PressurePros 248 Report post Posted September 24, 2009 Small deck nothing big other than being a solid stain strip P.I.T.A So far so good. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
0 PressurePros 248 Report post Posted September 24, 2009 Here is where it gets interesting. Customer didn't like yellow appearance of Cedar semi trans (spindles were clear cedar) so we added Rustic brown 1:3 Went back to look at the deck after 10 days of cure time and this is how it looks. Its like the yellow transoxide said "F.U" to the brown. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
0 PressurePros 248 Report post Posted September 24, 2009 I'm just pulling your leg. That above picture is not doctored, its just a trick of the sunlight on the transoxide pigment. Here is the way the deck actually looks. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
0 plainpainter 217 Report post Posted September 24, 2009 Very Interesting. Perhaps next time a 50/50 mix - and just let the customer know it's going to lighten up the way they want? I think Beth had a good mix - I believe it was mixed with the toner? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
0 plainpainter 217 Report post Posted September 24, 2009 *******...you tricked me. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
0 plainpainter 217 Report post Posted September 25, 2009 Here is a deck I just finished a couple of days ago used 50/50 mix of Sierra Redwood and Rustic Brown - Mahogany Decking and Cedar Balusters. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
0 PressurePros 248 Report post Posted September 25, 2009 I have 2 new construction cedar decks we'll be doing this weekend. I'm gonna find a sweet blend. Both are getting Armstrong. I want to give the product one last serious look and test out over the winter before I decide what to do in '10. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
0 plainpainter 217 Report post Posted September 25, 2009 Ken here is my deck from another angle....I think in the photo the red is a little harsh - it seems like the Sierra Redwood knocked out Rustic Brown. But I think it will tone down - I will take another photo this weekend. But it doesn't look as red in real life as it does in the photos. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
0 plainpainter 217 Report post Posted September 25, 2009 I have 2 new construction cedar decks we'll be doing this weekend. I'm gonna find a sweet blend. Both are getting Armstrong. I want to give the product one last serious look and test out over the winter before I decide what to do in '10. I don't envy you - I am finding it really counterintuitive staining cedar. Nothing soaks into the stuff! Mahogany which is a real dense wood that you would think nothing would go into just swallows A.C. like no tomorrow. As dry and nicely sanded the cedar is - nothing seems to go in. Staining the cedar skirt board on the deck above was a total joke Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
0 PressurePros 248 Report post Posted September 25, 2009 Dan and all you other woodies.. what are your thoughts on taking the semi down a notch with a gallon of spirits? It would probably help with the absorption into the cedar? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
0 plainpainter 217 Report post Posted September 25, 2009 Dan and all you other woodies.. what are your thoughts on taking the semi down a notch with a gallon of spirits? It would probably help with the absorption into the cedar? I don't think it would help much at all. The A.C. was like water that day - seemed to be as thin as straight spirits. There is just something wacky about cedar. I almost think spirits gets in the way of absorption with cedar - as if the cedar traps the spirits and prevents anything else from entering. I puddled the stain on to the railings and decking - 40 minutes later the mahogany was bone dry ready for another coat and the cedar railings still had visible puddles. It was actually very sobering - gave me better insight as to adhesion problems with oil based primers and typical cedar clapboard siding. Now I know that wood just doesn't accept anything - deep penetrating or not. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
0 plainpainter 217 Report post Posted September 25, 2009 I am also thinking about approaching cedar more from a Jim Foley perspective. F' all the percarbs or all the jib-jabber about properly neutralizing and all that other nonsense. I am just going to go back to my roots and 'burn' cedar with a strong tsp/bleach wash - and I don't care if the wood looks bone white and unnatural looking when dry. At least I know it will accept stain better. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
0 bigchaz 157 Report post Posted September 25, 2009 Dan and all you other woodies.. what are your thoughts on taking the semi down a notch with a gallon of spirits? It would probably help with the absorption into the cedar? Did it on some fences but they were pressure treated...so not sure I have any helpful results on that. It was a cost thing more than anything. I think I only used a half gal per 5'er. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
0 RPetry 564 Report post Posted September 25, 2009 Western red cedar is the most finicky, challenging wood to deal with. Seems that nearly every job is a bit different. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
0 Beth n Rod 1,279 Report post Posted September 25, 2009 I love a good photo over a cup of coffee......ahhhhhh nice! :) :cup: Beth Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
0 Beth n Rod 1,279 Report post Posted September 25, 2009 You guys are having too much fun with this thread and the pics. Good work. Rod!~ Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
0 James 624 Report post Posted September 25, 2009 Cedar needs to age. Doing it within 6 months of being built is a waste of time because it will look chitty and have to be redone in 6 months unless thats your plan. I like when cedar sits about 4 years ( deck boards)? Dan, That is the best looking job and photo you've posted. Mahogany is just about the most porous wood i deal with( depends which brand of course) and cambara. They suck oil !! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
0 plainpainter 217 Report post Posted September 25, 2009 Cedar needs to age. Doing it within 6 months of being built is a waste of time because it will look chitty and have to be redone in 6 months unless thats your plan. I like when cedar sits about 4 years ( deck boards)? Dan, That is the best looking job and photo you've posted. Mahogany is just about the most porous wood i deal with( depends which brand of course) and cambara. They suck oil !! Yeah - that job turned out really nice. After an initial $400 purchase for a used floor sander and $900 in parts later - that was the first job it really worked instead of breaking down. Since I sand - I was never a purist about starting and stopping on wood - this job I ran down each board continuously with the wand. And I used HD-80 full strength with pump-up and Citralic full strength with a pump-up. And of course the A.C. stain - everything just came together nicely on that job. Here is a pic of the deck in the middle of a second application on decking - for all those that think A.C. is a one-coater - hah! And another pic of someone that dropped by to appreciate my craftsmanship. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
0 Tonyg 14 Report post Posted September 25, 2009 Dan and all you other woodies.. what are your thoughts on taking the semi down a notch with a gallon of spirits? It would probably help with the absorption into the cedar? Ken, from a painters point of view I don't like cutting any coating more than 10% if I can help it. It would be one thing if you were "pickling" then that would be another story but thinning it down too much I would think you are going to lose some integrity in the coating. Use the Natural to cut with instead. I would also caution you against using new wood to base your opinions of the AC. I really like the product but my experience pales to most here. I will say that I think it works great on both BUT color differences between old/new is like night and day. I have color preferences for new and old wood and they rarely are the same - the color variance and expectation is too drastic with the age of the wood. For example - Super Cedar looks great on new wood but I don't like it on old wood - Redwood looks great on old wood but I really don't like it on new wood. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
0 PressurePros 248 Report post Posted September 25, 2009 Tony, I agree about watering down a product too much but I think diluting the semi solid by 20% and applying two coats (as we always do) is worth trying. I'll update you guys. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
0 plainpainter 217 Report post Posted September 25, 2009 Ken, from a painters point of view I don't like cutting any coating more than 10% if I can help it. It would be one thing if you were "pickling" then that would be another story but thinning it down too much I would think you are going to lose some integrity in the coating. Use the Natural to cut with instead. Ken is referring to the inability of stains to penetrate into cedar. We all know it's not good to cut too much - but cedar is just one big pita. Loading it down with spirits is an idea to get something to penetrate. But from another point of view when you saw these products go from 550 down to 350 VOC - that was a reduction of about a quart in thinner. So right off the bat - reducing something by 25% would get you back to previous regulations. I think I just hate cedar - it furs like mad, especially end grain. And it accepts oil base stain as if the stain was a waterbourne. I have no clue why people would use the stuff - as well, there are countless times when I was fooled into thinking cedar decking was pressure treated. So if it looks close to pressure treated - why not just use pressure treated? I'd rather just use spanish cedar and soak it with cretowood - and give it an annual cleaning and forget about it. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
0 RPetry 564 Report post Posted September 26, 2009 I don't envy you - I am finding it really counterintuitive staining cedar. Nothing soaks into the stuff! Mahogany which is a real dense wood that you would think nothing would go into just swallows A.C. like no tomorrow. As dry and nicely sanded the cedar is - nothing seems to go in. Staining the cedar skirt board on the deck above was a total joke Daniel, Nice prep on that cedar deck. Those posts are massive. Western red cedar, whether new, old, or in between, can be a pain. But I do not totally subscribe to the statements that newer cedar will not take a fair amount of oil stain. 5 month old, knotty WRC deck done this July. Not of the best quality. This wood took 11 gals. of RS natural cedar. The horizontal wood should be serviced about the same time frame next year, but we got about 1 gal. of oil into the wood per 120 sq. ft. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
0 James 624 Report post Posted September 26, 2009 Ken, use light colors of AC like Cedar tone or Natural or mix'em, Reducing the solids to 50,60% works better on newer cedar. Light colors don't look as bad on cedar during the aging process. Less pigment the better. My best mix of RS on cedar is half Klear Halph Lite bRown and dilute it with some Natural Toner. Great natural look with enough UV block. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
0 Jeff 232 Report post Posted September 26, 2009 Man I wish folks would take care of their decks down south here like they do up north Nice work Dan. All you woodies love seeing the pictures. Can I do wood with an Xjet & 12% LOL LOL Love the wood pics keep them coming Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
0 RPetry 564 Report post Posted September 26, 2009 Man I wish folks would take care of their decks down south here like they do up north ... Love the wood pics keep them coming Jeff, Who is kidding who? Deck restoration is a niche market that the Condo King would chuckle at! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Small deck nothing big other than being a solid stain strip P.I.T.A
So far so good.
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