The Economy; how do you feel about it?

[Big Bill 14]

I agree with Rick, long term is where it's at. I have been investing for the long term for 20+ years. When the stock market took a nose dive in '87, I thought it was disaster for me, but I took my old man's advice & stuck with it, it was only a loss on paper. I kept putting away a little bit every month, I have never missed a month's contribution in over 20 years. When the IRA contribution thing started, I have contributed. When the company I work full time for started offering the 401k in 1995, I have contributed the maximum amount every year. It takes discipline and hard work for me, which is the reason I am in the pressure washing business - so I can keep investing.

[Tmrrptr 164]

Wow!

What a thread.

Being newguy & all that, I'm reading ALL the stuff, to learn what I can...

Didn't lern nuthin from this one.

You'all bounced through economics, politics, philosophy, mini-flames, and a whole buncha other stuff before hashing back thru it all again!

Today is Tax Day, little over a month since last post here...

I just read abt hundreds of homes in foreclosure in Greely CO and there are big numbers growing here in CA and these are REAL PEOPLE affected by the economy.

I spent 5yrs working for big builders, and they are in a fade, now.

I know of tracts where they just stopped and went home.

One fellow has a tag line...When life gives you lemons, make lemonade...

So, I'm expanding my service offering to power washing homes.

If the market is full up, the best looking will get attention first.

...if i can get the hang of all them chems...

r

[Jeff 232]

Wow!

What a thread.

Being newguy & all that, I'm reading ALL the stuff, to learn what I can...

Didn't lern nuthin from this one.

You'all bounced through economics, politics, philosophy, mini-flames, and a whole buncha other stuff before hashing back thru it all again!

Today is Tax Day, little over a month since last post here...

I just read abt hundreds of homes in foreclosure in Greely CO and there are big numbers growing here in CA and these are REAL PEOPLE affected by the economy.

I spent 5yrs working for big builders, and they are in a fade, now.

I know of tracts where they just stopped and went home.

One fellow has a tag line...When life gives you lemons, make lemonade...

So, I'm expanding my service offering to power washing homes.

If the market is full up, the best looking will get attention first.

...if i can get the hang of all them chems...

r

Welcome and good luck. PWing is easy, do a little reading ask some questions and do a few projects and you'll see its a good little biz to be in

Jeff

[RPetry 564]

Meanwhile, the DJIA and the S&P averages are kissing record levels. Go figure.

Don't let our board optimist Jeff fool 'ya. PW is a tough business to get started. If you can last 5 yrs., you're in.

[Tmrrptr 164]

Hello , again Jeff,

Struggling here in CA.

Of course some folks are doing fine, but a lot of building is just shutting down.

I have been doing a few small PW jobs, and taking careful heed of the best advice out there... I am being VERY conservative with application of chems both to protect myself, and my clients property !

Whew! There's a LOT I need to learn !

Brand spankin' new PW'er... bypass hose poppin off shootin water in the air in front of client...

Next thing that happened was big wind when trying to downstream using a 1/4" barb fitting at the tip...

Then I found out a 24' extension pole is a real handul...

Most recent was the wheel and axle falling off as we loaded back in the truck after doing a pretty good job... of course, in front of the client.

Kind of a bummer cuz my wife got hurt a bit when the machine fell apart.

Need to get a ramp, or better yet, a trailer w/tank and stuff.

But it's all good.

Really makes a nice improvement to the clients property for a minimal cash outlay compared to other methods of improvement.

Easy?

Well, not just yet!

r

[Tmrrptr 164]

Hello Rick,

Well I guess you understand what's going on w the stock market and such...

From what I've tried to learn about it, I don't know nuthin!

I know a fellow who earns a living from an advance decline system of forecasting trends, but so far, it's way too complicated for me!

I know another who just made 25k because he thought a stock looked good, bought it, and sold a few weeks later.

I just hope to provide a better, and more complete service for my clients.

Hopefully, we can earn a living along the way.

r

[Jeff 232]

Hello , again Jeff,

Struggling here in CA.

Of course some folks are doing fine, but a lot of building is just shutting down.

I have been doing a few small PW jobs, and taking careful heed of the best advice out there... I am being VERY conservative with application of chems both to protect myself, and my clients property !

Whew! There's a LOT I need to learn !

Brand spankin' new PW'er... bypass hose poppin off shootin water in the air in front of client...

Next thing that happened was big wind when trying to downstream using a 1/4" barb fitting at the tip...

Then I found out a 24' extension pole is a real handul...

Most recent was the wheel and axle falling off as we loaded back in the truck after doing a pretty good job... of course, in front of the client.

Kind of a bummer cuz my wife got hurt a bit when the machine fell apart.

Need to get a ramp, or better yet, a trailer w/tank and stuff.

But it's all good.

Really makes a nice improvement to the clients property for a minimal cash outlay compared to other methods of improvement.

Easy?

Well, not just yet!

r

Wheel fell of your machine??? If so think about not unloading your machine at all at the job sight. I used load and unload at every job, until I went DUH and just got more pressure line and never had to roll machine off at any job again. Just a helpful hint that saves time and muscle

Good luck to you

Rick is right it is hard to make a living off of PWing, but persistance and a drive to make it will help. Your brain has to be in a mode of always trying to figure out how to get the jobs rolling in. Theres a million good ideas on these BB's for getting work

[Tmrrptr 164]

Yah, it was exciting when the wheel fell off!

Seems the stainless hubcap thingy was actually a push-on dealy to hold the wheel on... but didn't! When it dropped off on my wifes foot she immediately took advantage of the opportunity to tell me what she had been saving up to tell me... But as that began, the axle, now sliding because the wheel was no longer holding it in, kinda flipped out of it's bracket and we were real lucky to keep the whole mess up on the tailgate!

But this is just what we do for fun out here in CA !

Life IS good!

The whole deal is abt the economy...

Online news this morn just listed two CA counties down nearly 1/2 in RE prices or sales from last year... other counties down a third and a 1/4th.

I see it as an excellent opportunity to provide a valuable service PWing properties so they look their best.

...Best thing to do w a car for sale is drive it through the car wash!

A home listed for sale is much more important.

r

[Tmrrptr 164]

I am like you but with a different perspective. I don't readily buy what is handed me and chose to be a skeptic as long as the government continues to operate without the people.

I am not the popular opinion here but I never try to be. I am what you see.

btw. history is written by the winners. My lesson in history is not to become a part of it.

Rod!~

Things have changed considerably since the last posts here... most recently we have a significant number of mortgage co's in bankruptcy and a larger, staggering, number of foreclosures.

I, for one, see no cause for the situation to improve. No driving force.

Therefore, things must get worse.

Well, Rod's post was last.. "I am like you but with a different perspective"

Ha! That's generally called "different than you."

"Government that operates without the people?"

Aw c'mon. Government is NOTHING without the people.

"History is written by the winners" ???

Well that's blatantly wrong, isn't it.

History is what happened.

Stories may be written about what occurred by one side or the other, and a spin induced, but the facts remain the same.

And, "My lesson in history is not to become part of it."

Rod, the keyboard must have caught you on a bad day, as it does myself, from time to time.

You ARE, and SHALL BE FOREVER, a part of history.

It is inescapable, just as death, and taxes.

Perhaps you are unfamiliar with chaos theory and the butterfly effect...

Every ACTION creates a REACTION.

It may be that you shall not be recalled with Ben Franklin or Sam Adams, but you ARE a contributing factor even if your work does not have the impact of Mt Rushmore or the Hoover Dam.

Earlier, herein, Michael K claimed he had no concerns over the economy, or it dropping out, so to speak... He views it as opportunity and feels his regimen of hard work and savings shall both protect, and present him with great advantage in hard times.

Perhaps, but is he unfamiliar w the stories of once wealthy stockbrokers attempting to sell apples on the corner for a nickel after the market crashed? Or the folks taking a wheelbarrow of Reichsmarks to the market to try and buy a loaf of bread?

I feel everything is cyclic, by nature, and history is bound to repeat itself.

There may be varying facets, or some added twist, but the basics remain.

If our factories do not produce and our people are put in the streets, consequences shall affect each one of us.

Here's a new twist... Foreclosures in the wealthiest of neighborhoods have left homes vacant and swimming pools have become stagnant creating a breeding ground for mosquitoes which may spread the West Nile Virus.

Care for another twist with that martini ?

It is said half the foreclosures in CA are brought on by healthcare costs incurred by a catastrophic illness.

Sorry group, I just stumbled upon this economy thread as I was looking for a spot to place a post... My Question...

About 1/2 million foreclosures on the books, nationwide, and climbing.

These are, or soon shall be vacant, un-maintained buildings.

In the cleaning business, as we are, whom would we contact, to provide service, so these buildings can be made presentable for sale, when that time arrives that such buyers become available?

When Life gives you lemons, make lemonade...

We experienced professionals in the service industry must make our preparation now, for recovery tomorrow.

r

[Beth n Rod 1,279]

Hi Rich,

Thanks for your perspective.

To me it is pretty much an arbitrary topic which tends to bring out the mincing of words whether purposefully or not and tightens the scope of others who may share any similar view points to ambiguity.

I do not agree that it is impossible to avoid being a part of history when history favors those who figured prominently in it. I don't see myself making anywhere near that big of a splash as to be noticed in any archive of noteworthiness. I am a contractor like yourself and while we may clean up in our business', it will just get dirty again. If neither of us is chosen to clean it up again, someone else will. There is nothing notable for history to write about the majority of us except the statistics that our lifestyles, property and spending habits comprise in a demographic profile. Since there isn't a place for names, we are all anonymous figures that will soon be overwritten by the next wave of figures that pertain to the economics of that time.

Pretty neat huh! ;)

I did some searches this weekend and found that I am nowhere to be found unless I pay some service to release the data.

Rod!~

[Tmrrptr 164]

Yup, arbitrary might be a good choice of words...

But then again... Ha!

Semantics. and I never could read Carlos.

Can't do it Rod. Just can't.

I suppose I'll need to agree to disagree with you.

I think everyone will get their 15 minutes of fame.

It may not be as spectacular as others...

r

[newlook 265]

Not sure what you mean that you cant read me :)

Yup, arbitrary might be a good choice of words...

But then again... Ha!

Semantics. and I never could read Carlos.

Can't do it Rod. Just can't.

I suppose I'll need to agree to disagree with you.

I think everyone will get their 15 minutes of fame.

It may not be as spectacular as others...

r

[Tmrrptr 164]

Wow, you got me on that quote from the past economy post...

I was looking all through the thread to see where I might have said something disparaging about "Newlook Carlos" and I just couldn't find anything...

Then it dawned on me... Yep, the light clicks on once and a while...

It was in reference to Carlos Castaneda, the pseudo shaman.

I guess Rod has somewhat of an esoteric view towards the big picture that I was in disagreement with.

Now that it's Nov 4, 07 and the economic situation is peachy, perhaps I could review my view of the general situation...

Oops! From reading web news presentations, it almost looks as though things are beginning to snowball !

Maybe I should stop reading news articles and just go fishing.

r

[newlook 265]

LOL Rich....you da man. I was wondering what the comment meant...now it is explained.

The economy --- I don't care what anyone says....it's bad. It could be worse but it is bad and will stay that way for a bit!

Fortunately for us we have several platforms of revenue generating business for us to get by. They glory days of the real estate boom is over!!

[Beth n Rod 1,279]

Bump!!

I started this thread almost a year ago when I saw the indicators and felt that further discussion may provide some more insight.

Last August we saw a dramatic decline compared with previous years when we were booked clear into the end of September.

We thought the market was soft then...I think it is absolutely soggy now.

Rod!~

[Doug Dahlke 114]

The facts are the facts. Fuel prices have risen considerably over the last 18 to 24 months. Anything that ships by truck has increased in price. Some people can find alternative transportation but most still have to drive to get to work etc.

Yesterday on the local news they said that milk prices were up 30%, bread and eggs were well into the double digits along with beef and chicken. I mentioned the price of corn in another post. Last night on Modern Marvels they did a show about corn and it is amazing all that it goes into. The price for corn continues to rise because of increased use of it in ethanol. The US produces 40% of the world's corn and as the dollar declines in value more is being exported which further raises the price. The weak dollar also contributes to inflation because exports on other items rise as well and supply and demand means higher prices for those products.

The subprime mess continues and people who bought into ARMs are seeing their monthly mortgage payments go up, in some cases way up.

The last 10 years have also seen the demise of many good paying manufacturing jobs in this country. The politicians like to talk about all the new jobs that have been created but they aren't the same as the jobs that were lost.

People aren't snapping their wallets shut they are looking in their wallets and finding them empty. Most pay increases are only going to be 2% to 3%. That will nowhere near keep track with current inflation.

This isn't going away any time soon. Some companies will find ways to thrive or survive during these times, others won't. There are always people out there with money to spend but they are going to be fewer and harder to find/sell.

[Beth n Rod 1,279]

I am hearing from lenders/mortgage folks that the people who bought a few years back with ARMs were house poor from the get go, no furniture, and the deck furniture is what wash in the house. These same folks are losing their homes. Very sad. Credit card debt is through the roof for many people, which is debt most people will carry around for the majority of their lives.

Home improvement companies are competing for the same dollar. This means that you are competing with the flooring companies, interior painters, bathroom re-modelers, etc since disposable income has dropped, and people are making decisions and getting fewer things done.

Not trying to be negative, not at all. I just think it is better to have your eyes open, and plan with contingencies so you WILL survive.

Beth :cup:

[Doug Dahlke 114]

Not trying to be negative, not at all. I just think it is better to have your eyes open, and plan with contingencies so you WILL survive.

Beth :cup:

Well said. Things are what they are. It is not being negative to point out what is going on with the economy.

[Jeff 232]

The END is near

Maybe I should turn this into a GW thread. Guess all his tax cuts to the well off and corporations that was going to spur and maintain the economy didn't quite work for that long. What kept the economy going was the consumer and the debt they took on and now that that is coming to an end, times are getting tough for many. Where are all the benefits of those tax cuts now. Shouldn't of been any tax cuts the country was and is at war ( I wont even get into the war and the billions spent in Iraq)

whats even scarier, is about 3-4 weeks ago when I was watching the Republican Debates all the republican candidates were saying the economy was doing good, now a few weeks later they say it isn't doing good. What, they couldn't see what everyone else saw. They want to be president and they cant even see whats right in front of their faces

What we need is some of the good paying jobs back. The unemployment rate is the worst since 1990 in South Carolina, thats not good 6.6%

Tell me how the GW tax cuts helped, I just don't see it. Sometimes I just got to be a lift wing trouble maker. But the truth hurts sometimes

Its the END..................Maybe not just some difficult times that our great country will work out

[Doug Dahlke 114]

Jeff I agree 100% on the debt thing. I have been telling anyone who would listen that all this great economic stuff was smoke and mirrors because it was all built on debt. The piper now wants to be paid and it's gonna hurt.

The politicians are in one of two camps. Some are truly out of touch with what goes on in the real world. Remember the vast majority of these people are wealthy and don't feel our pain. The rest know what's happening and think the general public is dumb enough to believe the lie. When they know they can't get away with it any longer they change thier story.

I want to see more tax cuts. We are taxed to death. This country started a revolution over a tax rate that was something like 3%. People were willing to die for it. We now pay 50% between federal, state and local taxes. Factor in the taxes you pay that are passed along in the price of goods and services and it is even higher. There is more waste and fraud in government than probably anywhere else in society. I think I can figure out how to spend my money better than the government. The average US citizen saves next to nothing. Part of that is our culture and part of it is that we get taxed on the interest of what we save. If we die and pass it to our children its taxed again. If you have a tax deferred fund like a 401K they hit you up when you start withdrawing it.

Our economic policies stink. There are tough times ahead but maybe we will start paying more attention to what matters. Maybe we will wake up as a country and get some real change.

[Jeff 232]

Our Gov is run by King & Queens, we are in a monarchy now. They spend millions to get a job that pays 140K for congressmen, why, so they can take care of the special interest group and do speeches at 20-50K a pop. Or many are egomaniac that only care about the power

I just wish I could see a way to change it

[plainpainter 217]

Well, we still have the power of voting. But then again according to the bartender wearing a red wig in those Wendy's commercials - Choice don't mean a thing when there is nothing good to choose.

[Doug Dahlke 114]

"If you choose not to decide you still have made a choice."

Geddy Lee

[Beth n Rod 1,279]

"If you choose not to decide you still have made a choice."

Geddy Lee

Boy isn't that the truth!

Beth :cup:

[Beth n Rod 1,279]

"If you choose not to decide you still have made a choice."

Geddy Lee

Sorry to make a correction but that was Neal Pert-Drummer-lyrics writer-Rush. Still agree with it though as it is those choices that make us who we are.

Rod!~