Surface Cleaner: Wheels vs. Floater

[HotShot 34]

I have a 3000 psi, 5 gpm hot water unit. I will be doing a lot of driveways, drive-thrus, dumpster areas and sidewalks. I need to get my surface cleaner soon, and I've read most of the threads on here about them. My question is what benefits do the wheeled cleaners have over the floaters? And which, in your guys' experience would work best in my situation?

I was looking at the "Big Guy" and the original floater. From all of the past posts it looked like everybody counted the caster models out. Why?

I know it's kind of a lot of questions, but your help is appreciated...

[One Tough Pressure 580]

http://forums.thegrimescene.com/search.php?searchid=174540

[ken wiggins 14]

I'm new to the biz, but JLPW put me on the BIG GUY 30. I have done 7 jobs within the last 3 weeks. It is the best piece of equipment I've bought. EASY MONEY, GREAT TIME SAVER.

[HotShot 34]

http://forums.thegrimescene.com/search.php?searchid=174540

link doesn't work....

Ken.....Is your pw also 5gpm and 3000psi?

[Craig 111]

My personal favorite is the Landa Water Jet. Its adjustable height (from aggressive to non-aggressive) is indispensible on many jobs and performance is good. The handle on the side is useless but you can plumb it so it's independant of the cleaner. We also have a hydrotek (twister) and a steel eagle, which are all wheeled units.

[One Tough Pressure 580]

Strange it worked earlier. Click on search and type in "Surface Cleaners". There are 5+ pages of threads that will answer all the questions on various types.

Maybe it will work this time http://forums.thegrimescene.com/search.php?searchid=174651

[Barry M 73]

I'm new to the biz, but JLPW put me on the BIG GUY 30. I have done 7 jobs within the last 3 weeks. It is the best piece of equipment I've bought. EASY MONEY, GREAT TIME SAVER.

Ken, how many gpm is your unit? Curious.

[HotShot 34]

Thanks Craig....that is exactly what Ron recommended as well.

Alan....link still doesn't work :) but that's ok, I did a search and that is what has me so confused. 10 people say this one, 10 people say that one. I think what I'm going to have to do is start off with a wheel unit, then eventually buy the hover type as well. Do you think it would be better to start with the wheeled unit in my case?

[Russ Spence 76]

my next one will be the landa water jet ,it is awesome

[Littlefield 65]

I've used both, Ilike the wheeled ones

[One Tough Pressure 580]

Do you think it would be better to start with the wheeled unit in my case?

My opinion is that the wheeled units rock, and I own both. A wheeled unit can be tilted back so that it does not bottom out on uneven concrete such as driveways, and handicap access curbs.

You can lift the handle, ride on the front caster and go sideways just like a castered or hover unit, and they are so easy to push around.

I use the 24" Steel Eagle, and the only other way I would have it, would be to get a 30" Steel Eagle.

Casters on most units are cheap and fail more often than you would like. The front caster on the Steel Eagle has never let me down, and it has been around the block many times. You can get it with the Deublin Rotary Union, which is the same that the Landa Water Jet uses. I have no use for an adjustable like the Landa, as it will not fit under many things that I clean such as benches.

We ought to meet up and you can play with my Steel Eagle. I am less than 2 hours away in Simi Valley.

[HotShot 34]

We ought to meet up and you can play with my Steel Eagle. I am less than 2 hours away in Simi Valley.

cool....that's the answer that I was looking for :) Absolutely we should meet up. I'm a total newbie at the pressure washing biz. I mean, I have a pressure washer that I use for cleaning hoods, but it's a totally different ballgame. Name the time and place, and count me in....well, I'll actually have to check my schedule, but if it's during the daytime, I'm usually pretty open.

Littlefield and Russ...thanks guys for the replies also.

[HotShot 34]

Well, got my Steel Eagle 24" ordered....can't wait to get it and have Alan show me how to use it :)

[Christopher 102]

The Steel Eagle 24" is a good choice. I would not recommend The Big Guy unless you have a bigger machine like 7-10 gpm. It will work but it needs more gallons per minute to go faster even with the same pressure. The Wheel units are great but if you start doing a lot of jobs with obstacles like posts, equipment, etc.... A hover type like the Whisper Wash Classic 19" is great. I actually use it more than my Steel Eagle 24" depending on what kind of job it is. When your machine gets here and you have made some money with it, order a set of spray bars because when not if you hit something that you did not see, it will bend them or bust out the spray nozzle and the machine will not work at all. It has happened to several of us out here. You need to figure out how you want your equipment plumbed for speed and efficiency. I have a 3/8" Plug on the end of my hose, 3/8" Coupler on the inlet of my Gun, 1/4" plug on the outlet of the gun, and on the lances, surface cleaners, extendawands I have 1/4" couplers. I do this so I can use the gun like a ball valve so I can switch from different tools without having to slow down and turn off the machine to switch from the lance to surface cleaner or lance to extendawand or lance to dual-lance. You will need to order couplers, plugs, and most important----O-Rings. Keep these on hand at all times. I personally know of 2 people that had to shut down a job and wait until morning or until Monday morning till the local shop opened to get a 15 cent O-Ring. Keep a lot of these with you at all times so you do not end up looking like these guys. Check around and get acquainted with the parts stores both locally and online. I can personally recommend Pressure Tek, Water Cannon, Easy Clean Systems, and Steve Rowlett. All these people have experience and give excellent service along with opinions based on experience. Hope this helps.

[HotShot 34]

Chris....thanks for the advice, experienced first hand knowledge is always appreciated :)

I will probably get a hover type eventually, but it will probably be the recovery type for inside jobs.

[PLD 14]

I agree with Chris. For optimum results, surface cleaners should be matched to the pump. That said, I'll share my experiences and solicit others input about my setup/situation. Hopefully Anthony and I can learn from my experience.

I started with a cold 4gpm machine and 27" hydrotec. MUCH better than wanding. Striping was prevalent, and 2-3 passes was normal. Pre-bleaching was a must.

Next I got my 5.5/hot water/big guy. Boy was I the man. One pass, no bleach results. Perhaps it was the newness of hot water and the vast improvement over previous results, but as time passed speed dropped and 2 passed became the norm again. Today, when I compare my sq.ft./hr (1-1.5k) to someit isn't all that great. Just based on speed, I began suspecting pump issues, replaced nozzles, etc. but have not been able to identify specific issues.

This week, I needed/wanted a floater for a 2nd floor hotel walkway that was only 4ft wide. I supported my local vendor (i.e. overpaid) and got a whirl-a-way/BE 16" floater. After outfitting it with 2.0's I hooked it up to the 4gpm machine and started a test. My helper and I each did 2500ft with the big guy (5.5, cold) and with the floater (4, cold). We both did some work upstairs (railing, hence more condusive to floater) and downstairs (8ft, advantage big guy). I did NOT tell my helper it was a test. Afterwards, I inquired as to which was faster. He indicated that the floater was definitely faster. Much to my suprise, I had thought the same thing but believed it to be prejudices in favor of the new eqpt.

[Mike Williamson 198]

The Steel Eagle 24" is a good choice. I would not recommend The Big Guy unless you have a bigger machine like 7-10 gpm. It will work but it needs more gallons per minute to go faster even with the same pressure.

Actually, that's not true. The 28" spray bar on the big guy is lighter than the spray bar/manifold assembly on a 24" Steel Eagle. Thus, it takes LESS force to get it spinning. The weight of the spray arm is the only reason a larger surface cleaner wouldn't work as well with a smaller machine.

I use a big guy every day on a 5.6gpm machine and it works better than the steel eagle I sold after I bought the Big Guy!

If I had enough large concrete areas to clean regularly, I'd get a WhisperWash Maxima (36"). If you've never seen this in person, it is HUGE!

http://www.whisperwash.com/Whisper_Wash%AE_Maxima36/16578/Whisper_Wash%AE_Maxima36.htm

I would, however, have to modify it with a Big Guy handle and wheel assembly. Casters just suck!

[PLD 14]

Actually, that's not true. The 28" spray bar on the big guy is lighter than the spray bar/manifold assembly on a 24" Steel Eagle. Thus, it takes LESS force to get it spinning. The weight of the spray arm is the only reason a larger surface cleaner wouldn't work as well with a smaller machine.

For a balanced spray bar, the weight of the spray arm is irrelevant once it has achieved steady state rotation. For any given surface cleaner, the rotational speed of the spray arm is a balance between the slowing forces of spinner drag and fluid (air/water) drag on the bar, and the accellerating force (thrust) provided by the water/tips.

Assuming 3500psi operation and the same surface cleaner for both machines, the only variables are nozzle size and mass flow. Both are linearly correlated to thrust. Hence, a smaller gpm machine will always have a slower rotational speed that a larger gpm machine for any given SC. And pressure cleaning is all about energy/(sq.ft *minute). Increase the numerator or decrease the denominator, and the cleaning improves. Decrease the numerator or increase the denominator and the cleaning suffers.

[Mike Williamson 198]

For a balanced spray bar, the weight of the spray arm is irrelevant once it has achieved steady state rotation. For any given surface cleaner, the rotational speed of the spray arm is a balance between the slowing forces of spinner drag and fluid (air/water) drag on the bar, and the accellerating force (thrust) provided by the water/tips.

Assuming 3500psi operation and the same surface cleaner for both machines, the only variables are nozzle size and mass flow. Both are linearly correlated to thrust. Hence, a smaller gpm machine will always have a slower rotational speed that a larger gpm machine for any given SC. And pressure cleaning is all about energy/(sq.ft *minute). Increase the numerator or decrease the denominator, and the cleaning improves. Decrease the numerator or increase the denominator and the cleaning suffers.

Gotcha! Thanks for setting me straight!

[PWkid 79]

I agree with Mike I use a 36" maxima and a 28" big guy and they are very nice machines.

[Mike Williamson 198]

I agree with Mike I use a 36" maxima and a 28" big guy and they are very nice machines.

How do you like the Maxima, with the casters and all?

[Barry M 73]

Can I butt in here and ask a question guys? I run a 4gpm cold unit and I'm looking to get a surface cleaner. Why is the price so different between the Whirl-a-way 20" hover ($395) and the Wisper Wash Classic hover 19" ($695)? These prices are from Higher Power Supplies. Thanks.

[Mike Williamson 198]

Can I butt in here and ask a question guys? I run a 4gpm cold unit and I'm looking to get a surface cleaner. Why is the price so different between the Whirl-a-way 20" hover ($395) and the Wisper Wash Classic hover 19" ($695)? These prices are from Higher Power Supplies. Thanks.

Quality! Better parts. More dependable.

[VanDiesel99 14]

What I haven't been able to understand is why those big surfacers don't come with 4bar spinners rather than just a 2bar(or cross versus single bar). Obviously a 4 bar 4 nozzle assembly would clean faster than a two bar(and this would defeat the problem of not being able to spin that one bar fast enough to keep up with zebra striping. Any ideas?

[Barry M 73]

Quality! Better parts. More dependable.

Okay, I guess that's what I expected to hear thanks Mike. Do you think the cheaper Whirl-a-way is a good unit to start out with, for the price? What I'm looking for is a dependable spinner for under $500 that will run efficient with a 4gpm unit.

[PWkid 79]

The maxima is a 4 sprayer bar. The big guy is available in 2 or 4 bar sprayer. It is a matter of preference.Just think how a big mower works as long as it is moving it will cut grass as will a 2 bar sprayer will clean very well. Mike I love the casters it weighs like 38 lbs very light to move around ,it weighs I think 2 lbs less than the maxima.