New House Washing Set-Up

[Guest rfitz]

A few weeks ago I was driving to my next house washing job, when I heard a huge POP, and then it sounded like my tire was leaking really bad, then instantly my eyes were burning and I smelled a horrible chlorine like gas,

I instantly pulled over and realized the 5 gallon bucket I had mixed earlier for a house washing job, blew and split the 5 gallon bucket, I only had maybe 2 gallons of mix left, so needless to say, I will not mix the 2 again, so now my new house washing set up will be mounting 2 seperate tanks in my van, 1 for bleach and 1 for house washing soap, and run them off metering valves,

because every house wash is different any way, I will now be able to adjust accordingly.. Just thought I would warn people of this dangerous mixture

[One Tough Pressure 580]

What are you mixing with the Chlorine? In order to help, we need to know what did not get along in the bucket.

[Paul B. 523]

Alkaline type soap and chlorine mix will not do that as chlorine is also an alkaline. However, your mixed container should never be completely sealed. Need a small vent hole or safety relief type container.

When you mix Sodium Hydroxide from powder, you can feel the heat generated. In an enclosed container that heat can pressurizes a closed container. Mixed percarbonate should not be stored in a closed container as gases expand and can blow your container.

Sounds like an acid based cleaner was mixed with the chlorine (acid mixed with chlorine will create a poisonous gas).

This is why its important to know a little bit of chemistry in this business, rather than just getting someone to tell you what product to use. It is also important to have MSDS on your chemicals. The MSDS will tell you all toxic and hazardous contents and will provide you with a pH level. High pH 8 and above is Alkaline, 6 and below is Acid. Above all, read all labels on products you use for warnings and precautions.

Remember: "Safety First and Make IT Last!"

[bulletproof 14]

Paul ,those were some good points :groovy2: :groovy2:

[Guest rfitz]

The Cleaner I was using that particular day was a strong alkali, but also contained a little sodium hydroxide, that is why it probably blew,? also on a second note, does anyone use a rinse aid with their housewashing mix ? and if so, do you mix it in with your house mix, or do you have another bucket with water and rinse aid, and use when rinsing, lately, I am getting alot of soap scum on my windows and I am rinsing forever...? Paul what has been your best soap when mixed with bleach for house washing..? and a t what ratio..? I myself like downstreaming, but it is a drag going back and forth to my vehicle to pull the line turn off the cem injector, I may switch to a dual lance wand to eliminate this walking back and forth, as some of the houses I wash are huge and have huge lots, so it is a ton of wasted time walking back and forth

[Mike Cappa 14]

rinse aid, only sometimes. if you rinse the windows right after soaping them you shouldn't have a problem, that is unless you have hard water.

[Paul B. 523]

Bleach added to a strong alkaline detergent that also contains a small amount of Sodium Hydroxide would not have exploded like that. All those components are alkaline or base and on the same end of the pH scale. Must be something else that was added.

We've used SunBrite's AllBrite, Rowletts Citracleen, Hotsy's Ripper 1 and about 5 or 6 others.

Ripper I works well, but is expensive at $50 per 5 gallons (they say you can mix it 1:100 or 1:50 but the most effective strength for housewash was about 1:20 maybe 1:25). It's kind of expensive at $10 per undiluted gallon.

AllBrite works excellent and can also be used on gutters. For housewash, we mix it 1:25. With shipping, it runs under $6 per gallon (undiluted). It's an inexpensive gutter cleaner at 1:1 or 1:2 dilution since all others run over $10 per gallon.

Undiluted Citracleen runs about $3.25 per gallon with shipping (55 gallon kit). Mixed at 1:25 makes it very economical. We have not used it enough under all conditions to call it the one. Next year we will know for sure.

[Guest rfitz]

Paul, As a matter of fact the soap that was mixed with the bleach was very similar in make up as the all brite, I guess if its a butyl and bleach combo that is what makes it explosive..

[charlie 14]

Rob

I am glad you didn't get hurt. I have never of been a big fan of having a van as a work vehicle. The only vehicle I use is for my work vehicle is my Chevy S10 and I pull my washer behind it. In the bed I carry all my chemicals and extra pressure washer.

Charlie

[Paul B. 523]

Not very likely, Rob.

[ron p 500]

how close to a battery was the container of bleach?

if you put a closed container of bleach on a car battery it will blow up.

[Mike Williamson 198]

I have had a similar reaction when mixing a d-Limonene product with chlorine, though I've never had it blow like that. However, it was mixed in an open bucket. I got in a hurry and poured the chlorine into the bucket first (1 gallon), then the citrus cleaner (1 gallon), rather than water, citrus cleaner, then chlorine. I turned around to grab a bucket of soap mix to add to the mix and heard a whooshing sound. When I turned back around, the bucket was boiling over. When it stopped, there was about 1/2 a gallon of mix left in the bucket. I can imagine what it would have done if I'd had it capped. Even when mixing the citrus cleaner last, after diluting the chlorine with water, there's a reaction that produces heat. Learned my lesson that day! Just lucky it didn't boil over down the back of my legs.

[Paul B. 523]

Mixing Chlorine (which is an alkaline) with D-Limonene (an acidic solution) can cause a reaction like that. D-Limonene is a citrus acid, with stronger acids you will get a more violent and poisonous reaction.

It is important to read your labels!

...and never forget - "Safety First and Make IT Last!"

[Guest rfitz]

AS a nice safety measure, I poke a tiny air hole in all my conatiners now, because I have had alot of my chems swell up my 5 gallon jugs, chlorine alone, sodium percarb. alone, sodium hydroxide alone. etc..

[Paul B. 523]

ROB, ...ROB, ...ROB,

There is absolutely no need to vent your chlorine containers. They've been selling and storing chlorine in sealed containers for years without a problem (check your grocery stores).

By venting your container, you are letting the chlorine age (go flat) very quickly and escape into your airspace in the van.

Sodium percarb will only last a few hours after mixing. Your best results with it are to mix fresh on site. If you mix in the morning and plan to use it in the afternoon, you've wasted your money.

It works kind of like beer ..."once the lid is popped, it starts going flat."

HD-80 (for example) which is Sodium Hydroxide based crystal, can be pre-mixed and stored. If you are not mixing it on site, you should let it cool before you put a lid on it. Other Sodium Hydroxide based chemicals are always in stored containers and are not vented.

Other than mixing stronger acids with alkalines, it is most likely that your containers are swelling because of the heat in the van (enclosed van, summer sun, the heat generated from the P/W), not because of a chemical reaction.

If your still concerned, pressure relief valves are better than venting all your chemicals into the inside of your van. You could be in more danger as the escaping fumes intermix inside your van. Think of all the fume producing items you are enclosing in that van:

- Gasoline

- Diesel fuel

- Oil based stains

- Chlorine

- Sodium Hydroxide

- Stain soaked rags and brushes.

- Brush cleaning solutions

- Acids (battery and other chemicals)

Most likely, the only thing that is saving you is an open window or air conditioning. Think of all the possible long term harm you are causing yourself by breathing in those fumes.

Keep your chemicals out of sun-light and heat and away from open fires and sparks.

Think again very seriously before you start poking holes in your containers!

"Safety First and Make IT Last!"

[Guest rfitz]

Paul, I was told I can pre mix the percarbs, and they would last forever..? not true..? like you said earlier, labels or manufacturers lie or strectch the truth,?

anyhow, I will do as you say and mix percabs as I need them, thanks for the heads up on the chems...

[Mike Cappa 14]

nothing, and I repeat nothing will last forever.

[reed 500]

Rob, I bet it was the other "chems" you were using that you got from the neighbors METH lab, you guys in south county :D. Percarbs have a short shelf life, that is usually why they put a disclaimer on the labels of the percarbs to use withing 4 to 6 hours after mixing, plus some of the labes state do not store in a sealed container, cause when agitated just a little the chemical reaction takes place that causes it to give off gases and the result will be popping the lid at the least.

Rob, stay out of the Meth Labs :)

reed

[Guest rfitz]

Reed, Cant wait to show you my new monster Im having built, I will get it right after Xmas 8 GPM, 3000 PSI Honda 24 HP, all aluminum frame, all aluminum water tank, I also just bought a Hydrotech 5 GPM 3500 PSI cold water unit , just set it up today, nice little unit... Hopefully, we will have another roundtable at RW in Jan or Feb, I will show it to you then, THis fall has been unusually wet...??? But good for getting houses dirty right before the holidays....: )

[Mike Williamson 198]

An aluminum tank??? Is there a reason for that?

[Guest rfitz]

Actually, a very good reason, I am having a custom built system, specifically for my van, and by going with a hand made aluminum, we can make it verticle

so it takes up less space, etc.. not too mention It will last forever, and it looks great

[John T 744]

Riftz,

How about some pictures when your done. I like your idea about the custom made tank. What size aluminum tank are your getting and where are you getting it from??

[Guest rfitz]

Hi John,

I should have pics of it being built, assembled, and then when installed in the van, after Xmas but before Jan 1, as soon as its done I will post them

[MelissaMW 14]

Our water tank is stainless steel. Husband decided to go this way so that it would last. The other one, I don't remember what it was made from :( but he'd be getting in there to weld because of leaks. Now he doesn't have to. You have to remember though, this is on the big truck. We use plastic tanks for the pickup and portable units.

[John T 744]

Melissa,

How about some pictures of yours and your husbands set-ups??

It would be great for others to see how you guys set up your rigs. Like they say a picture is worth a 1000 words....I think thats how that saying goes:confused:

[MelissaMW 14]

I couldn't figure out how to post it here, so I put it under the scrap book.

http://www.thegrimescene.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=1089