Biz Black Eye

[JFife 14]

This was a sad story I saw on O'Reilly last night. A suburban house wife in either NY/NJ was brutally raped and murdered in here home by a guy that was pwashing her deck. The reason O'Reilly was discussing it was because the man was an illegal alien, and the story hadn't been getting much pub. Besides the fact it is very sad anytime a mother loses her life, much less in a brutal way, I was very disturbed and saddened that it was someone doing what I do for a living. I don't want to trivialize the event by discussing whether or not this would be bad for our biz, but these circumstances just really made it feel like it was hitting close to home.

[Cleveland Mobile 14]

It happens......every jerk off out there does something for a living. Thats why I try to be both professional and curtious when on the job or on the estimate. When I ring the font doorbell I always step off the porch so the customer doesnt feel threatened in any way. I try to look professional too. T-shirts with the company name etc. Do the job in a business like manner...no boom boxes blasting....keep the shirts on.....no yelling .....be neat about your work.

Remember...every home owner has a horror story....not like the one described by Oreilly....but usually everyone has had work done they werent satisfied with...and that all the more make it necessary to put the customer at ease.

Andy

[Ernie Greese 14]

I feel sorry for the lady involved, but she bears some of the responsibility too. Do you think the guy she hired was insured, a member of any professional organizaton or looked capable? I have the feeling the guy was the lowest price she found and it backfired. That's where Professional Deck Refinishers need to emphasize their professionalism like Andy said. Insurance, what ever certification and a can do attitude. I think O'Reilly was warning people to be more savvy when they call any contractor to do work. People are so tuned into Walmart thinking that cheap is best. Cheap merchandise is OK, but not cheap service.

[tropical wave 22]

I feel sorry for the lady involved, but she bears some of the responsibility too. Do you think the guy she hired was insured, a member of any professional organizaton or looked capable? I have the feeling the guy was the lowest price she found and it backfired. .

I understand what your trying to say, but I have a real hard time agreeing with her assuming ANY responsibility for what animals like this guy do.......I see this too much in my full time job.....

Just because a victim (in this case a woman) chooses cheaper service, uninsured etc etc, or drives thru a bad part of town, or wears something sexy, or whatever, these people dont bear any responsibility for what criminals do (after they are victimized I certainly ask myself, "what the hell were you thinking?") but its not their fault, and they certainly don't deserve it...... (if that makes any sense?)...

Its like locking your doors, they just keep honest people honest, they dont keep your stuff safe from criminals..... and as far as being professional looking, thats wonderful and will get more jobs than if you look like a dirtbag out on parole, but if books were judged by their cover it would make my job a whole lot easier---"just find the nasty guy, he MUST be the rapist or the burgler".....remember Ted Bundy, clean cut, professional looking, smooth talker etc. etc. Most people looking for a house wash would probably hire him too (if he was insured, of course)......Same for John Gacy, professional contractor (small business home handyman) and a professional clown, and he was a gem of a guy!!!!

[Ernie Greese 14]

I am not excusing the dirtbag. But SHE could have checked references, for one thing. This is where customer education comes in!

[PLD 14]

I understand what your trying to say, but I have a real hard time agreeing with her assuming ANY responsibility for what animals like this guy do.......I see this too much in my full time job.....

Responsibility in a manner that mitigates the accountability of the perp? Certainly not.

Responsibility to herself, and the family she left behind. Yes.

Granted, you *should* be able to walk downtown at 3am with $100 bills hanging out of your pockets. But, that is not reality. The reality is that such behavior is risky and that risk is common knowledge. So, you have the responsibility to yourself (which you may abdicate) and your friends/family (which you may not have) not to place yourself in a position of imminent danger.

[Celeste 341]

Let's turn the tables here for a moment, since we're talking about checking references, insurance, professionalism, etc.....

Beth and I both are women. We call on clients. Do we now have a responsibility to check our clients out so that when we go to quote a job, Joe Homeowner, who looks like a decent guy but is really a serial rapist, doesn't rape and kill us in his backyard?

Violent crime happens everywhere to anyone. The responsibility lies TOTALLY AND COMPLETELY with the perp. That woman was a victim period. I believe I've read somewhere that he was an illegal - where the hell's the government's responsibility mentioned in this issue?

[James 625]

Stuff happens out of anyones control- Did anyone finish the deck ?

[Outlaw 14]

Stuff happens out of anyones control- Did anyone finish the deck ?

Thats cold dude, even from you I would expect a little bit better!

Gav

[Don Phelps 85]

Did anyone finish the deck ?

That was incredibly insensitive to the situation. Having a bad day or ???

[Beth n Rod 1,279]

I see NO reason why the victim's choice in contractor is an issue here. How do you know the guy was the owner? Maybe he was just an employee? Maybe he had references and they were fake. For all you know he was the highest bidder. Point is, he did a very seriously wrong thing. She did not bring this upon herself. It is HIS fault, 100%! She was in HER own home, a place where she SHOULD have been safe. There is no reason to say she did anything wrong. She broke no laws.

Beth

[PLD 14]

Beth and I both are women. We call on clients. Do we now have a responsibility to check our clients out so that when we go to quote a job, Joe Homeowner, who looks like a decent guy but is really a serial rapist, doesn't rape and kill us in his backyard?

Obviously, that's not feasible. I'm a good sized guy, and but I do take simple precautions. Most quotes are not done same day, and I get a number, and call them at that number to confirm. I also leave behind a written log of all quotes, job sites, address, name, phone, date, time, etc. If I don't show up back at home within a few hours of when I'm expected there is a trail of evidence telling family and rescue where to start looking. Granted a serial killer is highly unlikely, but a fall or get injury while working alone are not.

When I show my rentals it is a whole different story. Attacks on property managers and RE agents happen every so often because perps know they will have a victim alone in a vacant property. I always make an appointment, never for the same day, call to confirm at a phone answered by a human, and I'm most often carrying a concealed firearm.

Violent crime happens everywhere to anyone. The responsibility lies TOTALLY AND COMPLETELY with the perp. That woman was a victim period.

As I said before, please don't take my statements as an attempt to shift any of the blame from the perp to the victim. I'm the last person you will see offering apologies for human garbage like that. I'm a right wing, gun tottin', shoot first and ask questions later kinda guy. I think it's a good news day when they report that a homeowner or shopkeeper blasts a would-be robber into oblivion.

But we all have the responsibility to take reasonable precautions to protect ourselves from harm. And checking out the credibility of a contractor is a one means of doing so. And had she done so, perhaps she might still be alive today.

[James 625]

Sorta like "parrot head " humor..- We can't dwell on stuff like that. Unless it hit's yourself personally.

[tropical wave 22]

Sorta like "parrot head " humor..- We can't dwell on stuff like that. Unless it hit's yourself personally.

couldnt agree more !!! being in "public service", me and my people in L.E. or Firefighters etc, see some heinous tragic stuff, crimes on children, murders, rapes, nasty crashes etc. etc......If that stuff comes home with you everyday, you'd lose your mind, ulcers, heart attacks........regular life stress is brutal enough, then add BS like that......thick skin and a bizzare sense of humor, its actually pretty weird what can happen to oneself after years of exposure to the dark side of humanity...........

[nitrox2595 15]

new to the site, If anyone waants to know the real story, i will post it here. This crime happenend in my town, ranked 5th safest in the country, and really hit home.

[tropical wave 22]

new to the site, If anyone waants to know the real story, i will post it here. This crime happenend in my town, ranked 5th safest in the country, and really hit home.

lay it on us.......

[nitrox2595 15]

The guy was powerwashing her deck and the rest of the crew went to lunch, leaving the one guy there. He apparently went to the door and asked the lady to talk to her. He forced his way into the house and raped,strangled and mutilated her. Her sister came over and he was back outside, she asked him a question, which he ignored and started to walk away. Her sister then went inside and found the body. While the guy was murdering the lady, The owner of the company came to the site and probably thought the killer quit, so he finished the deck and took the keys to the van. The killer was caught wearing her husbands clothes about a mile away, 4 hours later. Very Sad story.

[Celeste 341]

That's horrible - shame on the company owner for not checking out his employee!

[Beth n Rod 1,279]

Did he have a history? That's my question.

Beth

[CCPC 26]

Who says he didn't check out the employee? Just because someone has a spotless record dosen't mean the're not capable of such crimes. There's gotta be a first for every sick A___ H___'s reign of terror.

[Celeste 341]

As I understood it, the guy was an illegal. Don't get me wrong, I still maintain that the perp was 100% responsible but I also feel that in order to keep our country free the way we've enjoyed it, we all hold some responsibility in keeping those who feel they can circumvent our laws and system - I'll bet he wouldn't have tried that in whatever country he came from.

[tropical wave 22]

As I understood it, the guy was an illegal- I'll bet he wouldn't have tried that in whatever country he came from.

AMEN !!!!

lets send him back to his "motherland" in a plastic bag......

[Celeste 341]

Multiple zip-locks would be my preference :) LOL

[CLASSICPW 14]

I hate to ask the question, but how many of the contractors on here hire non english speaking help. illegal or not. A friend of mine runs a painting biz and has about 6 spanish guys working for him, only his foreman(2) speak english, which he pays well( abot $18 hr), but they are all from South America. He offered to get me a guy as a helper, which I need really bad, but I cannot speak spanish, so I'm forced to hire college kids who so far are lazy, never show up, and just always have an excuse not to work.

[nitrox2595 15]

He did not do a background check. The killer had a warrant from 2002 for beating his girlfriend. The owner hired him because he was recommended by another longtime empoyee. The fallout is now everyone wants the owner on the job.(impossible for me 12hrs a day doing ests.) And the good part is the county is cracking down on unlicensed contractors. As for illegals, or spanish people, Ive tried aying americans all they want, they felt they were too good to powerwash, I had 25 employees and only 5 are american. Treat them with respect, pay well, find the right ones and thats it.I tell my customers that they do not need to open the door until they call my cell, or my office and speak to my secretary who verifies the situation over nextel.

[KGILL 14]

I know this is an old post, but I found it as I have been reading every thread about wood from the first one posted. I am sure some of the posters here are no longer with this forum, but I do recognize some names as currently with the Grim Scene.

Facts... this was a deplorable crime committed by an animal. Whether or not a company or person is licensed, insured, yada yada yada has no bearing on what transpired. Perhaps the company owner should have done a background check, but those are only as good as long as the system works. I have seen too many times where failures in the system in which some things are not listed. Depending on the information available on the warrant...it may not have been entered properly on NCIC, and the state criminal information network. In va it is VCIN, other states have other names.

Another big problem with relying on background checks as CCPC states if a person does not have a criminal record. The funny thing about people who are charged for the first time.... is that they have no criminal records.

I have seen situations in which the victim can be at least partially blamed for their own victimization. For instance someone attempting to purchase narcotics and ending up getting robbed by the dealer. Or in recent times at my alma matter where a college student was robbed and killed while dealing narcotics in his off campus housing. These two situations are where people put themselves into a bad environment and situation. Does that mean they deserved what happened? No, but you can see where they are partially responsible. This victim does not fall into this category at all.