broke in new machine, have questions

[CCPC 26]

Finally got my new PW hooked up yesterday and broke it in today. However, I may have a few problems. The reason I say may, is because with my new setup, of which I'm drawing from a reserve tank, I'm a little uncertain if the differences I'm experiencing are normal or if I'm worried about nothing.

The equipment/plumbing:

5.5 gpm 3500 psi PW pulling from a 20g back up water tank

2' of 3/4" ID hose from tank to PW

General Pump Pulasar pressure unloader (EZ)

First question:

I think I may be experiencing some very rapid, almost undetectable pulsing when spraying the wand. Its very fast and mostly noticable when spraying the wand directly at concrete or another hard surface. What could be causing this? Or is this normal?

Second question:

The pump seems to be getting very hot. I'm not sure if its just me noticing it out of worry becasue of the new machine and plumbing or if its building much more heat than it should. I never really paid much attention to how hot the pump was on my other machine so I nothing to judge it buy. Also this pump is a bit bigger than the other, don't know if that makes a difference.

Third question:

With my old machine (4gpm) I didn't use a back up water tank, I ran straight from the spigot. I would always turn the water on let the water pressure flow through the line for a minute than start it up. With the new set up (water source coming from the 20g tank) There is no flow going through the pump and hose until I start the PW. The question is: if I fill the tank and there is a little air block in the hose between the tank and the washer (no flow going into pump) is this normal? and when I start the machine will that second or two of no water in pump damage the pump?

[Craig 111]

#1. Normal

#2. Normal

#3. It's OK, but don't make a habit of it. It could potentially damage your machine and lock it up, but this type of thing happens to me a lot. Just make sure to keep the trigger pulled to pull the water through the system. Don't let it sit there and starve for H20.

[FullBlast 14]

#1 Maybe little dirt in the valves.???

#2 Very hot??? Should be the temp of the water going thru the pump. On a hot day it will condesate. Should not be hot.

#3 No big deal if you take the pressuer hose off before you start it then get water going thru it then shut it down hook hose up then fire up good to go.

About that hot pump call Coutry Power Washing Equip. 717-765-9478 Nice man to work with there he will help you.

What machine do you have? What pump name?

[Beth n Rod 1,279]

Hopefully some equipment vendors will chime in here...

Beth

[PWkid 79]

#1 If you fill your tank from the top it could be air bubbles from the hose when your filling your tank.

#2 I have a belt drive pump and after running mine all day long my pump is cool to the touch unless its in direct sunlight.Your pump should not be that hot.

#3 In my humble opinion anybody that runs off a tank is going to have a sec or 2 of limited water until the pump is primed.

[Russ Johnson 141]

I think I may be experiencing some very rapid, almost undetectable pulsing when spraying the wand. Its very fast and mostly noticable when spraying the wand directly at concrete or another hard surface. What could be causing this? Or is this normal?

A noticeable pulsation could be a foreign object in one of the valves. Is this a new plastic tank? Do you have a strainer on the inlet plumbing? I have seen small shards of plastic in new tanks caused by the hole cutting process. Check for air leaks, too. A very small amount of air can throw a pump way off. Do you have a straight shot from the tank to the pump, or do you have elbows in the line? Elbows create restriction and turbulence because they require the water to change directions.

Second question:

The pump seems to be getting very hot. I'm not sure if its just me noticing it out of worry becasue of the new machine and plumbing or if its building much more heat than it should. I never really paid much attention to how hot the pump was on my other machine so I nothing to judge it buy. Also this pump is a bit bigger than the other, don't know if that makes a difference.

The pump may get warm, after all, it's doing "work", and the energy will be expended as heat. A pump that is hot to the touch may have a problem. The belts may be too tight, it may be low on oil, or, when assembled, the bearings may not have been given the proper clearance if they're tapered roller bearings. Generals have tapered roller bearings, Cat uses ball bearings (no clearance adjustment). Are there any external heat sources close to the pump (engine exhaust, etc.)?

BTW, if it's a General and it's getting HOT, watch the sight glass on the back cover. The plastic shrinks when it gets hot and falls out. A hot pump, an oil leak, or defective sight glass will, in all probability, be a warranty issue. Blowing the pump up due to a lack of oil is not.

Third question:

With my old machine (4gpm) I didn't use a back up water tank, I ran straight from the spigot. I would always turn the water on let the water pressure flow through the line for a minute than start it up. With the new set up (water source coming from the 20g tank) There is no flow going through the pump and hose until I start the PW. The question is: if I fill the tank and there is a little air block in the hose between the tank and the washer (no flow going into pump) is this normal? and when I start the machine will that second or two of no water in pump damage the pump?

It should not take a second or two for that pump to purge air. The air should instantly clear the line. Start the machine with the gun held open, as a cushion of air in the lines, pump head, etc. may slow this process.

[CCPC 26]

I really appreicate everyones input and advice. I'm going to do a little more experimenting and testing this weekend and try some of the ideas and thoughts that were brought up. It sounds like the only thing I need to be real concerned about is the pump heat situation. I'm also going the check all of the fittings from the tank to the pump inlet and make certain there's no air leaks.

[CCPC 26]

update:

I did some messing around with it today and heres what I've come up with.

I ran the machine directly from the spigot to see if this changes anything. The rapid pulsing was not nearly as bad, it sprayed much smoother and with a bit more power. When I reconnected to the tank the rapid pulsing and vibration returned. I know its not an air problem because I checked all of the fittings and everything is tight and solid. Could this pulsing possibly be caused because of having such a small reserve tank, maybe not enough water weight pushing down to help force the water out of the hose.

The pump still became very hot after about 5 minutes of spraying whether I ran from the spigot or tank. I don't know if this makes any difference, but the brass part of the pump is not hot at all, its just the crank case part. I don't know if this is of any help for diagnosis.

Any more ideas or help?

[Scott Stone 604]

HOw big is your feed line? I like as big a line as I can get. I actually run a 2" line from my tanks to just under teh pump inlet, and then it goes to a 1" line there. It works well, and I can empty my tanks down to within a half inch of the bottom with this set up. I also have NEVER had to wait for the pump to start pumping. I do use bigger tanks, but I think that it would still hold true. I have a feeling teh pulsation and the wait are both tied together. Fix one, and you will fix them both.

Scott Stone

[First Impressions 14]

I have had the problem with air in the inlet as well. You can try taking off the supply line before the pump and let the air pocket escape and then replace the line, this worked to allow the water to start flowing for me. Mine never purged the air pocket by itself. Now I just never let the tank get less than two inches above the outlet or I have to do it again. I am new and am only sharing what I have learned so far.

I really like Scotts idea of a bigger supply line I’m only using a ¾ inch line, and will probably re-plum mine soon to see if that helps reduce the heat, although I haven’t scene the hose collapse which I think it would do if it was starving for water. I think I went overboard with my tank at 100 gal. Not big enough to solve a no water problem at a job and to big for a float tank.

Hope I helped not sure if I did.

Dan.