Armstrong-Clark maintenance

[RPetry 564]

I have had the good fortune to be mentored over the past several years by a semi-retired, 35 yr. + in the business, exterior wood contractor. Located in the Southwest, we have never met, but correspond and talk on the phone periodically.

For his own reasons, he prefers to remain anonymous. I have never seen him post anything on internet BBS's. But for the 2nd season now, he has been testing and using a lot of A-C stain. The following are 2 emails and pictures from him. Posted with permission.

_______________________________________________________________

Rick:

Redwood deck after 15 months in the Arizona sun at 5800 feet. The deck was coated with Armstrong Clark Cedar Semi. Deck sits on the southwest end of the house and can get 14 hours of sun daily. I do not think it really needed a recoat, however, we did it to test the ease (or difficulty) of cleaning and recoating A/C.

The deck was cleaned with TSP and Dawn liquid.

We were going to recoat the deck with an A/C toner, but with the severe exposure we decided to recoat with Cedar Semi again.

Next email will have the after recoating photos.

[RPetry 564]

Second email and pictures.

______________________________________

Rick

Here are a couple of photos of the recoated Cedar Semi deck.

It looks a little opaque because of the amount of prduct absorbed by this 12 year old deck.

You can quote these emails (or portions of them, as you wish)

"The oldest woodie in the world"

[PressurePros 248]

That seems to be a fairly extreme environment. I'm guessing equivalent to two full seasons here, Rick? Very impressive. I agree its a tad opaque, but not horribly so. In fact, most people would probably love that evenness of tone. Another semi educated guess would be that that deck will not need any type of maintenance for at least 24 months.

I've been holding off on going to the A/C exclusively as it is double the cost of what I have been using. The more I see though, the more I am getting convinced this is the best product on the market (of its type)

Edited June 9, 2009 by PressurePros

[RPetry 564]

Ken,

No doubt on the extreme environment! At 5800 ft. of altitude, there is a lot more UV. My friend also gets a ton of snow in his area in the winter. He told me stories of actually cleaning and staining decks while there was still 4 ft. of snow on the ground! The equivalent of 2 seasons here is plausible.

The Southwest has a terrific climate. Went to school in Denver and remember laying out in the sun with my girlfriend in a bikini (her, not me!) in February, with snow on the ground, getting a nice tan.

I agree on the quality of AC. It has held up very well on my own ipe' deck. We tried it last year on a cedar job with good results and may be using it on a cedar job later this year. But I'm still a hardcore paraffin oil advocate.

[plainpainter 217]

Wow - this thread really makes me feel good about using A.C. semisolid next week. If the semi-trans looks like that on a recoat - man the semisolid should really go through some abuse in the N.E!

[MMI Enterprises 289]

Have heard of this person...but I admit I know not for sure their history. Rumour has it they from the industry or some such.

Rick, tell us more or link us to any writeup results of the AC/ ipe thing. I have a someone interested in going more than the 6-9 month they been getting from other hardwood/exZotic type products. For life of me I can't think of a single reason just now on how a lite film of drying oil locking things away could be a bad thing on such a wood. Heck its able to take a heftier dose of washing so any of the familiar complaints of removal of drying oils are almost moot point. Its all gonna fail at some point from extractives but when exactly is that gonna be with AC? Only some nationwide test results are going to say is my feeling. I assume at least 1-2 year if not 3. AC's oil combo may indeed be more suitable to handle issues of extractives or whathave you trying to force and boil their way on out.. What ya think? :)

Edited June 9, 2009 by MMI Enterprises

[RPetry 564]

Have heard of this person...but I admit I know not for sure their history. Rumour has it they from the industry or some such.

Rick, tell us more or link us to any writeup results of the AC/ ipe thing. I have a someone interested in going more than the 6-9 month they been getting from other hardwood/exZotic type products. For life of me I can't think of a single reason just now on how a lite film of drying oil locking things away could be a bad thing on such a wood. Heck its able to take a heftier dose of washing so any of the familiar complaints of removal of drying oils are almost moot point. Its all gonna fail at some point from extractives but when exactly is that gonna be with AC? Only some nationwide test results are going to say is my feeling. I assume at least 1-2 year if not 3. AC's oil combo may indeed be more suitable to handle issues of extractives or whathave you trying to force and boil their way on out.. What ya think? :)

Kevin,

My mentor friend started an exterior wood restoration business back in the early to mid '70's. Grew to 20+ locations over time.

Nothing wrong with a drying oil on ipe'. Just have to be sure it is not over applied. I am now at a tad over 8 months of A-C rustic brown on my own ipe'. Has held its pigment very well, and if I could ever get time to clean it, would look fine. As with any decent oil without garbage additives, it will strip easily. I'll check back in on the appropriate thread when the stain gets to the one year mark.

Caveat. The Defy waterbase stain for hardwoods looks the best at this point from the samples I applied to my ipe' deck. But it is waterbased.

A-C is the best of the oils.

[Beth n Rod 1,279]

I'm having fun looking at photos of recent AC jobs. I'm going to have to choose one for that contest at some point!

Beth

[bigchaz 157]

Rick any idea what the initial application on that wood was? If it was a two coat originally, the semi trans probably is almost the third coat in less than two years. I imagine that would contribute to the more opaque look

[RPetry 564]

Rick any idea what the initial application on that wood was? If it was a two coat originally, the semi trans probably is almost the third coat in less than two years. I imagine that would contribute to the more opaque look

Charlie,

I do not know, but can ask.

Any idea what started the truck fire? None of us want to experience that disaster.

[RPetry 564]

Charlie,

The original application of A-C was one coat.

[Tonyg 14]

I'm happy that it has held up so well but I think I would go with a toner or Natural when it comes time. That almost looks like a semi-solid.

[acegot 14]

AC toner would be the best look on redwood, you dont have to give it so much pigment to get beauty, I rarely use semi transparents unless it is a really old beat up redwood deck.

[bigchaz 157]

Charlie,

I do not know, but can ask.

Any idea what started the truck fire? None of us want to experience that disaster.

Hey Rick they called to tell me they (insurance company) hired an engineering firm to try and determine the cause. If its manufacture related I reckon they try to get money from Chevy...although not sure how well that's gonna work. Got to get permission from CEO obama first

[ShineBrite LLC 14]

Great thread. Thanks for posting this Rick. I'm the backwards dummy down here in the heart of Dixie that's been hooked on AC for 4+ years now. We did our first total recoat week before last. I was on vacation while my guys did it, but I'm going by tomorrow to take some pics to add to this post. We have 3 more to recoat this week and next. One is the first AC job I did. Would be nice to have a distributor closer to me, but Steve at the Stain Shop is now getting the stuff to me in a record 3 days.

( I had to edit this reply, I typed the wrong name in for Steve - That's Steve James, BTW)

Will post here again either tomorrow night or over the weekend with pics of recots on Woodland Brown semi solid and Mt Cedar semi solid. On PT Pine - so before anyone questions my pics, remember, PT pine does funny things to pigments.

Alan Broom

Edited June 11, 2009 by ShineBrite LLC

[ShineBrite LLC 14]

Didn't get by the one we did earlier with woodland, but here's a recoat done today on a dock that I photographed in process. Mt Cedar, pt pine.

The first two pics were taken within 5 minutes of application, so it's wet. You can see the dull areas where it's already soaking in. The shiney spots are where it's wet -

The 2nd two pics are of the house at the same place. Job is 13 months old. The wood on the house did not get a recoat like the dock as it looked 100%. The dock had very minor loss around the knots and this homeowner keeps the place beyond perfect and she's a regular customer, so recoat we did. Dock gets full sun dawn to dusk.

Will post woodland brn recoats soon

[RPetry 564]

Alan,

Real good pictures. Appears that A-C holds up very well in your climate.

Gotta' say though, it is a very opaque stain. Does not accentuate, but masks the grain of the wood.

[acegot 14]

Yea, there is a lot of pigment in that semi-solid. Here is a pic of an old redwood deck I did last week. Armstrong cedar semi-trans. We'll see what it looks like in a year, full sun.

Edited June 28, 2009 by acegot
addedpic

[Scott Paul 164]

Looks good!

[ShineBrite LLC 14]

Wow, throw in a few hundred knots, one or two split boards, several cracked boards and a handfull of warped boards and I could pass that off as 2 yr old PT pine here in the south.

Seriously though, that looks great!

[Tonyg 14]

Wow, throw in a few hundred knots, one or two split boards, several cracked boards and a handfull of warped boards and I could pass that off as 2 yr old PT pine here in the south.

Seriously though, that looks great!

Ya know, I kept looking at it and thats exactly what was missing - knots. Wood is such a beautiful thing but wood without knots would be really nice. I think the Teamsters have it so nothing other that PTP will be shipped here.

That's some pretty work!

[acegot 14]

Tony, here is another NO Knots for you.

Edited June 18, 2009 by acegot
added

[RPetry 564]

Lyle,

Real nice work and pictures. It seems that redwood is very common on the west coast, similar to PTSYP here in the east. Redwood is much more attractive and probably better suited as a material for exterior decks.

Have to disagree with the knots look. We work on a lot of western red cedar here, and I find the knotty cedar to be much more attractive and interesting than the clear.

[acegot 14]

Lyle,

Real nice work and pictures. It seems that redwood is very common on the west coast, similar to PTSYP here in the east. Redwood is much more attractive and probably better suited as a material for exterior decks.

Have to disagree with the knots look. We work on a lot of western red cedar here, and I find the knotty cedar to be much more attractive and interesting than the clear.

I do alot of redwood with knots & they look great, great color & charactor. Here is WRC with no knots though. Tony, another for you & "no knot" lovers.

[RPetry 564]

I do alot of redwood with knots & they look great, great color & charactor. Here is WRC with no knots though. Tony, another for you & "no knot" lovers.

Lyle,

That is great looking redwood with a real nice color of A-C stain.

I always assumed redwood is essentially knot free. Have only had the pleasure of working on 2 redwood jobs here in NJ, and both woods were clear.

[acegot 14]

[ATTACH]12352[/ATTACH]

Lyle,

That is great looking redwood with a real nice color of A-C stain.

I always assumed redwood is essentially knot free. Have only had the pleasure of working on 2 redwood jobs here in NJ, and both woods were clear.

Actually, most of the redwood, over half that I see, is con-heart(with knots) since the quit cutting old growth .

Rick, here is "knotty" picture for you.

Edited June 18, 2009 by acegot