PLD 14 Report post Posted March 3, 2006 I've been using a 15:1 proportioner and mixing my local chems 4gal bleach to 1 gal chems. Works good, but I'd like a better performing "soap". Hence, I'm strongly considering a to change to citracleen. Now for my problem, most recipes I've seen for Citracleen call for 1/2-1 gal CC to 1 gal bleach. That will whack my ratios pretty bad and cause me to back to no proportioner. I really don't want to do that because a 15gal bucket stinks to lug about. Can I mix the citracleen mix kit into 1/2-1/4 the water and use it in 1/4 the recommended amount? If not, any comments as to why that might assist my quest for lighter buckets? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ParadiseProWash 14 Report post Posted March 3, 2006 I've been using a 15:1 proportioner and mixing my local chems 4gal bleach to 1 gal chems. Works good, but I'd like a better performing "soap". Hence, I'm strongly considering a to change to citracleen. Now for my problem, most recipes I've seen for Citracleen call for 1/2-1 gal CC to 1 gal bleach. That will whack my ratios pretty bad and cause me to back to no proportioner. I really don't want to do that because a 15gal bucket stinks to lug about.Can I mix the citracleen mix kit into 1/2-1/4 the water and use it in 1/4 the recommended amount? If not, any comments as to why that might assist my quest for lighter buckets? You mix 1/2 gallon of CC and 1 gallon of 10.5% sodium hypochlorite in a 5 gallon bucket and finish filling the bucket up with water then X-Jet with no proportioners. That is the recommended mix you can change it up to meet your needs but it has always worked fine for me. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
PLD 14 Report post Posted March 3, 2006 I'm ok with the mix ratios. It's just the no proportioner (i.e. lots of solution) that I don't like. Wide open, you're looking at 2-3 buckets (10-15 gal) per house. With a 15:1 proportioner I make one 5 gal bucket of 12% and use about 1/2-2/3 of a bucket per house. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
PLD 14 Report post Posted March 7, 2006 From the silence, I assume that Citraclean = open proportioner if you're using an x-jet. Any downstreamers using citraclean? How do you make it work with the 10:1 ratio most good downstreamers offer? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
PressurePros 249 Report post Posted March 7, 2006 I know this isn't the question you asked but with those type of dilution ratios why not consider downstreaming. You wouldn't have to shut off the downstreamer, you just switch to the X-Jet to rinse. OOPS, posted before I read the above. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Chappy 138 Report post Posted March 7, 2006 I have to say that unless the house is really, really bad, citracleen isnt necessary. just an added expense. Ive done some pretty bad houses with just some dawn added to my pool shock. just use a stronger ratio of pool shock and the x-jet and go to town. I dont use the downstreamer since I run 2-300ft of hose and it wont draw at all. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
CCPC 26 Report post Posted March 7, 2006 I have to say that unless the house is really, really bad, citracleen isnt necessary. just an added expense. Ive done some pretty bad houses with just some dawn added to my pool shock. just use a stronger ratio of pool shock and the x-jet and go to town. I dont use the downstreamer since I run 2-300ft of hose and it wont draw at all. I've heard others say this also, that they can't draw chemical with as little as 200' of hose. I wonder why? I just started downstreaming again a couple of weeks ago, and I can easily pull chem with 250' of hose. I've haven't had an occasion where I needed more hose than that yet, so I'm not sure if that's the limit or not. anybody have any ideas why some can pull chem with 250' and others have a hard time pulling chem with as little as 150' ? PSI maybe? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
PLD 14 Report post Posted March 8, 2006 I know this isn't the question you asked but with those type of dilution ratios why not consider downstreaming. You wouldn't have to shut off the downstreamer, you just switch to the X-Jet to rinse. I'm seriously considering it. I've been running 13:1 proportioner and washing a house with about 2-3 gal of 12% NaHClO. Works great. Put 1 gal of soap and 4.5 gal of 12% in a pail and go. If I'm so happy, why switch? My present soap does a good job, but leaves something to be desired with post-wash gloss, window streaking, and gutter streaks. Apparently CC handles all three of these well, so I wanted to give it a try. The biggest problem I see is that at recommended ratios CC drops my in the bucket ratio to 6-7.5% (vs 10.5 with my mix). Hence, I need a 8-10:1 ratio for a CC & bleach bucket (no water). Since the xjet only offers 13:1 (too thin), 6.5:1, or open, it appears that heavy buckets with gallons of unneccessary water and CitraClean are joined at the hip. Anyone know how to get 10:1 from an xjet at 5.5gpm? As you mentioned, I can downstream at 10:1 Why am I not already downstreaming? Ignorance. I've only done it once for about a week and the experience was abysmal. Ratio's too low, dial-a-guess numbering, long clearing times, corroded QC's. I'm certainly open to thoughts. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
CCPC 26 Report post Posted March 8, 2006 I've never used Citracleen, but here's my thoughts from what I've read. First of all to Phillip, obviously since I've never used it, I can't help with your proportional problem, but if you don't mind I'm going to hijack breifly. The word is, from many on this bbs that sware by CC, that CC is undoubtably a great product, and does nothing short of perform miracles in the way of house surficants. My way of thinking is, it may infact be an outstanding product, but for three times the cost per average house wash compared to other house soaps that may not be quite as good, but still offer great results, I wonder if the extra cost is worth it. Now if you were cleaning the worst of the worst day in and day out, maybe I can see the benifit, but when considering, that for most of us, 4 out of 5 house washes aren't absoultly filthy, you're essentially using more product than most jobs warrent. If a house wash soap such as emulsifer plus can provide excellent results on 92% of a given house, and Citracleen can provide excellent results on 96% of the same given house, what have I really gained? I used a product that's costing me three times as much to aid in making a noticeable difference to 4% of the exterior. It seem more economical to use the cheaper good soap on all the exteriors, and then spot clean the few stuborn areas when needed. I guess my point is, it's been my experience that with many of the quailty house wash soaps on the market, most will provide the same results to 90% of a given exterior, and it's only the other tough areas that make a product like Citracleen stand out a bit, so it seem like a waste to use the more expensive product to simply increase resluts in a few tough areas. A good example would be like using three times your normal amount of chlorine in your house wash solution just to make sure you get good results on one small spot of heavy algea. That's what pump ups are for. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ParadiseProWash 14 Report post Posted March 8, 2006 I'm ok with the mix ratios. It's just the no proportioner (i.e. lots of solution) that I don't like. Wide open, you're looking at 2-3 buckets (10-15 gal) per house. With a 15:1 proportioner I make one 5 gal bucket of 12% and use about 1/2-2/3 of a bucket per house. I havent been on in a while but here is the reason for the open proportioner for me. Time is money the faster I can get chems on the surface the faster I can clean it the faster I get paid. From pull up to leave on a 2500 sq ft house is about 1.5 hrs for me. The extra chems pay for themselves in time savings which equals more money in your pocket. We have a lot of mobile homes around here double wides with vinyl siding from pull up to drive off less than an hour for around $130.00. If I were to downstream or use the proportioners I could not do it in that amount of time. When I pull up I mix my chems in five gallon buckets and place them around the house then when I get to where Im going they are already there so its a smooth motion and you never have to walk back and forth or cut the machine off. I hope this helps from my perspective. My Mix in a 5 gallon bucket 1/2 gallon Citra Cleen = $2.72 a gallon = $1.36 per bucket 1 gallon 10.5% sodium hypochlorite =$0.90 a gallon a dash of wet wax = $0.30 a dash of rinse aid = $0.25 a dash of foamer for the cling time = $0.40. Less than $3.21 a bucket x 3 buckets on a mobile home = $9.63 worth of chems and I gross $130.00 I dont see it as wasting I see it as time management and making over $100.00 hr to boot. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Jim Carroll 14 Report post Posted March 9, 2006 dude when I wash houses I use 12% and dawn, windows are clean and house is clean. and i use proportioners also. and you don't have to lug around much chemicals. I actually use a 15 gallon drum and pull it around with my hand truck. I have 50 ft 3/8 air hose on my xjet, that combined with the distance from the xjet you can cover a house pretty quick. let me figure the math and I think I can tell you how to get to 10:1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Jim Carroll 14 Report post Posted March 9, 2006 doolittle if you have your proportioner pack it has a list of colors and the corresponding drill bit size, I am guessing that you could get the size in between the two you are using and possibly get close. I got tired of buying those bags of proportioners so I started drilling out all the ones that you don't use to correspond with the ones that I use. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
PLD 14 Report post Posted March 9, 2006 I havent been on in a while but here is the reason for the open proportioner for me. Time is money the faster I can get chems on the surface the faster I can clean it the faster I get paid. You and I agree that time is money, but disagree on proportioners. I do the same thing, but because of the proportioner I use one 5 gallon pail. No time wasted making three buckets and standing there filling buckets with water. The extra chems pay for themselves in time savings which equals more money in your pocket. We have a lot of mobile homes around here double wides with vinyl siding from pull up to drive off less than an hour for around $130.00. Proportioners or not, the chem usage remains the same. The only thing that changes is how much the solution is diluted before If I were to downstream or use the proportioners I could not do it in that amount of time. Perhaps not while downstreaming. Or at least that's my impression which is why I am asking about it. Since I'm ignorant about it, please elaborate how/why it is slower. Proportioners slower? They only affect the amount of water in the bucket. Less water = less time filling buckets. i.e. proportioners serve to speed the process, not slow it down. 5 gal bucket w/ bleach, add chems, work from the same 5 gals bucket for the whole house and have some left over. If the house is a smaller ranch style house, you can often do 2 from one bucket. When I pull up I mix my chems in five gallon buckets and place them around the house then when I get to where Im going they are already there so its a smooth motion and you never have to walk back and forth or cut the machine off. I hope this helps from my perspective. That's what I was doing pre-proportioners. That and a 15gal on a hand cart. Now I just mix one bucket and go. Citraclean is throwing a wrench into my process, hence the thread. My Mix in a 5 gallon bucket 1/2 gallon Citra Cleen = $2.72 a gallon = $1.36 per bucket 1 gallon 10.5% sodium hypochlorite =$0.90 a gallon a dash of wet wax = $0.30 a dash of rinse aid = $0.25 a dash of foamer for the cling time = $0.40. Less than $3.21 a bucket x 3 buckets on a mobile home = $9.63 worth of chems and I gross $130.00 I dont see it as wasting I see it as time management and making over $100.00 hr to boot. Time to prepare/fill 3 buckets vs time to prepare one? Take your mix for example: 1 gal bleach @10.5% = 2% in the bucket. 2% thru the xjet = 0.66% TTW 0.5 gal CC 0.5 gallons other stuff. Now 3 gallons water. Repeat 2x. My thoughts (the reason for this thread): one bucket 0.5 gallons other stuff. 1.5 gal citraclean 3 gals 12% = 7.2% in the bucket. 7.2% thru a 10:1 proportioner = 0.65% TTW 7.2% thru a 6.5:1 proportioner = 0.96% TTW Add no water, do not repeat. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ParadiseProWash 14 Report post Posted March 9, 2006 I understand your point now about mixing stronger and using the proportioner. I guess if that is how you like doing it keep doing it that way. My choice for no proportioner is that I can go from one type of cleaning to another type that would take a different mix ratio and mix differently in my bucket instead of changing out a proportioner. For instance I can wash a house and strip a deck both with my X-Jet and mix differntly in my bucket and never slow down. Then I can clean some concrete with a differnt mix in my bucket. I guess you can do the same thing using the same proportioner. I just have all my mixes figured without one. Same general idea just another way of doing it. The thing I dont like about downstreaming is the walk back to the machine to get the little hose out I may be 200' from the machine when I need to pull the hose plus you have all that chem in the high pressure line that you have to clear before you can goto water and you still have to change that nozzle out. I use my X-Jet 100% of the time for applying chems be it long range with it open or close up with the close range nozzle. Just for refferance Im not arguing just having a conversation and showing how I do it. If someone finds something that works keep doing it. It's no secret that myself and Steve Rowlett are very close friends and that all my knowledge on chemicals came from him. Thats the way I was taught and thats the way I do it. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
B AND C PW 14 Report post Posted July 1, 2007 Can someone tell me where I can buy Citra Cleen? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Deck Guy 14 Report post Posted July 1, 2007 Almost all chem vendors have some version of it with similar sounding names, but they vary in strength. I think Rowletts Pressure Cleaning has some of the strongest. And I think his is actually called Citriclean. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
MMI Enterprises 289 Report post Posted July 1, 2007 In rereading this...all the lugging around and proportioning is so unattractive to me. BTW, what exactly is the main ingredients in the citraclean?..OJ?..might get thirsty whilest on the job.. :) Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Ron Musgraves 240 Report post Posted July 1, 2007 Pressure Washing Institute - Search Results those threads above have additional info about the chemical also. *** has a forum about the chemical at the bottom of teh board. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
MMI Enterprises 289 Report post Posted July 1, 2007 Ron, thanx but the link to your search comes up notta..and where do you mean at bottom of board?..You refering to the 'chemical discussion-contractor only' drop down menu? I want info handy without wading through heaps of stuff and I would also like some your best recipe listings for house washes and the like. I compile for my own use and someday I may stick them up on one of these boards... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Ron Musgraves 240 Report post Posted July 1, 2007 Yellowing Vinyl Question - Pressure Washing Institute Favorite Soap - Pressure Washing Institute Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Ron Musgraves 240 Report post Posted July 1, 2007 Chemicals, Product & Equipment Testimonials, - Pressure Washing Institute thats the chemical discussion area Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
MMI Enterprises 289 Report post Posted July 1, 2007 No on the testimonial link Ron..... thinks I like the one I mentioned..lol.. Chemical Discussion - For Contractors Only - Pressure Washing Institute Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Chemical Doctor 15 Report post Posted April 14, 2013 I'm seriously considering it. I've been running 13:1 proportioner and washing a house with about 2-3 gal of 12% NaHClO. Works great. Put 1 gal of soap and 4.5 gal of 12% in a pail and go.If I'm so happy, why switch? My present soap does a good job, but leaves something to be desired with post-wash gloss, window streaking, and gutter streaks. Apparently CC handles all three of these well, so I wanted to give it a try. The biggest problem I see is that at recommended ratios CC drops my in the bucket ratio to 6-7.5% (vs 10.5 with my mix). Hence, I need a 8-10:1 ratio for a CC & bleach bucket (no water). Since the xjet only offers 13:1 (too thin), 6.5:1, or open, it appears that heavy buckets with gallons of unneccessary water and CitraClean are joined at the hip. Anyone know how to get 10:1 from an xjet at 5.5gpm? As you mentioned, I can downstream at 10:1 Why am I not already downstreaming? Ignorance. I've only done it once for about a week and the experience was abysmal. Ratio's too low, dial-a-guess numbering, long clearing times, corroded QC's. I'm certainly open to thoughts. X-Jer is a 2:1 ratio, that is why I pre-mix the formula. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Chemical Doctor 15 Report post Posted April 14, 2013 Can someone tell me where I can buy Citra Cleen? I have the original Citracleen and it is listed on our website below. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Chemical Doctor 15 Report post Posted July 10, 2013 I'm ok with the mix ratios. It's just the no proportioner (i.e. lots of solution) that I don't like. Wide open, you're looking at 2-3 buckets (10-15 gal) per house. With a 15:1 proportioner I make one 5 gal bucket of 12% and use about 1/2-2/3 of a bucket per house. You are applying too much or you are cleaning very large houses. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
