Political thread jump start :)

[Celeste 341]

Hillary Clinton 'in to win' White House - Yahoo! News

Have at it guys - just keep it "nice" LOL

[Jeff 232]

I'm doing a write in vote to reelect George W. Bush for a 3rd term or just get **** Chenney to rewrite the law as he see's it, Executive Privilege rules, who needs congress or even the people . GW & DC 4 more years

Vote Republican in 2008

[Chappy 138]

Jeff,

Im glad you finally see it my way.

[Deck Guy 14]

Is that really news? I think we all saw this coming.

I'm with Jeff. All Hail, King George!

[RPetry 564]

If that self serving, mealy mouthed squirrel is elected President of the United States, me and mine are fleeing the country for Costa Rica.

Hillary Clinton is synonymous to leadership and responsiblities for Chief of State as Barry Manilow and Barbara Streisand are to good music.

And yes, Celeste, I am being very nice.

[Celeste 341]

And yes, Celeste, I am being very nice.

I meant be nice to each other, not the politicians :)

Celeste

[RyanH 14]

Hmmm. Given our current relationship with the middle east, and considering their disdain for females, I really don't see ...damn, I hate to call her a "her" given her cold and lifeless demeanor...the candidate being of much use to us in a global diplomatic role.

[Deck Guy 14]

Though some Arab countries have reservations in giving their women certain rights, they haven't had difficulty dealing with other country's female representatives. Ever hear of Golda Meir?? She was an absolute hardass!

Peoples perceptions about Hillary are interesting, given that I have never really seen many candid moments. If I recall, Senator McCain said several years ago that he was surprised, after having spent some time with her alone on an airplane, that he found her...charming and engaging. Not at all what he had expected.

Again, I really don't know anything about her, so maybe you guys are just more perceptive than I, or people who know her personally. Interestingly, the traits which you attribute to her sound like many male politicians (**** Cheney isn't exactly a charmer, is he?). Yet we somehoe expect a female to smile and act pretty. Maybe there's a bit of unintended sexism under all the hatred thrown her way.

Frankly, I really believe we could change the constitution (who really cares about that old thing anyway) and get George W back in for another 4-20 years. We could just make the presidency a lifetime post! After all, we are in a time of war which (I believe) justifies anything he cares to do. He already has established his superior statesmanship (or globally diplomatic, to paraphrase Ryan), exemplary communication skills, and ability to mobilize our allies in our cause! Who could want anything more in a president!

[RPetry 564]

The United States constitution is a hallowed piece of art that has served this country well for over 200 yrs.

Lets be serious. With contiuing breakthroughs in genetic technology in short time we will be able to raise the dead. Given that astounding ability, who better to lead this country and be King if agreed, than the finest leader of the 20th century.

No one can hold a candle to history's greatest, Winston Churchill.

"To be conservative at 20 is heartless and to be a liberal at 60 is plain idiocy."

This is the finest, most astute and insightful political statement ever made. We could sure use a Winnie now.

[Jeff 232]

This upcoming 2008 election is going to exceed $1,000,000,000 BILLION......Thats just ridiculous and a shame

Maybe we could just clone GW & DC then we would have it made

VOTE REPUBLICAN in 2222

ONE BILLION $$$$ anybody see something wrong with this picture

[Deck Guy 14]

The United States constitution is a hallowed piece of art that has served this country well for over 200 yrs.

Not in a time of war!

When we can effectively clone, my vote goes for FDR!

[Jeff 232]

Is that really news? I think we all saw this coming.

I'm with Jeff. All Hail, King George!

Love the bumper stickers, you commie, liberal, atheist, tree hugging, global warming lying, pig

Hail to KING GW, at least he's got the middle east under control

Vote DEM in 2008, No Republican, No Vote for Ryan, No vote for me, Hell dont even bother voting they dont listen to us anyway!!!!!!!

[Doug Dahlke 114]

I would never vote for Hillary Clinton. I voted for Bush both times but if he could run again I wouldn't vote for him either. I do believe in the constitution and it is the reason this country was great. It has been trashed by both political parties and an electorate that is more concerned about the next American Idol than their liberty and indivdual rights. The Republicans have their heads so far into their posterior regions that they don't even realize that is why they just lost control of both houses in the last election.

[Deck Guy 14]

I can't vote for her simply because that would make Rush Limbaugh's job too easy. He's already had 12 years to hate on her. If anybody feels inclined to vote for a commie pinko liberal, at least put some other idealistic schmuck on his altar!

[RyanH 14]

If she'd promise to get the FairTax passed, as it is currently written and without any alteration, I'd vote for her. Of course, GW said he'd do certain things too and that hasn't happened (remember abolishing the death tax? Still there...)

Does anyone remember why we went to Kosovo? She didn't seem to have a problem with her husband sending our boys over there. Of course, that was also aptly timed to quickly snuff out the media attention over Monica Lewinsky. In fact, she's only had problems with things when it has been pushed by the other party. It's only popular to bash a prospect when an opponent pushes it, not when someone in your own party does it. Personally, I'm tired of the baseball politics where people vote according to teams and not accomplishments. As a champion of individual responsibility and acheivement, I couldn't care less about party affiliation. It isn't very often when you meet someone to whom you can say "what you do speaks so loudly that I can't hear what you say." As for Hillary, well, her past actions speak so loudly that I can't say enough bad things to trump them, and she can't say enough good things to hide them.

Oh, and if you want to see how Democrats are slowly want to strip away and damn the character of our Constitution, do a few searches on the "Fairness Doctrine." Sounds EXACTLY what Ayn Rand wrote about over 50 years ago, and that stemmed from her experience with a communist government.

And you want this phony as the First Man?

[HotShot 34]

I am actually a little scared for conservatives in the coming 2008 elections. There are far too many limp wristed republicans that call them conservative when they are far from it in reality. I think a true conservative will be hard to find that will actually be popular enough to make it to the big-time. I sure hope they do, but as of now, I don't see it happening.

Will the "real" conservatives in public service please stand up?

[JFife 14]

Ant,

......I am standing!! Unfortunately most would call me a radical, fanatic, hawk, fascist (though incorrect), or some other term for the people on the "right" side of the issues. Remember my Amendment I want to make to the Consti.......the one where you not only have to be 18 to vote, but also are not allowed to vote until you have paid a certain amount (40K-75K) into the tax system?? Think how many problems that would solve!! No more people voting for entitlements that will actually receive the entitlements......the people paying the money will have the say. You'd keep people that don't work out of the voting booths. You'd cut down on women voters....as many would be on "maternity leave" before they hit the 40K-75K taxation amount. This would be the solution to our current dilemma of moron lawmakers. People that would actually be functional and effective would start running for offices. Fife in 2012:)

[HotShot 34]

J-FI...

I can see your point, but there are some problems with that. I am going out on a limb here, but I would say that most conservative women are stay-at-home moms that are actually at home raising their kids and they wouldn't be able to vote???? That's not right. $40 K in some parts of the country is A LOT of money and would not include a lot of hard working people.

I'm not sure that money is the issue...I don't mind EVERYBODY having a right to vote, but I do think that if a politician is caught in a lie, they should automatically be banned from the process. How many times have you watched a debate on tv and and said to yourself...that's a lie!!! I think that if you (the politician) or your staff get caught lying..you're disqualified!!!! I think this country should raise the standard for our public servants instead of brushing off the little things like rape and lying to a federal judge and you know, little things like that :rolleyes: It makes me sick when I hear people take up for a politician that has done something wrong by saying "well, that's his/her personal life"...

I also think that if a guest is invited on a tv program like Hannity & Colmes or Orielly or something like that and they are caught lyiing they should not be invited back on the program and they should keep a list running at the bottom of all the liars that have been kicked off the show...I don't care if they're dems or repubs...I think the truth is more important and I think that conservatives have a better arguement for ideas on how to run the country when lying is taken out of the equation.

[Jeff 232]

Far right Far Left

I'd like to see the middle of the road and people actually work together. Oh ya this is the 21st century in American politics, we're doomed

ONE BILLION DOLLARS for an election period, ridiculous

I dont want Hillary, but I'd like to see her get in just for the FUN of seeing all you guys FREAKING out.

I'm interested in Richardson or Biden.....MCcain I was interested in, but he for a losing policy in Iraq, he was right a few years ago, to want to send more troops, but why now, 20,000 troops how long will that help the overall picture. now 200,000 might work

VOTE DEM IN 08

[RyanH 14]

Will the "real" conservatives in public service please stand up?

:lgjump:

Keep your eyes open....I'm going to start working on something in the next 5 years. I'd be doing something now if I didn't have so much fun in my current job. I'm going to have to bite my tongue though and most likely enter under one of the two super-parties. Hmmm....I'm just liberal enough when it comes to certain issues that I will most likely run on the democratic ticket.

Drugs? Regulate them like alcohol. Heck, tax them even. Take the money we currently spend on the drug war and put it into rehabilitation. Stop the use by education, not with more guns on the street to stop dealers. Prostitution? Personally not for me, but who am I to judge if someone else wants to pay for a little strange every now and then? Gay marriage? Only a fool would think that a "marriage" can be anything other that something sanctioned by a church, but I'm all for legal unions. Gay adoption...I have many reservations about that. I'd have to draw the line there Alcohol? Jesus partied with the best of them, and when the house wine ran out he turned water into even better wine. So I have no problem with drinking, although the idea of getting drunk and losing capacity of one's own self is rather pathetic and I do look down upon that.

Yeah, Republicans won't like me too much for those issues, but they WILL like my capitalist approach and fiscal conservatism. And most "hard working Americans" should appreciate my fresh approach of not taking any crap. If what you say isn't true, I won't gloss over it during a debate and let you get away with it, I"ll make you defend yourself to the very end and, if I disagree with it, I'll say with certainty and clarification why I disagree. Americans deserve representatives who represent them, not someone who just wants a government paycheck and only needs to say some words and dress nicely to get it. My main detraction is I haven't served in the military, but I HAVE personally thanked a few hundred when I come across them in the airports and sit next to them on planes. I may not have served, but I do appreciate and applaud their committment.

[JFife 14]

J-FI...

I can see your point, but there are some problems with that. I am going out on a limb here, but I would say that most conservative women are stay-at-home moms that are actually at home raising their kids and they wouldn't be able to vote???? That's not right. $40 K in some parts of the country is A LOT of money and would not include a lot of hard working people.

:)LOL, you are defending that side because it probably describes your wife (conservative/at home). Mrs. Ant will need to take one for the team under the Fife Plan. Sure, there are good women voters, but the majority (probably 60-65%) are too liberal. 40K too high?? Okay, let's say 30K. Here it is--if 25% of your $$ is going to taxes, and a person is making $24,000.00 a year, at 6K in per year it would take them five yrs to be able to vote. That is a LOW salary, and assuming you hadn't put in before turning 18.

You're right--it's not a "money" thing--it's an Entitlement thing. Here is why my idea is sound: People always complain (both sides) that they are tired of "dumb, uneducated" voters. I don't like some welfare crankwhore being able to vote. Dems don't like the idea of Herschel coming in from the backwoods with a Rebelflag on his truck and just voting a party line. But you cannot eliminate the idiots without being called a racist/bigot/etc. The Fife Plan doesn't allow anyone to be called those names. Hard-working, taxpaying citizens get to vote---simple as that. If Crankwhore pays her taxes, she gets to vote. If Herschel will leave Munchkintown and has paid his dues, he can vote.

The beauty of the Fife Plan is that it makes people realize, if they want entitlements, they'll be paying their fairshare. Otherwise, the "payers" get to determine who gets what......not some bleeding heart Donkey who is pandering to get votes.

I'm not sure that money is the issue...I don't mind EVERYBODY having a right to vote, but I do think that if a politician is caught in a lie, they should automatically be banned from the process. How many times have you watched a debate on tv and and said to yourself...that's a lie!!! I think that if you (the politician) or your staff get caught lying..you're disqualified!!!! I think this country should raise the standard for our public servants instead of brushing off the little things like rape and lying to a federal judge and you know, little things like that :rolleyes: It makes me sick when I hear people take up for a politician that has done something wrong by saying "well, that's his/her personal life"...

I also think that if a guest is invited on a tv program like Hannity & Colmes or Orielly or something like that and they are caught lyiing they should not be invited back on the program and they should keep a list running at the bottom of all the liars that have been kicked off the show...I don't care if they're dems or repubs...I think the truth is more important and I think that conservatives have a better arguement for ideas on how to run the country when lying is taken out of the equation.

You see things very black and white. I'd tend to see a gray area in there every now and then. Regarding "caught lying" etc......my thought is, "Don't ask them the question in the first place." I think a big problem we have is that really high-quality people are afraid to run for office because they'll get smeared and every skeleton they've ever placed in a closet will be brought out.

[JFife 14]

:lgjump:

Keep your eyes open....I'm going to start working on something in the next 5 years. I'd be doing something now if I didn't have so much fun in my current job. I'm going to have to bite my tongue though and most likely enter under one of the two super-parties. Hmmm....I'm just liberal enough when it comes to certain issues that I will most likely run on the democratic ticket.

Glad to hear that Ryan!! Definitely think it is in your calling.

Drugs? Regulate them like alcohol. Heck, tax them even. Take the money we currently spend on the drug war and put it into rehabilitation. Then what are you going to do with all those poor Drug Cops jobs?? How about stopping rehabilitation funding and putting that money into more cops!! Or maybe just do what they did in Season3 of 'The Wire'. The thing that I don't like about legalization is I'd be very concerned what it would do to RealEstate values, etc. Stop the use by education, not with more guns on the street to stop dealers. Prostitution? Personally not for me, but who am I to judge if someone else wants to pay for a little strange every now and then? Gay marriage? Only a fool would think that a "marriage" can be anything other that something sanctioned by a church, but I'm all for legal unions. Gay adoption...I have many reservations about that. All of these things.....to me, you're simply not taking the correct moral stand. Better stated, you're not taking a stand in-line with Christianity, IMO. While I might agree, they all seem like you're just fighting one big uphill battle, that doesn't/shouldn't mean you just concede all ground. Re: gay adoption--while it might sound detestable, is it worse than a kid growing up in foster care?? I'd be completely against it if there were more hetero couples looking to adopt vs. potential children, but that isn't the case. I'd have to draw the line there Alcohol? Jesus partied with the best of them, and when the house wine ran out he turned water into even better wine. So I have no problem with drinking, although the idea of getting drunk and losing capacity of one's own self is rather pathetic and I do look down upon that.

Yeah, Republicans won't like me too much for those issues, but they WILL like my capitalist approach and fiscal conservatism. And most "hard working Americans" should appreciate my fresh approach of not taking any crap. If what you say isn't true, I won't gloss over it during a debate and let you get away with it, I"ll make you defend yourself to the very end and, if I disagree with it, I'll say with certainty and clarification why I disagree. Americans deserve representatives who represent them, not someone who just wants a government paycheck and only needs to say some words and dress nicely to get it. My main detraction is I haven't served in the military, but I HAVE personally thanked a few hundred when I come across them in the airports and sit next to them on planes. I may not have served, but I do appreciate and applaud their committment.

Fiscally you'd make a great candidate that I'd support---and that means as much to me as the moral stuff. Personally, I think the moral questions should be dealt with on a more personal level--like in the home, church, etc. Not really politics, or it shouldn't so much be.

Re: your military service---you could go down and try to get in, and have them decline you based on your weight, eyesight, or something like that. Then you can go into your debates and answer with all the sincerity you can muster: "I did everything I could to be a United States Marine, but I had some physical limitations that prevented it." On the Scumbag Scale, that would actually probably score quite low compared to most politicians:)

[John T 744]

Hey Jon---I like your title there "The Fife Plan" and actually got a kick out of reading it but..it would never work and if you tried to debate it somewhere you'd be laughed off the stage. That would be an easy debate for anyone to crush you and its because of your views about ladies voting and also the other problems that will arise from this strange view point.

Since you are stating that people must make a certain amount of money to vote and if a lady is home raising children where really that is one of the toughest and most rewarding jobs to do but doesn't pay in monetary value she has no right to vote...boy that would get you chased off of a debate team an ran right out of the building..and not just for that. What you are also eliminating here is many other people's right to vote...such as the disabled who may not have the ability to make a decent earning. Here's a morbid example for you that should put this to bed. What about some hero serving in the military who might have got his leg shot off there and is now home..and let's say because of this he is having a hard time making money besides his disability check he is recieving and to compound all of this he now is suffering from depression. You have to really root for this guy/gal to pull thru...but according to your plan since they are not earning enough they will now lose there right to vote.

The "Fife Plan" needs to be alot more thought out because where it is now anybody would love to be debating the "Fife Plan" because of all the potential problems with it. That would be an easy debate...It was funny reading it though.

[John T 744]

Ryan has some good idea's and just because he never served that shouldn't stop him from running for any type of office. Bill Clinton never served and he protested against us in a foreign country when he was young. G W Bush didn't really serve either with his crap about all of his missed time as a National Guards men reservist.

The problem with Ryan's plan is taxing drugs. It sounds like a good idea but basically what your doing there is you have to legalize it to tax it. Now what they do is they take all of your earnings if your selling drugs and throw you in jail. Besides legalizing drugs which is so morally wrong why make it easier for kids and young adults to have easier access to drugs because there legal. The war on drugs should never end.

If Ryan could ever run where his ticket was that he was running as a "Regular Joe" who has normal everyday problems like most Americans do and what his plans were to fix some of those problems..I'd vote for him. The unfortunate thing here is that you really have to be a politician to win. You have to be a great salesman and you have to please so many with money to get there support. Why does anyone suppose Hillary Clinton has a 100 million in her campaign fund. She didn't get it from most of the regular Joe's that I know. It's a cynical view I have on politicians and how there system works.

I hope in my lifetime a regular guy or gal makes it all the way to the White House.

[Jeff 232]

:lgjump:

Keep your eyes open....I'm going to start working on something in the next 5 years. I'd be doing something now if I didn't have so much fun in my current job. I'm going to have to bite my tongue though and most likely enter under one of the two super-parties. Hmmm....I'm just liberal enough when it comes to certain issues that I will most likely run on the democratic ticket.

Drugs? Regulate them like alcohol. Heck, tax them even. Take the money we currently spend on the drug war and put it into rehabilitation. Stop the use by education, not with more guns on the street to stop dealers. Prostitution? Personally not for me, but who am I to judge if someone else wants to pay for a little strange every now and then? Gay marriage? Only a fool would think that a "marriage" can be anything other that something sanctioned by a church, but I'm all for legal unions. Gay adoption...I have many reservations about that. I'd have to draw the line there Alcohol? Jesus partied with the best of them, and when the house wine ran out he turned water into even better wine. So I have no problem with drinking, although the idea of getting drunk and losing capacity of one's own self is rather pathetic and I do look down upon that.

Yeah, Republicans won't like me too much for those issues, but they WILL like my capitalist approach and fiscal conservatism. And most "hard working Americans" should appreciate my fresh approach of not taking any crap. If what you say isn't true, I won't gloss over it during a debate and let you get away with it, I"ll make you defend yourself to the very end and, if I disagree with it, I'll say with certainty and clarification why I disagree. Americans deserve representatives who represent them, not someone who just wants a government paycheck and only needs to say some words and dress nicely to get it. My main detraction is I haven't served in the military, but I HAVE personally thanked a few hundred when I come across them in the airports and sit next to them on planes. I may not have served, but I do appreciate and applaud their committment.

You'll be like the rest of the libertarians, unelectable. Dont quit your day job!!!!!!! You'd be torn apart in a State or national election, legalize drugs, they'll say your a qauck. Never legalize something that hurts so many

[RyanH 14]

This should be a thread of it's own, not to hijaak the original post from Celeste. On my views regarding "moral" issues, the overall point is I don't think it should be anything other than local issues. Too many people turn to the Federal government to decide how local authorities should operate. As for the "drug" thing, being legal or illegal won't change people's desire to or to not use them. Remember prohibition many years back? The many gangs that arose as a result? Anytime something is made to be illegal there will always be parties willing to war over them. Legalizing drugs isn't going to cause a nation of drug addicts, but it WILL keep tennagers from shootings cops in the face when they are pulled over for speeding and they don't want the cop to find the small baggie of pot under the seat. It will keep an army of cops from tearing down the door to someone's house and terrorizing the occupants because there is *suspected* drug trade going on (Atlanta recently). Alcohol and cigarettes are all around us, and I never chose to smoke, and I drink so rarely it's not even an issue. I went to Jamaica a few years back, easy and legal access to pot and coke, and I stayed clear. Look at how much money is spent fighting drugs in our country, and it isn't improving. People find new ways to get it here and manufacture it in their own homes. The profit margin is so high that traffickers can afford to pay humans to pack this crap into their systems and travel from point A to B to transport. I"m saying take away that incentive. It may not be a perfect plan, but when selling pounds of drugs ranks above serious crimes like rape and murder, something is seriously screwed up in our society. My wife works in a law firm and many of their clients are in on drug possession charges...many of these people have been responsible and respectable members of society for YEARS and now that they were found with drugs, all of a sudden they are deserving of YEARS in prison? To serve what purpose? As a deterrent to others? Whatever. I say preserve our prisons for those who would do harm to our society. There is a difference between outright legalization and regulation.

And not saying my focus would be go get these things legalized, just saying how I would swing should the issue come up. My focus will be grounded in security and fiscal responsibility (no building bridges to nowhere on my watch!)