I have never been present when sterilization is being done that I’m aware of.

This was one of the original installs for this urethane grout. I have been doing commercial interiors for about 15 years.

Most major chains Outback Corp., Darden, Brinker & Yum are installing this and replacing old with the urethane by Dupont.

Thanks for The info Ron.

The black sanded grout with red quarry tile and base cove is exactly what is used in 90% of the places that I repair.

I will do a search on this new grout and recommend it to my clients. They tear down and rebuild their stores every 10-15 years but are still slow to change things that arnt working (like using 5/8 regular drywall instead of hardi board in the kitchens).

Thanks,

Jesse

[Steve Kiser 14]

Thanks for the link Steve. Just a couple of questions:

How much does the unit you are using sell for?

Does it use water or steam and how much?

Will it erode the grout quickly like the hand held stiff bristle brushes they are now using in the franchises?

I cant tell much from the web site and have no time to listen to a salesman.

Thanks again and have a great weekend.

Jesse

I got one for around 2300 and some change can't remember figure, it is a scrubber which replaces the little 8 in. brush on a pole that I started out using, it comes with a weight or a water tank, the weight I use when doing the t&g and concrete, the water tank can be used when stripping floors, and it has a little lever on the handle to dispense water, this thing is spinning at 3000 rpm, I did a dressing room at the local shake joint last weekend and after laying down cleaner, hit with scrubber, and rinse at low pressure. Cut almost an hour off my time, from doing it last yr. I have never seen "eroding" grout yet, should be interesting though, all I have to deal with is air pockets. I did however go to a ladies house and when i did a spot test in her closet, after appling the cleaner and hittine with the brush the brush looked like the color of the grout, and when I hit with the cleaning wand, it took the grout out completely, not sure why, kinda like the cleaner liquified the grout again. I am not too worried about it, that is the first time in the 8 yrs I have been cleaning t&g to see that.

[Jesse 15]

Thank Steve.

[bforbis 14]

Jeese, I do a lot of repair in places and repair with the epoxy modified.urethane grout and it is a much better product. As well I use a water proofing adhesive for the base boards and seal top and bottom so the water is locked out.

We use industrial vacs to remove the water, so the water is not sitting there long. Most of these restaurants have far more damage in place before I get there and I try to advise them on corrective path.

The initial construction is where the fail lies.

[Jesse 15]

Hey Brent,

How do you feel about the installation of the urethane grout versus standard black sanded grout? I am referring to dry time, clean up and how well it blends with the existing grout.

I am scared to death of how this stuff will clean up if it is that strong. We hit the black grout with a scouring pad to remove haze then damp rags and hundreds of buckets of clean water are exchanged as fast as I can switch them. The very, very light haze is left for the minimum wage workers to get that next night after closing.

I have tried to sell them on the benefits of sealing (including ease of clean up and less eroding) but it falls on deaf ears.

Thanks for your thoughts,

Jesse

[MMI Enterprises 289]

A few things...

Ron, Realize some these prejects on here are not always done with pressurewash equipment so pricing varies for that reason as well as for reasons of locale and competition level. I use autoscrubbers which have a lower overhead to run and more people offering such services. But hey..trust me I love to get $80-$100 per hr for scrubbing floors but it don't always at all work out that way. On inside work I usually have to be providing actual finish removal services to get to the .20-.30 per sqft. range. (translates into just about same $ an hour figures above for me).

This mornings 4 hour job translated into $60 an hour my share but that was a special deal for my brothers janitorial company in order for him to score daily office cleaning contract. We did 20k sqft of 30k nasty warehouse space in 4 hours..

The thing about these kitchen areas for me is that I don't like the soak and wait time involved of flooding the floor either (is just about required with any method other than hot pressure) so am interested in hooking up a recovery vacuum to my sureface cleaner such as Alan runs...

....Alan, How often does the rubber have to be replaced on the surface cleaners edge. Getting such going on the homemade jobber I run may be too much a pain as you mention butit may be worth a shot..

Far as sanded grout versus urethane...contractors I see use Admix (probably urethane based) in there mortar/sanded grout mix these days so perhaps worrying about such is moot point now...least where I am at anyways. From where I stand with 20 years doing inside cleaning work of all types I got to call it shoddy workmanship from the get go that a place would have to regrout. If a regrouting is to take place the surface sure had better be degreased first and then acid etched or it will just fall out again.

[One Tough Pressure 580]

....Alan, How often does the rubber have to be replaced on the surface cleaners edge. Getting such going on the homemade jobber I run may be too much a pain as you mention butit may be worth a shot..

.

My recovery surface cleaners have a very stiff bristle brush custom made by Fuller brush Company. They keep the water in and allow air to enter for the vacuum. If you had rubber, it would suck to the floor and not move very easy, if at all. If I crank the vacuum to high, it will suck mine to the floor and they will not move.

[MMI Enterprises 289]

My recovery surface cleaners have a very stiff bristle brush custom made by Fuller brush Company. They keep the water in and allow air to enter for the vacuum. If you had rubber, it would suck to the floor and not move very easy, if at all. If I crank the vacuum to high, it will suck mine to the floor and they will not move.

ahh.....Have a pic or a link by chance?.. Is it around edge only sorta like a bonnet pad driver for a carpet cleaning?...Regular scrub machine pad drivers or the nylogrit type scrub brushes cover the whole bottom of a traditional swing floor machine and but have open areas for water to get through during scrubbing so I assume that is not what yer refering to..

[One Tough Pressure 580]

The brush is not as thick as the bonnet pad driver and is only around the outside of the surface cleaner. The spray bar is basically the same as all others and is installed on a dual shell surface cleaner. The bar spins inside of the inner shell, and then you have a 1/4" or so gap where the suction comes into play, surrounded by the brush on the outer shell.

So the bar spins and everything gets pushed out. The brush keeps it in so that the vacuum can suck it up.

I can find my pics, I will try to get some tonight when I am out.

[MMI Enterprises 289]

thanx Alan... seen it today at a shop.. Shop guy didnot know where to get the brush material but I will check with Fullerbrush like ya mentioned. Not sure how I will dual shell mine though ;(

[Integrity Curb Appeal 64]

This is actually what got me into PWing. I modified an inexpensive surface cleaner with a perimeter vacuum attachment to clean tile/grout in my restaurant. I took a 3 man (2 hours each) job and cut it to 1 man (1.5 hour) job and the tile had never looked so good. The difficult part I have found is that restaurants require a system for cleanliness. Cost for frequency at even medium rates are sometimes impossible for operators to budget.

[Ron Musgraves 240]

How do you feel about the installation of the urethane grout versus standard black sanded grout? I am referring to dry time, clean up and how well it blends with the existing grout.

Funny thing, I first cleaned this urethane mess up and after a few years I ran into a contractor that had a nifty little trick.

I went and looked at the job and the grout was all over the tile. Sand grout it doesn’t mater because the grout doesn’t adhere to the ceramic that easily. This urethane is ridiculous. He spread this stuff all over the tile. I couldn’t even see the tile, I thought big dollars and what a mess. He had used a candle wax on the tiles first. This job came clean ten times faster and looked 300% better than any other I had done.

Urethane is rated 4000 to 6000 PSi regular sand is 2000psi

Acid is the bets thing to clean grout. Caustic will also be a safer choice in side and area that’s not ventilated.

Grout will be missing in the dish rooms and near milk machines. Lactose is deadly on grout. Grease is the third reason grout repair guys stay in business.

[MMI Enterprises 289]

They also have a few brands of seal made to prevent stickage that ya can spray on or mop down over at the local HD... Cheapo Behr is one they got for such construction protection. After grouting such stuff can be stripped off or left for a fair to good seal for the business opening..

[Integrity Curb Appeal 64]

I use as little pressure as possible, mainly b/c you really don't know how good the grout or installation is. You can be cruising along and blow out a section of grout. But don't panic...it's not difficult to replace. The key is to inspect the area and expect it from some areas and inform the customer. Bill accordingly.

I inspect the area(s) before cleaning and look for anything that might be a problem. I do minor tile repair (some has turned into major repairs b/c of it was just needed...not b/c of highpressure) and regrouting.

I have developed a procedure, that even "tile isntallers" do not go to this much detail, for restaurants and use materials that are epoxy modified and really last.

I just did one last night, in a cooler of a Lone Star. If you don't mind the night life, there is good niche for interior tile cleaning for restaurants.

This morning I confirmed another Red Lobster for a complete interior cleaning of thekitchen and prep areas (no hoods), floors, walls, under equipment, sanitization...

This is the niche I am interested in, do you mind if I give you a call sometime with a few questions? Ifyou don't mind, when is a good time to call?

Thanks,

Scott

[Jesse 15]

How do you feel about the installation of the urethane grout versus standard black sanded grout? I am referring to dry time, clean up and how well it blends with the existing grout.

Funny thing, I first cleaned this urethane mess up and after a few years I ran into a contractor that had a nifty little trick.

I went and looked at the job and the grout was all over the tile. Sand grout it doesn’t mater because the grout doesn’t adhere to the ceramic that easily. This urethane is ridiculous. He spread this stuff all over the tile. I couldn’t even see the tile, I thought big dollars and what a mess. He had used a candle wax on the tiles first. This job came clean ten times faster and looked 300% better than any other I had done.

Urethane is rated 4000 to 6000 PSi regular sand is 2000psi

Candle wax?! I never would have thought of that. I used an admix 1 time on my very first regrout job in a Perkins Restuarant job. What a nightmare! That stuff is still on the tile face.

I will try these sealing ideas before grouting and hopefully have a much easier cleanup time.

[Ron Musgraves 240]

That's a great thread here sir, we love to read it, very informative although, and we hope you'll share more posts like this in future too. And thanks you for sharing your thoughts. I want to read all about cleaning stuff.

It is a great thread