sthom21 14 Report post Posted February 25, 2009 OK, I will risk stepping into the fire here. I am a Newbie. Only my second year coming up, and part time on top of being a newbie. I have done several house washes, a few sidewalks, 3 decks, 1 fence and several roofs. But, I have a whole lot yet to learn. I do not consider myself to be in the same class as most of you here. I feel I have a long road to get there. I really appreciate all the help and information I have gotten from the various BBS's. It has helped me to avoid mistakes I am certain I would have made otherwise. Reading all the comments about lowballers made me very cognizant of my pricing strategy so as not be labelled a lowballer. I have lost more than a few jobs because I wouldn't drop my price, so I am not a lowballer by any means. I have spoken to a few of the regulars here and have gotten great advice from one of my local competitors. I respect him for his willingness to help me, the industry and ultimately himself by sharing information. I say he is ultimately helping himself because I will refer jobs that I am not ready for to him simply because he was so willing to help even though we are technically competitors. I think that takes alot of class and professionalism. You might say it set the "Diamond" standard. I don't expect something for nothing from these boards. When I have something constructive to add, I do. Unfortunately, I do not yet have the knowledge to add something new to most posts because someone with alot more experience has already made the point I was thinking of. In the end, it is up to each of us individually to decide to either help a newbie out or leave them to their own devices and hope for the best. I intend to help others whenever I can. The same way others have helped me. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Ron Musgraves 240 Report post Posted February 25, 2009 Sorry guys, I will keep educating them and raise the standards so high we will all be better off. Power in Knowledge!!!!!!!!! It has never hurt me , its helped my market. We work together and share info like any other trade. If you have one account and loose it, thats your fault. You cant loose good customers with good realation to someone who competes. You can loose them to a hack that doesnt know what to charge. Teach and train, of course trade secrets are trade secrets. Shhhhhhhhhhhhhh Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Ron Musgraves 240 Report post Posted February 25, 2009 So, I think that it is actually to my benefit to help someone buy and setup the proper equipment, as well as being nice to them as they get new customers, so that I am in the proper position to pick up the pieces. But that is just me, and that Darn Ron hasn't gone bankrupt Great thread!!! Guys, if you beleive that not helping is the answer? Why are you here? If you give , you get!!!!!!!!!!! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
All Surface 24 Report post Posted February 25, 2009 Great thread!!!Guys, if you beleive that not helping is the answer? Why are you here? If you give , you get!!!!!!!!!!![/quote] +1 I agree completely Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Christopher 102 Report post Posted February 25, 2009 I agree with what most of you have said here. That thread on PT State could have been a lot more professional, it could have been a warning on the market situation in Michigan and how the economy is very bad there instead of being more of a discouraging ramble. I have been helped a lot on the boards and I have tried to help a lot of people on many of the boards but I will help them as long as they do something to help themselves like doing a lot of reading on the older threads on topics they are interested in and when they have questions, just ask. That thread could have been handled totally different in so many ways. I agree with Tony, I have spoke with Tony some in the past and he is a great person and a great businessman. I understand his concerns and feel bad about what happened to him when he tried to help out a new person. That is a shame and could happen to any one of us at any time, we have to be careful of who we help. We always need to remember that our potential customers can and do view the bbs out there and will see how we act and that might be a determining factor if we are called to bid on a job or not. Most of us do not mind helping out others as long as we feel like we can trust them and hope we don't get burned with our goodwill efforts. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Ron Musgraves 240 Report post Posted February 25, 2009 So, I think that it is actually to my benefit to help someone buy and setup the proper equipment, as well as being nice to them as they get new customers, so that I am in the proper position to pick up the pieces. But that is just me, and that Darn Ron hasn't gone bankrupt. Scott and I have bumped head a little, we always remain freinds despite him lowballing me.LOL serious we work together and with others, I cant give specifics but we watch out for one another. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Mike Williamson 198 Report post Posted February 26, 2009 I just read a thread on ptstate - another typical guy coming on for the first time asking about square tanks vs. round - wants to know if a van setup is good to chase commercial and residential, as that what he plans to do. And to boot he's in South Michigan.Now I got this sick feeling in my stomach - like ughh - another newbie who thinks the pressure washing trade is good money and will be doing $89 house washes. What I want to know - is it responsible to congratulate the guy and give him the confidence for starting up a new business - especially someone that sounds like they never had a business before nor any real experience with pressure washing? Is it in our own self interestes to welcome guys aboard during this economy? Call me selfish - but I feel like I will be struggling just to make ends meat - that I am working day and night trying to understand SEO just so I can get a decent website ranking and maybe make an extra couple of grand in sales I wouldn't have last season - I really want to discourage anyone from coming into the trades right now. I just don't need the headaches of dealing with $89 guys right now, especially when I know they won't last anyways. I remember when you first showed up, and sounded like you had no realy experience with pressurewashing. Most of us have been in that position. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Russ Spence 76 Report post Posted February 26, 2009 I remember when you first showed up, and sounded like you had no realy experience with pressurewashing. Most of us have been in that position. We all have. It is funny to me the number of guys who show up and spend 6 months to a year around the BBS scene, then they seemingly know everything, then vanish into thin air. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Alexy 85 Report post Posted February 26, 2009 We all have. It is funny to me the number of guys who show up and spend 6 months to a year around the BBS scene, then they seemingly know everything, then vanish into thin air. Yeah, It's called back to Walmart full time... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Beth n Rod 1,279 Report post Posted February 26, 2009 I can really appreciate Scott Thompsons post because it provides a perspective that many of us forget. We were all newbies at one time and I am sure that the threat we all perceive is that information is so much more readily available than when we first started (10 years ago for us as an example) that getting started is probably easier now than it was then. Although information is not available in a structured learning environment, what can be derived by an eager start up is quite amazing. I agree with Scott Stone that pricing is a subject I do not like to discuss. I can give example formulas and provide an insight where all that is necessary is to plug in actual figures unique to the individuals business and they have something to work with. Frankly, I would like to see someone succeed rather than fail because the damage left behind by someone who does fail is an image of our industry that is hard to overcome. People begin to think of us in unfavorable ways because of some (not all) novice and often unscrupulous companies and we have to work harder to change their perception. There is an attrition rate and those who survive will become a competitor. In some areas, there is not enough work to go around and having another competitor means less money for the one already established. Does this mean we should not educate? No, I don't think so because these companies will learn to diversify and offer other services to make up the difference. We see it a great deal as it is. I myself have made some comments about "lowballers" in the past and you know what? It was based upon my mindset at the time and perhaps how I got beat by one and I know that they don't provide the quality of service we do but what can I do? I move on and wait for that one to call me in a year or two to take up where the other left off. Does that excuse me for the derogatory statement? No. My appolgies to those who may have taken offense. My bad day should not be their label. Rod!~ Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Tegrey 121 Report post Posted February 26, 2009 Dan, Believe it or not, we were all new at one time. Most of us didn't have a lot of experience and we usually charged too low for the work we did. Hopefully within a few years we learn how to run a business and grow our business. Most are having trouble today, because they did not plan on a slow down. Our businesses are the example of what we do. Having any competition is better then no competition in my view. Thank You. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
TNRoofCleaner 16 Report post Posted May 18, 2009 I am new to these forums and have learned alot of information by reading. I am basically forced to start my own business or move to the NE or CA and I don't want to do either. Now because of these forums I have a low pressure rig set up for under $1200 ladders, tank and trailer included. There are always going to be hacks and weekend warriors and tight wads to deal with but there is only so much room for that kind of work. People will pay extra for quality work if that is what they are shopping for. All of you that have been doing this kind of work for a long time have seen one person quit and another take his place. It does not decline. Kind of like an infestation of pests, one dies and another is born. I have seen this in the telecom industry where I come from. Maybe that person you help will become your best resource. Say you have so many jobs you can't keep up. What are you going to do? Buy more equipment and hire more employees? Then it only lasts for 3 months. Why not sub out to your trainee because you are sure they are doing thing like you taught them? Maybe not exactly but the same general idea, and most importand the same end result. You both make a little off the job and you have a customer for life if you can keep them. Now you will need a non compete between you as the customer should remain with the original company. Great thread. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
plainpainter 217 Report post Posted May 18, 2009 Don't forget guys - unlike a lot of you even - I worked for years for other crews and bosess - I had been asking questions about pricing perhaps for about 5 years under several bosses before I quoted my first job. I had done perhaps over 50 decks for other painters over the years. And I had done tons of internet research about chems and machines on regular websites before I even joined a forum. Sure I did my college stint and worked several 'desk' jobs in the interim. The main reason I found these boards was due to frustration over how business changed so much - frustration that deck stains never seemed to last as long as they use to back in the 90's. I had no idea about the changing VOC laws that were happening. In a lot of ways I was a predecessor to alot of you guys - I was doing decks before Jim Foley - just as a painter and not a deck specialist. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
PressurePros 249 Report post Posted May 18, 2009 You get back what you give.. good or bad. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Beth n Rod 1,279 Report post Posted May 18, 2009 You get back what you give.. good or bad. +1! Beth Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Scott Stone 604 Report post Posted May 19, 2009 Ron and I have bumped heads occasionally, and often it will go something like this. "Ron (or Scott), I got one of your accounts today." "Damn, (Ron) Dang (If it is me) which one?" "Wallys wonder world restaurant" "they pay good" or "they pay bad, you will want to watch them." "anything else I should know?" "Yeah, watch out for this, or that, and you can upsell x pretty easily." "Thanks, and sorry about that" The secret is, that we do not intentionally target each others accounts, or even each others markets. We just, occasionally, run across an account that the other has. In all honesty, I run across his more than he does mine, because he has more rigs on the road. But then, we also call each other with questions, of how do you do this, or that. It all works out. I also give his guys my business card, because he gives them $50 every time they bring him a competitors card. :D Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Lightning Gene 66 Report post Posted May 19, 2009 Is that the card that says $99.00 mall cleanings? ...... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Scott Stone 604 Report post Posted May 20, 2009 Gene, you have seen my truck, and one of my trailers. Do they look like the equipment of someone that does $99 mall cleanings? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
