Beth n Rod 1,279 Report post Posted February 20, 2005 Here's a shot of both HD-80 and F-18 in action, side by side, stripping an IPE deck. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
0 PressurePros 249 Report post Posted February 21, 2005 I'm missing the point.. are you saying the F-18 is just as good, not as good, not hot enough to strip the O? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
0 R. Williamson 14 Report post Posted February 21, 2005 Both stripped the sealer. The F-18 side is brighter which indicates the F-18 has a lower PH balance. Even after brightner/nuetralizer was applied the F-18 side was brighter. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
0 Beth n Rod 1,279 Report post Posted February 21, 2005 Right. The F-18 was not as alkaline, and still did the job. I'll have to look for the brightened shot. The deck did not turn out uneven in the end, but the initiall application of brightener does show one side brightened more than the other. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
0 aph111 14 Report post Posted February 21, 2005 I thought a lower PH is more alkaline. Robert:The F-18 side is brighter which indicates the F-18 has a lower PH balance. Beth: Right. The F-18 was not as alkaline Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
0 Beth n Rod 1,279 Report post Posted February 21, 2005 The darker the wood turns the more alkaline it is. When you brighten with an acid, the surface turns lighter in color. Beth Read this: http://www.thegrimescene.com/forums/showthread.php?t=50 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
0 reed 500 Report post Posted February 21, 2005 I thought a lower PH is more alkaline. neutral pH is 7.0 anything above is considered alkalinic, anything below is acidic. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
0 Beth n Rod 1,279 Report post Posted February 21, 2005 Lower in alkalinity is what he meant by lower pH balance. Many strippers are around 12-14pH 14 being the highest in alkalinity or causticity. Causticity alone is not what does the stripping. The ability to interact with the coating and break its bond by changing the pH is the primary function. Causticity is part of it, reactivity is the other component. Not all caustics will react with a surface the same way. This is decided molecularly. Rod~ Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
0 PressurePros 249 Report post Posted February 21, 2005 I have heard other contractors say the HD-80 has a high furring incidence (whether true or false I cannot say as I did not witness their individual stripping techniques) Using low pressure to wash, is it fair to assume that the F-18 will have less of a tendency to furr and darken cedar? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
0 Beth n Rod 1,279 Report post Posted February 22, 2005 Using low pressure to wash, is it fair to assume that the F-18 will have less of a tendency to furr and darken cedar? Depends entirely on the dwell time and the strength of your mix. HD-80 happens to have a very high causticity because of the caustic builders incorporated into the formulation. F-18 is not quite as high on the pH level as HD-80. The most common fuzzies occur where the sealer being removed is thinner in some areas than others especially around the middle of the deck and the pickets. Decking around the rails is usually the thickest due to overspray and drips from previous application. Here is a good rule of thumb: Too strong for too long makes fuzzies. In all fairness to either product, if the reaction is allowed to go on unchecked, this will result in a greater chance of fuzzies. F-18's formulation utilizes other chemicals to bring on the reaction and so therefore is easier to control. HD-80 is like its name sake acronym HEAVY DUTY! This product was developed to go through numerous layers of some of the most rediculous stuff on the market. Its action is quick and relentless. (note pic above in post #1) The right side is HD-80 taking no prisoners. At 4oz./gal, it was overkill on this test. The left is F-18, doing its job in a different way, more like finessing the sealer off the wood. At 6oz./gal, it was doing a great job. In order to avoid fuzzies, attention to the color change should be monitored and watered down if the reaction proves to be quick in some areas by just applying a light spray of water to them. Conduct your test spots around the rail system and right under the rail cap and top of the spindles. These are the areas that will give you the most challenge, the sun exposed areas will be easier, modify your dillution to suit these areas or dont apply as heavily. Practicing this will develop the proper technique to get a great strip without making more work for you afterwards. Regarding the last question of F-18 on cedar...our tests have not been completed. Stay tuned for more this spring. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
0 reed 500 Report post Posted February 22, 2005 I have had a lesser amount of "furring" using the F18 on the decks I do, rich are 99 percent cedar. Why this is could be due to a number of factors as was stated above. The number one reason I can contribute less fuzzies is the strength of the F18 I used to get the job done. Reed Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
0 James 625 Report post Posted February 22, 2005 It's not April Fool's day is it ? Looks like you took brite'ner and did oneside . LOL... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
0 Beth n Rod 1,279 Report post Posted February 22, 2005 Doesn't it? But it's not. Those are two different strippers working side by side. Beth Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Here's a shot of both HD-80 and F-18 in action, side by side, stripping an IPE deck.
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