age of restoration

[JFife 14]

I'll write on next post

[JFife 14]

Okay, I'm already holiday-bored. Here is the game:

Give me your analysis of this deck. How you feel it looks. What has been done to it recently/in the past. Was it done correctly?? How old do you think the finish is?? By the appearance, would you be happy with your decks looking like this after 'X' years?? Just start giving thoughts. Maybe it looks like a fresh restoration?? Whatever. After a few posts I'll give the history.

[seymore 90]

Ok Jon...That deck looks like it's about 2-3 yrs old and looks like it has some kind of clear on it maby applied about 1 yr ago??

Now I would still do a test spot with some stripper anyway :)

No i wouldn't want my deck to look like this ever!

If you are bored you need to come to Texas we're in the 70's-80's and my work is still non stop.

[Beth n Rod 1,279]

7-10 years, Acrylic or behr brand sealer

washed maybe 1-2 times. Grill stains and dry wood, checking.

AT the current resolution, its hard to tell much more except that there appears to be remnants of silicone in the wood.

Rod!~

[JFife 14]

LOL, you guys are gonna LOVE the answer! I'll wait for a couple more analysises (or whatever the plural for 'analysis' is)

[PressurePros 248]

My initial guess was.. wood looks "thirsty". By areas of dry rot and knots popping I'd say the deck was 6 years old with a clear water base (acrylic) or some type of Seal Max product applied 6-18 mos ago. I know this must be way off based upon your last post.

[John Orr 206]

I would guess about 18 months since "treated" with CWF.

[Beth n Rod 1,279]

Ok....I'll take a guess also...

Guess is assuming a full sun deck. Can't see what the surrounding tree growth is like, and do not know what exposure the deck has. Photo doesn't contain any shadows....

Age: 3-6 years old

Deck floor and rail caps are due to be serviced.

Perhaps Olympic on the rails....

Grill stains appear to have been there a while.

Deck boards look like they have been washed before.

Pressure treated lumber.....

Would feel better about this guess if I could see:

shot of the whole yard

know the exposure of the deck

see a close up of typical floor board area

could see the corner where the rail caps join more clearly to see how the boards look

Beth

[squirtgun 122]

I just want to know if it your deck Jon.

[Jarrod 22]

I guess it's my turn.

Deck age - 6-8 years old.

Obvious grill marks.

It was once treated with CWF or Behr (still in the spindles) The last time it was restored (2-3 yrs ago) the contractor couldn't get it all off - understandibly. That same contractor coated the deck with a clear or an oil based stain - I'm leaning towards an oil base.

The deck does need to be restored though.

No, I would not be satisfied with the way it looks.

The dog's tail was snipped about 4 years ago.

[JFife 14]

And the winner is.......ehh, Beth was fairly close, pointing out the full exposure and all.

Here's the deal:

This is MY deck. My house was built in 96', I moved in this past May 1. Deck just looked grey and dry, but I used a low concentration of F18 to strip, and once I started stripping, I saw areas where stains had been tested in small spots, I saw about 5sf of CWF, etc. Deck boards were already cracked, warped, etc. This deck gets 100% sun, literally. Comes up on one side, goes down on the other, above the deck all day. Gets grill usage and abundant dog traffic from my two boxers and their friends.

So I stripped this deck properly, brightened, dried, did not buff, and applied some left over Sikkens SRD/Natural Oak to the deck. I personally did it all, applied to saturation by brush with thorough backbrushing, allowed to soak for about 15 mintues, and re-applied to saturation. After awhile, I'd wipe up any shineys.

I've appplied SRD to many decks, but never seen it perform this poorly. I know it gets extreme exposure, but were talking six months old here. I'm going to recoat it in the near future with my Gold Standard (TWP) and see how it performs under this condition and report back. It won't be really fair since the SRD had to work with the really dry wood, but it will still be interesting. Actually, if Russ or anyone else has some ideas of something they'd like to see me try, I'm all ears. I wouldn't object to doing half my deck with one thing, half with something else. Maybe I'll try a few different things. Don't question my white-trash credentials:)

[bforbis 14]

Jon,

I have only recently researched the SIKKENS line of stains, Are they set up for multiple coats such as base, intermediate and top coat??? May be not all lines of SIKKENS, but wonder if yours was supposed to have something else?

[JFife 14]

SRD is a one coat penetrating stain. Their other products perform totally differently, creating a heavy film.

Any critiques are welcome. Perhaps you think I did something wrong?? I'm all ears. I'm anxious to try some new solutions for this deck.

[bforbis 14]

I don't think I could begin to say what if anything you did wrong. There is too much experience on this forum for me to speak.

As I re-read your post of what you did and assuming "stripped it properly" I noticed one thing.... You used "left over stain" How old, where was it stored (heat, cold or frozen at one time) Maybe that is the key to the failure???

Just a thought!

[JFife 14]

....since you mentioned it, I actually think i bought it specifically for this job. Stain was fresh. Good call though.

Hey Jimbo Foley, any ideas for a treatment you'd like to see?? Maybe one of your pre-condition/stain jobs?? I'm for anything.

[PressurePros 248]

I vote for a Wood Tux top coat with one half being treated with Wood Tux DMC first. I know you are wary of products without long track record and since the SRD failed so miserably, I'd be looking forward to hearing your updates as to which side, if either or both were holding up..

[Beth n Rod 1,279]

Jon,

Keep in mind the formulation changes for the new voc laws. I dont know how long ago they released the new formulas but still I would take this into consideration.

As for applying 2 coats to saturation is why it failed. The wood fibers were too open and allowed too much into the substrate creating a non flexible surface. SRD was not meant to be applied with more than one coat. We had a customer who did the same thing and then afterwards told us we didnt know what we were doing. He went ahead and added more to it after we had already finished the job and guess what he is in for??? More of the same and by his ignorance alone.

Rod!~

[JFife 14]

Rod,

Not really two coats, more of a wet on wet coat. The same way anyone would apply most anything i imagine. You spray a side of railing, then go back and re-mist and brush out. That is what I did. There was an area of a rail where i applied a small amount after the first coat had set up, and at that point it creates a film. That part actually looks fine. Believe me, if I thought I did something wrong to cause this I'd own up. But everything was done by their instrucitons, with the exception of that I didn't sand.

Ken,

I'd be happy to try the WTW on this. But this doesn't seem like an ideal job for a conditioner, does it?? I'd think that would be more for something like an untreated 10yr old fence or something. What do you think?

[PressurePros 248]

Jon,

Since you're going to be stripping again to use a different product, you'll use an acid to brighten/balance and that will displace some of the sugars in the wood. I have absolutely no experience on Russell's two step process, but I think the DMC would act as the name states to deep condition and help the substrate. Hopefully he will jump in here.

[JFife 14]

So you'd strip this and not just percarb it?

[PressurePros 248]

You could probably strip with EFC-38. It has a bit more bite than just straight percarb. I would use HD-80. Get a two lb jar from Russ, you can mix it 3-4 oz per gallon to be sure you are emulsifying anything that's left of the SRD.

[Beth n Rod 1,279]

Depends on the rails and what you want to do there. EFC would be a great choice, stronger rather than weaker. Just my .o2...

Beth

[Beth n Rod 1,279]

Jon,

and applied some left over Sikkens SRD/Natural Oak to the deck. I personally did it all, applied to saturation by brush with thorough backbrushing, allowed to soak for about 15 mintues, and re-applied to saturation. After awhile, I'd wipe up any shineys.

In troubleshooting a sealer I look at the information given here and try to understand what I am seeing in relation to your information on what has been done to the deck. By experience with SRD up north here with higher humidity conditions, it is possible that in 15 minutes the product can set up. I dont know how hot the temps were when you did it but the condition influencing the sealer is full sun and once the product starts to dry thats it...I consider that a coat.

My intent is not to question you or deminish your application methods, but to adding my notes on what I have encountered and the detriments of the same scenario played out up here.

Anyway, I am just noticing the fact that the deck had very little product left on it although SRD is a one year product. It is a strong point that I always evaluate products even when applied by others and the conditions so that I am aware of its capabilities or weaknesses and your posting this Q & A thread has been very helpful in that regard.

Rod!~

[JFife 14]

Thanks Rod,

I'm with you, I'm surely pleased to be the guinea pig in this scenario rather than a paying (and talking) customer. Is performance like this what you expect with your SRD decks?? When you say 'one yr product', do you mean that it is 'gone' in one year, or just needs re-coated?? I've used SRD on plenty of decks (and a handful of homes) and have never had it perform this poorly.

[Beth n Rod 1,279]

It needs maintenance every year in order to keep it looking its best.

At least thats what we see up north here.

The wood on your deck seems to have been a playground for testing and who knows what was done to it. My guess is that the wood contains a significant amount of an alkaline still that lies deep in the structure which when reactivated by moisture exposure below can work its way up towards the surface (water evaporates upwards) it brings with it whatever is causing the sealer to fail so completely.

Just a guess and this is giving the benefit of the doubt to the sealer that the formulation is still as good as it ever was because this seems to be an isolated incident for you. Given this, longer dwell time with an acid at higher concentration should help minimize the future occurence of this problem.

Curious...

Rod!~

[JFife 14]

Rod,

I humbly bow to the King!! I think you are EXACTLY right, Rod. When I stripped this deck, I used a sample of a product that had been sent to me, enough for one deck. Worked great. To brighten, I used another sample from another company, but the product had a "name" as opposed to being called a "brightener". I remember at the time thinking, "this doesn't smell like brightener", but it did lighten the stripped surface. In hindsight, I think it was a percarb cleaner that i used as a neutralizer, which would mean your conclusion about having alkaline remnants left in the wood would be dead-on.

I think you may have solved this problem. So I am going to strip w/ efc38 and then apply copius amounts of neutr, rinse, and do half the deck w/ TWP and half with WTW (anyone have a gallon to part with? I dont care the color, just something natural looking. I'll send postage if someone has a left over gallon).

Gonna be a fun test!