Dawn & Bleach? Fume Issues! IS this safe???

[fireandrain 39]

Hey guys, so I went to mix up a batch of Dawn mixed with 3% bleach. Thought I read on this forum that this was a good all purpose cleaning mix. On the Dawn it says " Do NOT mix with Bleach"...so, naturally, I DID! :lgwave:

About 1o minutes later I felt like I was gonna pass out, so I masked up and got rid of the concoction.

I'm trying to get a good tip on a bleach/detergent mix that would be effective applying with my deckster and would take on mossy/moldy brickwork with an attitude. Is this Dawn/Bleach mix as bad an idea as I think?

[squirtgun 122]

Just how much did you mix?It takes very little dawn or any other soap to give the mix cling.Maybe 1 or 2 cups per 65 gallons of mix.

[Jeff 232]

The regular blue Dawn will give of a pretty strong smell/ odor/vapor and if you used a lot it would be worse. Apple Blossum Dawn doesnt have that problem

You can use Simple Cherry, it was designed for use with bleach

[seymore 90]

I've been sniffing Dawn n 12% for 10 yrs and i never really noticed the smell.I've also sniffed some strong substances thru the yrs. so maby i've lost a few CeLl BrAinS?? :cool:

Now when bleach and oxalic get mixed together that's about as bad it gets for fumes.

[HotShot 34]

get a respirator and you wouldn't have to worry about it.

[Greg R 82]

The Dawn didnt have ammonia in it by chance???

[RPetry 564]

Matt,

Greg's on to something. If the Dawn had ammonia in it, which is quite possible from your description of the label, you may have created a real fun gas.

Sodium hypochlorite mixed with ammonia creates "chlorine gas". Very effective in trench warfare in France during WWI. Killed 10's of thousands of soldiers.

[MMI Enterprises 289]

Think it is said that the bleach cleans or gets rid of mold by way of the chlorine gas so go figure... maybe it like that saying 'ya can't have one without the other'.

Ammonia is like a kicker or catylist and sets things off like all at once.. or something like that. If and when the dawn is mixed with percarb it can foam like nuts and cause an explosion if enclosed.....pssst , not a chemist, don't quote me.. :)

[RPetry 564]

If and when the dawn is mixed with percarb it can foam like nuts and cause an explosion if enclosed....

When I was just starting out, used Wolman's wood cleaner, a percarb based product. Mixed up a 5'er and after putting a few gallons in a backpack pump up, threw a lid on the 5 gal. bucket.

A few minutes later, that lid blew off that bucket as if a M-80 had exploded. Enclosed gas can create a bit of pressure. No Dawn needed.

[bigchaz 157]

Can bleach be mixed with S Hydroxide or a precarb?

[Integrity Curb Appeal 64]

Can bleach be mixed with S Hydroxide or a precarb?

Rod is the house chemist. Im sure he will have an answer and include reactivity data.

[RPetry 564]

Can bleach be mixed with S Hydroxide or a precarb?

Charlie,

I would guess there is no harm in mixing two or even all three together. If I understand correctly, you are specializing in exterior wood. To what purpose would you want to combine bleach, stripper, or sodium percarbonate?

Separately, all three chems have their use. But do not know of any need to mix them. Something new and different?

[Celeste 341]

You can mix bleach & sodium hydroxide - that's what's in Outdoor Bleach anyway. Bleach with a percarbonate is a big No-no though, the whole oxygenated bleach shouldn't be mixed with regular bleach thing.

[bigchaz 157]

Charlie,

I would guess there is no harm in mixing two or even all three together. If I understand correctly, you are specializing in exterior wood. To what purpose would you want to combine bleach, stripper, or sodium percarbonate?

Separately, all three chems have their use. But do not know of any need to mix them. Something new and different?

My main reasons would be that at least so far they both haven't been super effective at killing mold on their own. Granted there has been some dirty decks ive done.

But I recently cleaned a very dirty/moldy porch with 6oz of stripper per gallon. Look to me like it had cleaned quite well so I went ahead and brightened. but when the wood started to dry you could see lots of black mold and dirt still on the wood.

Anyhow, the customer had given me a bottle of olympic deck cleaner that I figured I would just throw out for him since hes moving. Once I saw that the wood was still dirty I figured what the heck and applied it. Almost instantly the wood looked 10 times better. I had the stripper dwelling for 20 minutes and this home depot stuff worked in 30 seconds.

The main ingredient in the stuff was water then sodium hypochlorite then surfecterent then sodium hydroxide. So I was wondering whether the bleach added to hydroxide would make a difference in another dirty deck I have coming up with lots of black mold. Precarb doesn't seem to be as effective at killing mold which is why I tried the hyroxide

[RPetry 564]

Charlie,

I agree that out of the three chems, percarbs seem to be the least effective in removing mold and mildew. NaOH seems to be somewhat better, but my guess would be a 1.5-2.5% sodium hypochlorite mix is the best of the three.

Not sure what NaOH in sodium hypochlorite does. Celeste mentioned "outdoor bleach" which I have never heard of. Know the laundry Clorox does contain a very small amount of NaOH but again, to what purpose, I have no idea.

Maybe Rod, Kevin, Plainpainter or other chem wiz can help out.

Have avoided using a bleach mix on raw wood for two reasons. First, it just seems to "dull" the coloring of the wood, and kind of also mutes the initial coloring of RS. Also seems to be some question if any acid can neutralize sodium hypochlorite. And with RS, I want the wood to be slightly acidic.

A light bleach and soap mix sure works great for RS maintenance though, when oil and pigment is still in the wood.

[bigchaz 157]

Yea the bleach does tend to make the wood a bit lighter, but the black mold is a pain in the butt to kill for some reason. Thinking maybe ill bleach while the wood is dirty and then use my cleaner/stripper and neutralize. The dirt might help keep the bleach from really getting into the wood, but hopefully effective enough to kill the mold before I clean

[seymore 90]

Thinking maybe ill bleach while the wood is dirty and then use my cleaner/stripper and neutralize.

I'll usually strip rinse then bleach then rinse reall good then use oxalic.The stripper will work faster than bleach and times bleach is not needed but it all depends on what the wood looks like.

[MMI Enterprises 289]

percarb and chlorine= a no no

chlorine = unsightly color to bare wood for some folks

However!

Acidic= lightening effects to new stain

Alkaline= darkening effects

...being chlorine is way alkaline seems sorta backwards..haha

[RPetry 564]

Charlie,

Listen to Shane. He is a bleach woodie extraordinaire! He and Jim Foley have won awards. The two founders of the BDA.

Seriously, both Shane and Jim use sodium hypochlorite with terrific results on exterior wood. I still only use it for RS maintenance, but probably do not run into the mold and mildew problems that others face.

There are some very old hands around in the wood business and once you get to know them and they trust you, extraordinary information and help is not far behind.

[bigchaz 157]

I'll usually strip rinse then bleach then rinse reall good then use oxalic.The stripper will work faster than bleach and times bleach is not needed but it all depends on what the wood looks like.

Thanks, good to hear from someone who know bleach. Imma use that order of stuff. I was just worried about the bleach and oxalic, but with rinsing real good ill assume you don't have any problems. Do you pressure wash after stripping or after bleach?