EFC-38 for cleaning

[Tonyg 14]

I have a couple of decks over water that have an existing stain with just some mildew and soil. Normally I would just use a house wash for a maintenance cleaning but I didn't want to use anything with phosphates or SH.

I planned to use EFC-38 to clean and kill the mildew because I wanted a percarb with surficants. Does the EFC-38 have too much stripper to do a maintenance clean on the existing stain?

Any other suggestions?

[big mike 14]

Tony,

Your best bet for mold & mildew will still be SH. Your going to have to use some creative plastic use to keep it out of the water. The EFC-38 (percarb) will still affect organisms in the water and you should avoid ANY cleaner getting in there. Percarb will strip some finishes (especially penetrating oil types). The only method you can use without protecting the water, is to use only water (not real effective). Price these decks accordingly.

[James 625]

Some areas let you use bleach because it will get so diluted and disperse in the water it has no effect on the environment. You can wet the deck down and use some heat to remove the dirt and mildew. 125 degrees.

[big mike 14]

Yes, Jim is right about warm (not hot) water. I just assumed that most woodies don't carry hot water rigs to deck jobs. Bleach is the ticket if you can get away with it.

[charlie 14]

Check with the dnr and get a clearence letter from them to do the job. You will have to probley have to get a label and msds sheets for them. Is there anyway the decks can be removed then you can do what you want.

[Beth n Rod 1,279]

I have a couple of decks over water that have an existing stain with just some mildew and soil. Normally I would just use a house wash for a maintenance cleaning but I didn't want to use anything with phosphates or SH.

I planned to use EFC-38 to clean and kill the mildew because I wanted a percarb with surficants. Does the EFC-38 have too much stripper to do a maintenance clean on the existing stain?

Any other suggestions?

We used to use quite a bit of EFC for maintenance cleaning, but it does have pretty decent stripping capabilities, and at times more than we wanted it to. It is not a true percarb... we switched over a year ago...

For killing mold or mildew, you need a percarb or as Jim says a very diluted bleach. If you don't want to remove the coating and are planning on just a light maintenance coat of sealer, don't strip it.

Beth

[Tonyg 14]

We used to use quite a bit of EFC for maintenance cleaning, but it does have pretty decent stripping capabilities, and at times more than we wanted it to. It is not a true percarb... we switched over a year ago...

For killing mold or mildew, you need a percarb or as Jim says a very diluted bleach. If you don't want to remove the coating and are planning on just a light maintenance coat of sealer, don't strip it.

Beth

Thanks all,

I will put in a call to the VB Environmental Mgt today to make sure since this is on the Chesapeake Bay watershed. I think I will go with a basic percarb and some slightly warm water (although this would be a first I think with a secure stain I will feel better). This is an existing stain and the stripping potential from EFC-38 scares me a bit as I do not intend on staining the decks.

[Beth n Rod 1,279]

Be prepared to be told you have to use only water, and that you have to reclaim all of it.

Beth

[Henry Bockman 14]

If the sealer on the decks is oil based you might create a small oil slick. I'd be careful about anything getting in the water, if oil from the sealer gets in the water and drifts on to the yacht next door you could have some real unhappy locals that may report you for violating the Clean Water Act. I'm suprised that DNR would give you a letter approving you to do the job. Even plain water with no chems is going to break free some of the oil and other chems from the lumber and dump it into the bay.

Personally, I'd pass on the job, I don't want that kind of media coverage...

[charlie 14]

DNR gave me a clearence letter. I used water to clean, waterbase to treat with a tarp under the pier to prevent treatment from going in river. When I do piers we do it this way or they remove it and we do it on land at least 100 ft away.

[plainpainter 217]

efc-38 has more phosphates than it does percarbs. Frankly I never saw much fizz action - oxiclean does a better job!

[Tonyg 14]

Well, I was initially more concerned about damaging the existing stain with the stripper in EFC-38, I did follow up with our DEQ (DNR) about the enviromental issues.

Their stance is that can't authorize or advise in any way because even using straight water is a contaminent because our local water has chlorine and other additives. These are two "decks" that extend over the water and not docks. The house is surrounded by water on three sides with no boats (and no immediate neighbors) and belongs to a widow. Disassembling or lifting them and moving them 100yds is a little... uh... crazy?

Unofficially they said someone is going to end up cleaning them and would probably be far less responsible. Not saying to do irt or not, or what to use or not. If there were a fish kill or other major impact I would be responsible but other than that they are aware this activity is happening every day and they can't regulate that.

IF I still decide to do them I will spot them with a percarb (not EFC-38) and a little warm water as recommended above. The stain is tight so a quick wash with a little pressure should be fine.

Dan, I think I remember the MSDS for the EFC-38 said it was 70% sodium percarbonate.

Thanks all!

[RPetry 564]

Tony,

Typical gov't response.

Straight sodium percarbonate breaks down into, if I recall correctly, hydrogen peroxide and soda ash. May want to check out the chemistry, but I think both are not harmful to the environment.

If you want to protect the existing stain, just apply the percarb, at maybe 3 - 4 oz. per gal. of water, let it dwell for 10 minutes, and scrub easy with a soft brush on a pole, and hose rinse off.

[charlie 14]

I guess I am lucky.

[Celeste 341]

It's not just the cleaners that are the concern for getting back into the system, but what is taken off - most of the time, THAT is worse than what you use to clean with!

[Chappy 138]

Whenever Im doing a dock, i use floating oilsorbant booms. They arent goint to soak up old stain or the bleach but do a fine job controlling the oil. I still havnt figured out how to get a tarp under a dock to catch everything.

[SawtoothLogRestoration 14]

So what if someone was trying to strip the stain from a dock? Is there an environmentally friendly stripper (haha)? I think I'll stick with media blasting. From the sounds of all the experiences here, stripping over a lake, especially one like Lake Lure, is a pita.

[Beth n Rod 1,279]

Brent,

The debris from a blast should not enter the water either, and on a board, I would not suggest blasting. Just my .02....

Beth

[SawtoothLogRestoration 14]

Beth,

You think dealing with a liquid over a liquid would be easier than a solid? The builder asked about blasting, I suggested chemical. The environmental guru for Lake Lure was not excited about chemicals of any kind around the lake.

[Beth n Rod 1,279]

And the debris from a blast will not be allowed by the EPA either. It contains pollutants and contaminants that can't reach the water. Docks are a pain in the backside.

Beth